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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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 Posted: Sat Dec 25, 2010 11:11 pm Post subject: |
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| In Development? I have read the US government believe they already have built nuclear bombs. but you don't know for sure and either do I. so let's leave it as that. |
In terms of their delivery systems.
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YES, I know this. my ex student worked for Koreans biggest nuclear plant and we spent hours and hours talking about enrichmented uranium, plutonium , the black market buying, which Korea buys from, and the ways Korea brings it in undetected and where they buy if from, he also built the Nuclear plant in North Korea and spent 9 months up there building it.
trust me, I know A LOT about the trafficking of illegal uranium, nuclear bombs, the logistics of building a bomb etc..
the North have been nuclear since the 90's! stop watching FOX NEWS! |
BULL.
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I have read he has thousands of missles pointing at seoul which can bring a rain of death!
you want to disagree, perhaps you need to tell Obama that The North is not a threat and they have bows and arrows and we should just pack up and leave.. |
Are they a threat? Sure. Saddam Hussein also had thousands of tanks and artillery and rockets. Not that it did him a bunch of good.
The effectiveness of such systems has been demonstrated time and time again as being a threat, yes, but not a devastating one.
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and you come across as an Arrogant conceited patriot who doesn't want to accept other countries can damage your own.
wake up.. USA can not take on the world! |
I know that the U.S. has limitations. It cannot take on the world. It could however, make mincemeat of North Korea if ti wanted to.
The U.S. is fighting with both legs tied and one arm behind its back at the present moment. If you think otherwise you are a fool.
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IRAN? maybe not over North Korea. but they might join in on an attack.
Ahmadinejad is a highly intelligent person and I wouldn't count him out.
unlikely yes. but not impossible, |
If Ahmadinejad is as intelligent as you say he is, which I believe as well, then he would not attack the U.S.
Not impossible, but about as likely as the X-Men joining in on the attack.
How would Iran get soldiers to North Korea? Do you think Iran would start a Mideast Meltdown over North Korea?
Come on dude, again fantasy novel type stuff.
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they could if they wanted to spend the money. they choose not too.
they can afford too. they just don't see the reason too waste money like that. and frankly the burden is taking it's toll on the America tax payers. |
USSR did try to do it. It went politically and economically bankrupt trying to do it. What do you think that whole Cold War and collapse of Communism thing was about?
China knows better than to do that and they also know it would still take them about 30 years to develop such a capability.
Remember- when it comes to Americans policing the globe it is the job that we are the best in the world at and we are the only business in town that can do it.
I"M STILL WAITING FOR YOUR DETAILED EXPLANATION FOR THE REQUIREMENTS FOR DEPLOYING 500,000 COMBAT TROOPS OVERSEAS AND WHAT IT WOULD TAKE FOR CHINA AND RUSSIA TO DO THAT.
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give Russia or China a 20 year deadline they will have the troops overseas and stationed. When push comes to shove both of these countries could do it.. logistically VERY POSSIBLE! again they choose not too. not because they cant.
you sound like the US military is the only nation in the world who are capable of doing this. I disagree. |
EXPLAIN HOW IT IS POSSIBLE. Don't just say "they can do it." Tell me what goes into deploying 500,000 soldiers overseas. I mean things like food, water purification, ammunition, maintenance equipment, living quarters, etc. etc. I'm just scratching the surface there. You think this stuff can "just happen". No it can't "just happen".
Guess what, when you look at what is actually required, instead of just saying "Oh they can do it, believe me." Then you realize that, no, no they can't.
What was China's last major overseas deployment? 500 Riot Police to Haiti.
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I never said that. I said 1 nuke on LA , NYC, Chicago, Washington and Where ever else.. its goodnight USA! sure the country will still be standing but without NYC, LA and a couple of major cities, plus the loss of 50 million people, the country will take centuries to recover because the world would keep turning the next day, and businesses will look to other markets and the world will go on without USA.
USA will be left to clean up its mess.
picture NYC after a nuke 1000X more powerful than the bomb in Nagasaki hits it? the end! |
Yes because a war torn and defeated nation has always taken centuries to recover, ahem, GERMANY AND JAPAN.
Do you really believe what you write? How did you arrive at these conclusions?
Do you really believe that if NY was nuked it would be sayonara USA and the rest of the world would just keep on humming?
Seriously, put down the comic books.
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sure.. but a surprise attack would cause devastation. that's the biggest concern I think. if the North attacked first, the damage would be catastrophic. and not if the North bombed NYC but any terrorist.
or in the future an enemy of the USA. first in would wreck havoc. |
But it can't stage a surprise attack.
