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Dev
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
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 Posted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 6:59 am Post subject: |
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| Fishead soup wrote: |
| No mention of Toronto. If you have the cash and a good job it's a pretty cool place to live. |
I mentioned it on page 2 of this thread.
Besides the high cost of living, I don't know why Toronto gets so much criticism. Entertainment wise, it's by far, the best place in Canada. Anybody who is anybody makes a Toronto stop when they tour North America.
The one big problem I have with Toronto is the lack of green space. I'd love to be able to go on a nice hike sometimes. |
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Dev
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 7:26 am Post subject: |
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| banjois wrote: |
| Yeah, I think "livable" usually equals "boring." I mean, Vancouver's great and all (although getting unliveably expensive), but I'd take grotty old Montreal over it any day of the week. |
To enjoy Montreal, you should like Quebecois culture and not mind the never ending language debate.
The governments there try to eradicate the English language every chance they get.
Businesses are not permitted to use English on any of their signs.
Immigrants, who also pay taxes, are not allowed to send their children to English primary & secondary schools. And immigrants include Canadians from other provinces (because Quebec is runned like a separate country with their own tax return forms - no other province has this).
Your driver's license is only in French even though Ontario's is bilingual. I hope you don't get stopped by police in the U.S. bacause you'll probably have to translate it for them.
Even the subway company does not broadcast bilingual messages in emergencies like service interruptions. Messages are only in French.
If you're okay with all of this and willing to use your tax dollars to support these policies, then, by all means, enjoy Montreal. |
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redaxe
Joined: 01 Dec 2008
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| Posted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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| SeoulMan99 wrote: |
| redaxe wrote: |
| SeoulMan99 wrote: |
| redaxe wrote: |
Interesting debate between Chicago and New York.
I lived in Chicago for a year and loved almost everything about it except the winter weather and the flat topography.
I personally have a strong dislike for New York culture, I lived there for about a month and hated it.
I'm from Seattle which is awesome except for too-expensive real estate and too much cloudy weather, but I'll take mild and cloudy/rainy temperate weather most of the year over the Midwest's extreme winter blizzards and humid summers.
Seattle has a LOT to offer culture-wise, and tons of white collar jobs, but there is stiff competition for those jobs. It's a bit less expensive and more "livable" than most Californian cities, with less suburban sprawl. Overall I can't really think of a place in the US I'd rather live. |
Seattle is a nice city, which unfortunately doesn't get enough praise nationally or internationally. The Midwest certainly does have variable weather which seems to shift on a dime. I think the harhness of Chicago winters isn't as bad as people might think. There is a solid three months which I think are rather bad, another two which aren't so-so, and then the other seven months are rather tolerable and nice, imo. However, if you dislike the heat then I can understand that. Humidity doesn't bother me though. To get beyond the flatness I suppose you'd have to head up to Wisconsin, which is a beautiful state, but obviously it's not going to have mountains such as you have in Washington.
I don't know why Seattle doesn't get more attention. Maybe it's all those damn vampires up there?  |
Well, Seattle is pretty small in terms of population. It's only the 25th largest city in the US, about the same size as Denver. It is very diverse and has a lot of cultural attractions and activities for a city of its size, so in that regard I feel it is a little underrated. It also has a great natural environment and almost every conceivable outdoor activity is possible within a two-hour drive or less.
But Seattle is very strongly represented in the business world because of Microsoft, Boeing, Starbucks, Amazon, Adobe, Expeditors, etc. And it's definitely the economic center of the US Northwest, with Portland a very distant 2nd. So although Seattle tends to fall between the cracks when people discuss the major cities of the U.S., it is completely dominant on a regional level.