In order to stage an attack it would make movements that would be noticed by aerial reconnaissance and satellite imagery. Furthermore if they staged a surprise attack that would result the entire world being against them diplomatically, including China. Especially if any Chinese business assets were struck during the attack.
This is to say nothing about the wisdom about launching a surprise attack and expending all your ordinance to blow up the 63 Building, Choi's Tacos, and an SK Cell Phone store and kill 10,000 people.
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| they have a 1 million man army who are brainwashed! |
Really? The same 1,000,000 man army that lets people smuggle in cheap Chinese goods and SK DVDs? The same army that occasionally has fits of "restlessness" when rations are short. The same army led by a bunch of generals who seem to be scheming and positioning themselves to run the place when KJI is dead?
We heard the same kind of bluster from Saddam Hussein in 1991. Remember "The Mother of All Battles"? His "elite" Republican Guard? And unlike KJIs troops who have zero combat experience, Saddam actually had plenty of veterans from the Iran-Iraq war.
1,000,000 means nothing if you have sporadic training, low rations, ancient equipment, and zero combat experience. I don't care how brainwashed you are. A banzai charge at a machine gun nest is still a banzai charge at a machine gun nest.
What's next are you telling me that they'll start ghost dancing?
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| what about Biological warfare??? isn't this a threat we need to worry about too? |
Yeah, and so do the Norks if they use it. First, their own weapons could end up infecting their soldiers, second we could retaliate with nuclear or chemical weapons.
And whose medical care do you think is better? Which military has ample experience dealing with battlefield trauma injuries? Which military do you think would be able to issue vaccines?
Right, KJI has his secret biolabs like some James Bond villain. Right next to his clone army and his robo-troopers.
Do you really believe that KJI is this capable? I don't think you do. If you did, you wouldn't be here in SK. Really, whose chair would you rather sit in- SK/USA's or NK's? |
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Koreadays
Joined: 20 May 2008
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| Posted: Sun Dec 26, 2010 3:20 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
In terms of their delivery systems.
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yes, I agree, but like I said, what if they already have the nuke in South Korea sitting in some barn somewhere which they brought through with one of their thousand tunnels which were built. Im sure they still have one or two tunnels they use. or did use.. then all they need is a small plane. how hard could that be to obtain? KABOOM!
goodbye seoul.
NO, Seriously. sorry you choose to not believe it. I was more shocked than you are when he told me..
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| Are they a threat? Sure. Saddam Hussein also had thousands of tanks and artillery and rockets. Not that it did him a bunch of good. |
I'm still wondering why Saddam didn't attack the USA back..
that was not a war.. it was America coming to Bagdad and having a few bandits firing AK 47's..
Vietnam now that was a war..
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| The effectiveness of such systems has been demonstrated time and time again as being a threat, yes, but not a devastating one. |
still enough to send Seoul into the stone age!
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| I know that the U.S. has limitations. It cannot take on the world. It could however, make mincemeat of North Korea if ti wanted to. |
I agree.
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| The U.S. is fighting with both legs tied and one arm behind its back at the present moment. If you think otherwise you are a fool. |
I don't deny this. but is America really fighting any wars now?? come on!
they are fighting some rebels in the mountains. it's like a man bringing a gun to a knife fight. When America enters a real war again the body bags will be in the millions.
the greatest military/intelligence in the world and still can't win in Afganistan.. and where is osama bin ladin? how has it been now? 10 years? perhaps it's time to untie that arm from behind the back and wrap things up...
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| If Ahmadinejad is as intelligent as you say he is, which I believe as well, then he would not attack the U.S. |
of course he wouldn't. I'm just saying he is an intelligent person and he is capable of leading a country into war if he has too.
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| How would Iran get soldiers to North Korea? Do you think Iran would start a Mideast Meltdown over North Korea? |
He wouldn't. He would attack the USA In the middle east.
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| Come on dude, again fantasy novel type stuff. |
maybe.. but its possible.
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| USSR did try to do it. It went politically and economically bankrupt trying to do it. What do you think that whole Cold War and collapse of Communism thing was about? |
that was then. this is now. Russia is emerging and a rich nation now. 50 years from now who knows how much bank roll Russia will have..
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| China knows better than to do that and they also know it would still take them about 30 years to develop such a capability. |
China is patient. 100 years from now we might all be speaking Chinese.
America CAN'T run the world for ever. It's impossible. there will be a shift every great nation has it's time. then another nation takes over.
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| Remember- when it comes to Americans policing the globe it is the job that we are the best in the world at and we are the only business in town that can do it. |
yeah, NOW.. wasn't so 200 years ago, 500 years ago, 1000 years ago, 2000 years ago. Most countries have done more than USA will ever do.
Remember the British Empire? the French? the ROMAN? Spaniards?
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EXPLAIN HOW IT IS POSSIBLE. Don't just say "they can do it." Tell me what goes into deploying 500,000 soldiers overseas. I mean things like food, water purification, ammunition, maintenance equipment, living quarters, etc. etc. I'm just scratching the surface there. You think this stuff can "just happen". No it can't "just happen".
Guess what, when you look at what is actually required, instead of just saying "Oh they can do it, believe me." Then you realize that, no, no they can't.
What was China's last major overseas deployment? 500 Riot Police to Haiti. |
These countries know how the logistics work.
if you think China, Russia, ENgland, France, Japan don't know how to deploy 500.000 troops around the world and orchestrate a military operation you are deluding yourself.
USA USA USA I know, I know.. but actually other countries have been leading and patrolling military operations around the world and documenting how to do it for centuries! the logistics is not important.
The Chinese , British, French know what it takes.
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| Yes because a war torn and defeated nation has always taken centuries to recover, ahem, GERMANY AND JAPAN. |
different world now. the world is moving 10times faster than it did before.
America could easily be left behind. no money to buy oil and the Dollar will be worthless..
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Do you really believe what you write? How did you arrive at these conclusions?
Do you really believe that if NY was nuked it would be sayonara USA and the rest of the world would just keep on humming?
Seriously, put down the comic books. |
If NYC and LA were nuked yes the dollar would be worthless...
and how would the USA pay its military and contractors? just pull dollars out of it's ass? ohhh and no wallstreet... come on...
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But it can't stage a surprise attack.
In order to stage an attack it would make movements that would be noticed by aerial reconnaissance and satellite imagery. Furthermore if they staged a surprise attack that would result the entire world being against them diplomatically, including China. Especially if any Chinese business assets were struck during the attack. |
you are talking about the military mobilizing, I'm talking about MR YOON and MR PARK flying their little plane over seoul which took off from some small airport and dropping a surprise on seoul.
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| Really? The same 1,000,000 man army that lets people smuggle in cheap Chinese goods and SK DVDs? The same army that occasionally has fits of "restlessness" when rations are short. The same army led by a bunch of generals who seem to be scheming and positioning themselves to run the place when KJI is dead? |
what ever.. they would do damage if they wanted to attack.
this is not Iraq where the Iraqi Army didn't fight back. don't confuse KJI with Saddam.
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| Remember "The Mother of All Battles"? His "elite" Republican Guard? And unlike KJIs troops who have zero combat experience, Saddam actually had plenty of veterans from the Iran-Iraq war. |
and what combat experience has the Americans had in the past 10 years?shooting innocent people in Iraq? the North Soldiers are not sitting around in Bars in Itaewon getting their drink on. they are probably living a serious hard combat training life. 24/7!
no xbox and stuff in their barracks.
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| 1,000,000 means nothing if you have sporadic training, low rations, ancient equipment, and zero combat experience. I don't care how brainwashed you are. A banzai charge at a machine gun nest is still a banzai charge at a machine gun nest. |
plenty of food here once they all come into South Korea.
you seem to think these guys will be headless chickens just running around with no clue?? hahahahahahah...
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Yeah, and so do the Norks if they use it. First, their own weapons could end up infecting their soldiers, second we could retaliate with nuclear or chemical weapons. |
NO because they would have the vaccine. we wouldn't.
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| Do you really believe that KJI is this capable? I don't think you do. If you did, you wouldn't be here in SK. Really, whose chair would you rather sit in- SK/USA's or NK's? |
don't confuse my words. I not support the NORTH! I'm just saying if they waged war. we would be killed.. of course USA would eventually win the war and Korea would be one country. but you and I would probably be dead. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Sun Dec 26, 2010 4:34 am Post subject: |
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yes, I agree, but like I said, what if they already have the nuke in South Korea sitting in some barn somewhere which they brought through with one of their thousand tunnels which were built. Im sure they still have one or two tunnels they use. or did use.. then all they need is a small plane. how hard could that be to obtain? KABOOM!
goodbye seoul. |
But everyone would know where the nuke came from and North Korea would face U.S. nuclear retaliation as well as the complete loss of any support from the Chinese.