P.S.: Chicago is a great city but I wouldn't use the "L" or any other part of CTA as an example to boast about. I think Chicago should be embarrassed of its train system. It is old and falling apart (not to mention dangerous enough to scare most white people away) because CTA is out of money, and last I heard they had to jack the ticket prices up to $4 a pop. Chicago is definitely the type of city where you need a car. |
Though Boeing is based in Chicago now, I know it is still a Seattle company and I believe they still run logistics from there? The L definitely needs to be updated, but I think it is vast enough that you don't need a car. I used it recently and it was $2.50, which is sitll ridiculous. I was just saying I don't think Boston's metro is better, nor SF's. In fact, I find most American metro systems rather pathetic. Chicago's metra system, which is the suburban-city-suburban train system is rather good though.
* I see white people on the L all the time. I don't think it's that dangerous. It definitely depends which line you're on and where you are though. |
Boeing just moved their corporate HQ to Chicago, the plant where they engineer and build their airplanes is still in Everett, WA.
Metra is a good system but it's designed for commuters who live in the suburbs and work in the city, and the train schedule is set accordingly. It's awful for people who want to go downtown on the evenings or weekends, the trains only run like once per hour and not very late. |
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yingwenlaoshi
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: ... location, location!
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| Posted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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Not posted by me. I lived and worked in Quebec for three years. I'm bilingual and lived in Montreal.
Last edited by yingwenlaoshi on Tue Feb 23, 2010 8:19 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Mr. Pink
Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Location: China
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| Posted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 9:46 pm Post subject: |
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| yingwenlaoshi wrote: |
| Dev wrote: |
| banjois wrote: |
| Yeah, I think "livable" usually equals "boring." I mean, Vancouver's great and all (although getting unliveably expensive), but I'd take grotty old Montreal over it any day of the week. |
To enjoy Montreal, you should like Quebecois culture and not mind the never ending language debate.
The governments there try to eradicate the English language every chance they get.
Businesses are not permitted to use English on any of their signs.
Immigrants, who also pay taxes, are not allowed to send their children to English primary & secondary schools. And immigrants include Canadians from other provinces (because Quebec is runned like a separate country with their own tax return forms - no other province has this).
Your driver's license is only in French even though Ontario's is bilingual. I hope you don't get stopped by police in the U.S. bacause you'll probably have to translate it for them.
Even the subway company does not broadcast bilingual messages in emergencies like service interruptions. Messages are only in French.
If you're okay with all of this and willing to use your tax dollars to support these policies, then, by all means, enjoy Montreal. |
Why is that?
Surely English being the majority or official language would be more practical on so many levels, (tourism, business etc...) |
To delve into that answer requires some knowledge of Canadian history.
To put it simply though: The French culture and language was almost overwhelmed by American and English-speaking Canada's interests. They owned most of the companies and had English only policies. There was a huge divide between the rich and poor in Quebec, with the rich being English speakers and poor being the Francophones.
Thus in the 1960s they had a "Quiet Revolution" whereby the government started to put measures into place to protect Quebec from being owned by the Anglophone. These measures actually hurt Quebec a lot. Before this, Montreal was a bigger city than Toronto. It had a larger population and more HQ were located there. After language laws were introduced, the Anglophones saw the writing on the wall. They left Montreal for Toronto. A lot of the money left with them.
Why does Quebec get to do their own pension plan or immigration or taxes? I guess it comes down to the federal government always kissing Quebec's arse for votes and allowing it to get special status. (OF course it is more intricate than this, but that again is another history lesson.)
Quebec still foolishly believes that they do not need English and if people want to do business with them, they should learn French. This could be why Quebec's hand always gets a huge portion of federal taxes (more than Ontario gets) and thus they can buy votes by giving more socialist programs than the rest of Canada gets.
Don't worry. The gravy train will end one day, and when Quebec realizes they need foreign investment, they will wake up to speaking English.
IMO Montreal should separate from Quebec, as they have the only sane people in the province. I lived in northern Quebec and I can tell you, they are about as backwards and nationalistic (for Quebec) as you guys complain Koreans are about their country. |
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chris_J2
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Location: From Brisbane, Au.
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| Posted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:00 pm Post subject: Quebec |
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| IMO Montreal should separate from Quebec |
For a moment, I thought you were going to say Quebec should separate from Canada, Mr Pink.