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| NO, Seriously. sorry you choose to not believe it. I was more shocked than you are when he told me.. |
Maybe the guy was pulling your leg. People who tend to mouth off about Nuclear trading tend not to ever get into such positions.
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| I'm still wondering why Saddam didn't attack the USA back.. |
Maybe because he lacked the capability?
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| still enough to send Seoul into the stone age! |
Nope, no it isn't. Seoul can be rebuilt, and again, the tactical wisdom of such an act is questionable at best.
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I don't deny this. but is America really fighting any wars now?? come on!
they are fighting some rebels in the mountains. it's like a man bringing a gun to a knife fight. When America enters a real war again the body bags will be in the millions.
the greatest military/intelligence in the world and still can't win in Afganistan.. and where is osama bin ladin? how has it been now? 10 years? perhaps it's time to untie that arm from behind the back and wrap things up... |
It's the delicate balance of guns and butter.
Now if China ever did decide to start a massive conventional war with the U.S. over North Korea (highly unlikely), then yes, the U.S. would untie its other arm.
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| He wouldn't. He would attack the USA In the middle east. |
Which would draw in the rest of the region. Not exactly something that he would want to do over North Korea.
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if you think China, Russia, ENgland, France, Japan don't know how to deploy 500.000 troops around the world and orchestrate a military operation you are deluding yourself.
USA USA USA I know, I know.. but actually other countries have been leading and patrolling military operations around the world and documenting how to do it for centuries! the logistics is not important.
The Chinese , British, French know what it takes. |
They know how to in theory, but they lack the capability either economically, politically, or militarily.
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| you are talking about the military mobilizing, I'm talking about MR YOON and MR PARK flying their little plane over seoul which took off from some small airport and dropping a surprise on seoul. |
Assuming said plane doesn't get shot down....
And again, they use the nuke, then what? Massive retaliation on NK and the Chinese moving into North Korea and toppling the government in de facto cooperation with the U.S., S.K., Japan, and NATO.
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what ever.. they would do damage if they wanted to attack.
this is not Iraq where the Iraqi Army didn't fight back. don't confuse KJI with Saddam. |
Right, because KJI's fanatical legions are substantially different than Saddam's fanatical legions.
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| and what combat experience has the Americans had in the past 10 years?shooting innocent people in Iraq? the North Soldiers are not sitting around in Bars in Itaewon getting their drink on. they are probably living a serious hard combat training life. 24/7! |
Right, the US has been diddling around on their XBoxes while the Norks have plenty of spare ammunition and fuel to conduct round the clock exercises. 
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plenty of food here once they all come into South Korea.
you seem to think these guys will be headless chickens just running around with no clue?? hahahahahahah... |
Uhm, they won't exactly have much time to loot the Family Mart while dealing with SK and US to the South and China to the North.
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| NO because they would have the vaccine. we wouldn't. |
Right because the Norks have come up with magic diseases that only they know about but the U.S. doesn't. And the NK biowarfare research capability is so much more advanced than the U.S.'
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| of course he wouldn't. I'm just saying he is an intelligent person and he is capable of leading a country into war if he has too. |
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| maybe.. but its possible. |
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| that was then. this is now. Russia is emerging and a rich nation now. 50 years from now who knows how much bank roll Russia will have.. |
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China is patient. 100 years from now we might all be speaking Chinese.
America CAN'T run the world for ever. It's impossible. there will be a shift every great nation has it's time. then another nation takes over. |
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yeah, NOW.. wasn't so 200 years ago, 500 years ago, 1000 years ago, 2000 years ago. Most countries have done more than USA will ever do.
Remember the British Empire? the French? the ROMAN? Spaniards? |
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different world now. the world is moving 10times faster than it did before.
America could easily be left behind. no money to buy oil and the Dollar will be worthless.. |
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If NYC and LA were nuked yes the dollar would be worthless...
and how would the USA pay its military and contractors? just pull dollars out of it's ass? ohhh and no wallstreet... come on... |
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| NO because they would have the vaccine. we wouldn't. |
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| you are talking about the military mobilizing, I'm talking about MR YOON and MR PARK flying their little plane over seoul which took off from some small airport and dropping a surprise on seoul. |
So basically your premise is that the most outrageous and extreme stuff happens in this conflict. That KJI has super capabilities that he's hidden, that the entire global economy ceases to be integrated, that NATO collapses, that everyone turns on the U.S. and of course this will all happen 50-100 years from now.
Which is more likely involving North Korea- Your doomsday scenario or Gulf War I, the sequel?
It's great on drama. It's bad on realism.
Your scenarios are based on fantasy and conjecture, not based on data concerning the amount and types of military equipment, reports on the training and quality of the NK armed forces, any consideration of international law or diplomacy, and a complete disregard for economics beyond "The Dollar is Doomed and the Sky is Falling" silliness.
I have just as likely a scenario- The CIA gets wind of KJI's surprise attack and sends in Commandos to assassinate him (in conjunction with some NK general who we have co-opted and promised to make 'Military Governor'), Meanwhile thanks to our recon capability we have his artillery emplacements targeted and destroy 90% of them in the first couple of hours. Meanwhile, we send our armed forces screaming across the DMZ and in a stunning display of strategic and tactical acumen surround and compel the surrender of the demoralized and co-opted NK front line forces. With the head gone and command and control decimated KJI has no way of even ordering some sort of biological/chemical/nuclear attack.
Now that scenario is unlikely as well, but its a heckuva lot more likely (2% vs. .0002%) as your Iran and Pakistan declare war on the US, China starts WWIII, and NK agents set off a nuke in LA scenario.
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| don't confuse my words. I not support the NORTH! I'm just saying if they waged war. we would be killed.. of course USA would eventually win the war and Korea would be one country. but you and I would probably be dead. |
Really? Who do you think is crapping their pants over military might? SK and the US over North Korea or North Korea over the US and SK?
KJI would trade his army and resources for South Korea's at the drop of a hat.
He also knows time is ticking. In 10 years SK and China will be so economically integrated that he would be politically unable to launch a massive attack against South Korea without China storming in. In fact they are just about at that point now. All that's left is for the last vestiges of China's old guard to be retired.
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If NYC and LA were nuked yes the dollar would be worthless...
and how would the USA pay its military and contractors? just pull dollars out of it's ass? ohhh and no wallstreet... come on... |
There is a lot more to the USA than LA and Wall Street. Look at how big (economically) each state of the Union is compared to nation's across the world.
New York, Texas, and California could be absolutely obliterated and the US economy would still be larger than Germany, France, and the UK put together.
Get a clue dude and put down the political thriller novels.
You still haven't even started to answer the question about logistical necessities. |
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Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
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| Posted: Sun Dec 26, 2010 5:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
| Uhm, they won't exactly have much time to loot the Family Mart |
This thread is fun to watch 
3 points, I would add, to take into account:
Mao Tse Tung boasted China could field an army of 200 million whenever necessary. That still stands. Combine Russia and the islamic states, they could too. India.
The US has around 500.000 troops now in the middle east and Aghanistan. I don't see that they are going to leave.
North korea have been helping Iran with their nuclear stuff including missiles and launch pads.
Economically the world has entered a period of long term instability. I don't see it shifting at all.
US owes China $1.7 trillion. Currently China uses this as leverage to manipulate the US. They dump bonds whenever Washington annoys them. At what point will this, combined with america's inability to pay, hit the fan?
WW1 killed 8 million.
WWII killed 52 million.
WW3: _____ billion. |
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Koreadays
Joined: 20 May 2008
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| Posted: Sun Dec 26, 2010 8:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
But everyone would know where the nuke came from and North Korea would face U.S. nuclear retaliation as well as the complete loss of any support from the Chinese.
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yes, but that doesn't stop us from being obliviated. who cares what happens afterwards. Seoul is burnt to the ground.
if KJI wanted a suicide mission. of course it would be in its interest to just sell the country to the South or China for 50 billion dollars in cash , and ask for some land and just chill..
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| Maybe the guy was pulling your leg. People who tend to mouth off about Nuclear trading tend not to ever get into such positions. |
DUDE, he works for korea Nuclear energy department as a vice president
I use to go to the government building. I hardly doubt he is making stuff up. he didn't tell me anything classified.
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| Nope, no it isn't. Seoul can be rebuilt, and again, the tactical wisdom of such an act is questionable at best. |
questionable at best? come on! a NUKE on seoul...
rebuild? sure.. 50 years later and we will be back to where we are. maybe if we survived we can share stories in Itaewon as a couple old guys.
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| Which would draw in the rest of the region. Not exactly something that he would want to do over North Korea. |
ARABS support the whiteman? you think the CHinese love us? when it comes to choice. they will stick with the PURE Asian blood over us.