Imho, Quebec needs Canada, more than Canada needs Quebec. |
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The Happy Warrior
Joined: 10 Feb 2010
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| Posted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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I nominate my current residence of Beijing.
It has pollution.
It has nongmin.
It has congested traffic and terrible drivers.
It has rude and surly public behavior.
It has the Happy Warrior!
北京欢迎你！ |
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Cerberus
Joined: 29 Oct 2009
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| Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 6:35 am Post subject: |
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for all of Montreal's faults listed above
(btw. I've never been there)
but almost every American male I know that has been there loves the place.
Thinks the city is gorgeous, loves the different look/ culture and what I always always hear is how the women there are way hotter and more approachable. |
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banjois
Joined: 14 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 7:46 am Post subject: |
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| OHMYGODTHEWOMENINMONTREAL |
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Cerberus
Joined: 29 Oct 2009
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| Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 9:41 am Post subject: |
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| banjois wrote: |
| OHMYGODTHEWOMENINMONTREAL |
perfect example.
I've heard this from every American male that's been there.
why are the Quebecois females so much hotter (and leaner) than their English speaking Canadian cousins?
is it the same thing that makes 99% of French females hotter than say their English counterpart? |
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D.D.
Joined: 29 May 2008
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| Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 10:08 am Post subject: |
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| I dont think france has such nice women but quebec is amazing. |
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banjois
Joined: 14 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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I lived in Montreal for five years, and loved it. I'd have to disagree a bit with the bashing of the language laws. I mean yeah, it sucked finding a job as an (at the time) monolingual Anglo, and the province definitely lost a lot of it's big old money in the 70s. But they did preserve their culture and have a thriving French media industry in the middle of what's become a big monocultural cesspool.
I'm actually in Vancouver now, waiting for my visa to fly to Korea, for the first time in years. I LOVE visiting this city for a week or so, but round about day eight I start getting sullen. It's a great place to live if you've got money, I suppose, although it's pretty soulless when it comes down to brass tacks. I'm hoping the Olympics has an impact on the street life here for the future. Up to now, if you got a big group of Vancouverites in the same area they'd either ignore each other or riot. But people are actually out and about and interacting. It's nice.
But I think a lot of the "liveable" cities on the list make one wonder about the definition of "liveable." It would seem to me that a lot of them are liveable if you've got lotsa cash. I know the last name I lived in Vancouver I was making decent if not excellent money and it was still a struggle to make ends meet living in a relatively low-rent apartment and never having any fun. I'll still take the occasional slum or disturbance or less than pretty thing if it makes a city more interesting in the end. |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Cerberus wrote: |
for all of Montreal's faults listed above
(btw. I've never been there)
but almost every American male I know that has been there loves the place.
Thinks the city is gorgeous, loves the different look/ culture and what I always always hear is how the women there are way hotter and more approachable. |
Yes, it is definitely on my top 5 list of North American cities.
You know what Canadian city is underrated? And this is from someone who just spent 48 hours there in the midst of summer (so keep that in mind).... Ottawa. I was pleasantly surprised by it when visiting last summer. |
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D.D.
Joined: 29 May 2008
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| Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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| bucheon bum wrote: |
| Cerberus wrote: |
for all of Montreal's faults listed above
(btw. I've never been there)
but almost every American male I know that has been there loves the place.
Thinks the city is gorgeous, loves the different look/ culture and what I always always hear is how the women there are way hotter and more approachable. |
Yes, it is definitely on my top 5 list of North American cities.
You know what Canadian city is underrated? And this is from someone who just spent 48 hours there in the midst of summer (so keep that in mind).... Ottawa. I was pleasantly surprised by it when visiting last summer. |
Ya summer being the main point there. I have only seen it in winter and it was quite scary. |
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yingwenlaoshi
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: ... location, location!
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| Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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Not posted by me.
Last edited by yingwenlaoshi on Tue Feb 23, 2010 8:11 am; edited 1 time in total |
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