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| They know how to in theory, but they lack the capability either economically, politically, or militarily. |
Military? I disagree, economically? they could, politically? right. no need too, Anyway America plays world police but they don't really do much.
USA usually only goes into countries where they can profit.
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| Assuming said plane doesn't get shot down.... |
why would a random little plane get shot gun? no threat on board. no one has any idea that a small plane is carry a nuclear bomb, can be dropped anywhere in seoul
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And again, they use the nuke, then what? Massive retaliation on NK and the Chinese moving into North Korea and toppling the government in de facto cooperation with the U.S., S.K., Japan, and NATO. |
sure. Suicide mission isn't it. but if provoked he might be mad enough to go out in a blaze glory. being burning Seoul with him.
of course I don't believe this. but it's possible from this mad man.
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| Right, because KJI's fanatical legions are substantially different than Saddam's fanatical legions. |
the Iraqi army didn't even fight!
the Norks will fight...
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| Right, the US has been diddling around on their XBoxes while the Norks have plenty of spare ammunition and fuel to conduct round the clock exercises. |
wasting amo doesn't mean you are a better. I'm sure the norks are training in different ways.
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| Right because the Norks have come up with magic diseases that only they know about but the U.S. doesn't. And the NK biowarfare research capability is so much more advanced than the U.S.' |
YES, they have. look into it..
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| So basically your premise is that the most outrageous and extreme stuff happens in this conflict. That KJI has super capabilities that he's hidden, that the entire global economy ceases to be integrated, that NATO collapses, that everyone turns on the U.S. and of course this will all happen 50-100 years from now. |
NO, I'm saying north Korea has a nuclear bomb and they could use it.
once its dropped there is no turning back.
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| It's great on drama. It's bad on realism. |
still the out come is the same if a nuke is dropped.
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| Your scenarios are based on fantasy and conjecture, not based on data concerning the amount and types of military equipment, reports on the training and quality of the NK armed forces, any consideration of international law or diplomacy, and a complete disregard for economics |
It doesn't take the greatest military in the world to drop a nuke and kill 20 million people. takes a small plane and a target . once the bomb is made its all down hill from there. The Norks already have built the bomb.
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I have just as likely a scenario- The CIA gets wind of KJI's surprise attack and sends in Commandos to assassinate him (in conjunction with some NK general who we have co-opted and promised to make 'Military Governor'), Meanwhile thanks to our recon capability we have his artillery emplacements targeted and destroy 90% of them in the first couple of hours. Meanwhile, we send our armed forces screaming across the DMZ and in a stunning display of strategic and tactical acumen surround and compel the surrender of the demoralized and co-opted NK front line forces. With the head gone and command and control decimated KJI has no way of even ordering some sort of biological/chemical/nuclear attack.
Now that scenario is unlikely as well, |
yes, because we would never get wind of his surprise attack, we will know what happened once the mushroom cloud is in the sky and its wiped out everything from Ilsan to Bundang!
also you are saying the USA can just go in there and kill 90% of the country and it'a all ok! all those innocent women and children just killed .
I doubt very much other countries will accept that. yes USA got away with it before in Japan, but USA can not just go around and Drop Nukes when ever it wants too and kill millions of women and children.
KJI can because he is a flaming nutter. but that doesn't mean we can just nuke his country because he nuked us.
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| Really? Who do you think is crapping their pants over military might? SK and the US over North Korea or North Korea over the US and SK? |
those nork generals are brainwashed and hardcore dudes. they are ready to die. they know they are nuclear and they know they have chance.
never underestimate the underdogs bite. sure they will loose.. but the damage they could do .. that's why we do not attack him.
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| KJI would trade his army and resources for South Korea's at the drop of a hat. |
really.... why hasn't he then?
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| He also knows time is ticking. In 10 years SK and China will be so economically integrated that he would be politically unable to launch a massive attack against South Korea without China storming in. In fact they are just about at that point now. All that's left is for the last vestiges of China's old guard to be retired. |
Korea hates China! Korean businesses are having a hard time in China
Korea is looking at bringing their manufacturing back to Korea or moving to Cambodia.
China and Korea will never he tight.
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There is a lot more to the USA than LA and Wall Street. Look at how big (economically) each state of the Union is compared to nation's across the world.
New York, Texas, and California could be absolutely obliterated and the US economy would still be larger than Germany, France, and the UK put together.
Get a clue dude and put down the political thriller novels. |
DUDE. without those major states USA can't compete globally.
sure might be ok for local agriculture to feed the people. but dude.. seriously if 3 nukes wiped out 3 major cities. USA would experience a recession 1000X worse than the one in 1929.
stop deluding yourself.
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| You still haven't even started to answer the question about logistical necessities |
I am not a military strategist . Are you?
but I am sure the Russians or the Chinese could be a perfectly fine job if they wanted too. if you want to think Russia is a joke. you believe that.
take a look at the Russian military. they are just as good as the USA'S
Sun Tzu said
the importance of positioning in strategy and that position is affected both by objective conditions in the physical environment and the subjective opinions of competitive actors in that environment. He thought that strategy was not planning in the sense of working through an established list, but rather that it requires quick and appropriate responses to changing conditions. Planning works in a controlled environment, but in a changing environment, competing plans collide, creating unexpected situations.
The USA should have read that before going into Vietnam! |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Sun Dec 26, 2010 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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| yes, but that doesn't stop us from being obliviated. who cares what happens afterwards. Seoul is burnt to the ground. |
Actually it does- Mutually Assured Destruction.
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questionable at best? come on! a NUKE on seoul...
rebuild? sure.. 50 years later and we will be back to where we are. maybe if we survived we can share stories in Itaewon as a couple old guys. |
Are Hiroshima and Nagasaki ghost towns? No, they've been rebuilt. Life goes on.
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| ARABS support the whiteman? you think the CHinese love us? when it comes to choice. they will stick with the PURE Asian blood over us. |
Yeah they sure did in Gulf War I. The Chinese backed us in WWII. The Koreans sent 350,000 troops to fight alongside is in Vietnam.
Dollars trump race.
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| Military? I disagree, economically? they could |
Again, please project the logistical requirements for deploying 500,000 troops overseas in line with the capabilities of the Chinese and Russian militaries.
I have asked this question now 4 times, in bold. You have repeatedly failed to answer it.
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| why would a random little plane get shot gun? no threat on board. no one has any idea that a small plane is carry a nuclear bomb, can be dropped anywhere in seoul |
(War is going on)
"Sir we have a plane flying in from the North. Looks like a Learjet."
"Let it on through. It's probably nothing."
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| of course I don't believe this. but it's possible from this mad man. |
Again, everything you post here is "Probably not going to happen, but it could."
I could get struck by a drunk driver when I walk out of school today. Putin could have a psychotic episode and order a total launch. China could suddenly decide that today is the day to take over the world. The Aliens from Independence Day could arrive tomorrow and guess what? Our drunken crop duster is in jail.
But that doesn't mean its going to happen, nor should you base decisions off such possibilities.
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the Iraqi army didn't even fight!
the Norks will fight... |
Because you say so?
Because their ideology is that much more firm?
They regularly let people bribe them to get into China. The Generals are positioning themselves to act like warlords. Not exactly the Wehrmacht we have here.
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| wasting amo doesn't mean you are a better. I'm sure the norks are training in different ways. |
You need practice shooting in order to be a good shot. You need practice flying and driving in order to be a good driver or pilot. You need practice shipping things and encountering hitches in order to be a good logistics crew. You need to have the authorization and resources to repair stuff in order to be good mechanics. You need combat experience in order to be good soldiers.
Sure they might be okay at training without bullets. The SKs and US Troops are better.
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| YES, they have. look into it.. |
Source?
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| still the out come is the same if a nuke is dropped. |
Okay so the Norks smuggle in a 10 KT Atom bomb and detonate it in Gangnam.
That's not the end of the war. That doesn't win anything. The SK military is still intact. Much of the SK economy is untouched. Bad? Yes. Rebuildable within 10-15 years? Absolutely.
Of course that plane that you keep on talking about could get shot down. Or maybe the device fails to explode. Or maybe it only partially explodes and is the equivalent of a "dirty bomb".
NK's tests have not been very convincing.
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| It doesn't take the greatest military in the world to drop a nuke and kill 20 million people. takes a small plane and a target . once the bomb is made its all down hill from there. The Norks already have built the bomb. |
Their bomb lacks the yield to kill 20 million people.
Now I know in your fantasy land they already have Thermonuclear explosives that somehow can be mounted into/onto a learjet. But in the reality based community, that's not the case.
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also you are saying the USA can just go in there and kill 90% of the country and it'a all ok! all those innocent women and children just killed .
I doubt very much other countries will accept that. yes USA got away with it before in Japan, but USA can not just go around and Drop Nukes when ever it wants too and kill millions of women and children.
KJI can because he is a flaming nutter. but that doesn't mean we can just nuke his country because he nuked us. |
Absolutely he can.
Do you seriously believe what you are writing? The sad thing is I have talked to people like you before and there are people out there that genuinely think like you and believe what they write.
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| really.... why hasn't he then? |
Because he can't. Duh.
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DUDE. without those major states USA can't compete globally.
sure might be ok for local agriculture to feed the people. but dude.. seriously if 3 nukes wiped out 3 major cities. USA would experience a recession 1000X worse than the one in 1929.
stop deluding yourself. |
Right.....Again look at the economic data. Those three states could disappear and the U.S. would still be the largest economy in the world and the equivalent of numbers 3,4, and 5 put together.
No, you are the one deluding yourself.
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I am not a military strategist . Are you?
but I am sure the Russians or the Chinese could be a perfectly fine job if they wanted too. if you want to think Russia is a joke. you believe that.
take a look at the Russian military. they are just as good as the USA'S |
No, its not as good as the USA's. Take another look. They lack the ability to deploy large numbers of troops overseas.
I don't think they are a joke, but they do not have the ability to project heavy ground forces 8,000 miles away.
I'm not a great military strategist, just an armchair, but I know enough to know that before I declare that Russia has the ability to deploy 500,000 troops overseas that I need more than just "I'm sure they can."
You're great at cooking up entertaining doomsday scenarios. But again, tell me what it takes to deploy 500,000 troops overseas and you'll realize how staggering the requirements are and how ill-equipped the Chinese and Russians are to do that.
Just saying "I'm sure they could" is not an answer. You know that deep down. You also know deep down that you can't answer that question. Maybe you should go out and read some more instead of spouting off plots for political thriller novels.
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| the importance of positioning in strategy and that position is affected both by objective conditions in the physical environment and the subjective opinions of competitive actors in that environment. He thought that strategy was not planning in the sense of working through an established list, but rather that it requires quick and appropriate responses to changing conditions. Planning works in a controlled environment, but in a changing environment, competing plans collide, creating unexpected situations. |
Somehow I don't think Sun Tzu would have said "Well we'll just deal with supplies when that problem confronts itself"
The logistical requirements are some of the most important things a commander must deal with. Your guns are useless if you can't get your soldiers ammunition.
You're forgetting of course, that a big part is the objective conditions. The objective conditions for North Korea's environment are not just terrain, but the political environment, the economic environment, and so on.
Yes, I understand Aufragstaktik. You still need coolant for your Panzer IV's engine or else its just a big stationary gun.
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Korea hates China! Korean businesses are having a hard time in China
Korea is looking at bringing their manufacturing back to Korea or moving to Cambodia.
China and Korea will never he tight. |
Oh please. I guess China hates the U.S. too?
Everyone knows that geography dictates that SK and China will inevitably be major trading partners and to a degree that dwarfs the NKs.
Go back to playing video games. |
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Koreadays
Joined: 20 May 2008
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| Posted: Sun Dec 26, 2010 10:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
Actually it does- Mutually Assured Destruction.
. |
yes I know..
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| Are Hiroshima and Nagasaki ghost towns? No, they've been rebuilt. Life goes on. |
not know. But that's because japan invented everything after ww2. so they could compete because they owned all the patents and went strong. now its different.
yes, life goes on. but it wont mean straight back to the top because there are other companies wanting to take your business when you can't meet the demands.
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| Yeah they sure did in Gulf War I. The Chinese backed us in WWII. The Koreans sent 350,000 troops to fight alongside is in Vietnam. |
YEAH!!! because the Japanese were all over their country!
where were our friends the Chinese during the Korean war? oh thats rights point their guns at us and killing us all.. so much for loyalty.
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| Dollars trump race. |
yeah, you are probably right. but not when you are selling something to someone who has everything.
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| I have asked this question now 4 times, in bold. You have repeatedly failed to answer it. |
I have answered it. I said I am not a military strategist.
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(War is going on)
"Sir we have a plane flying in from the North. Looks like a Learjet."
"Let it on through. It's probably nothing."
|
I have mentioned this twice already, I will say it again.
the North spies have managed to smuggle in the bomb into SOUTH KOREA
the bomb is sitting in some random farm house. A plane is purchased with the pilot paying all his airplane taxes and fees yearly, one day he decides to take his plane up for a spin departing from an Airfield in Seongnam..
he decides to fly over seoul and DROP A BOMB out of it!
KABOOM!!!!
"Sir we have been fired on"
NO CHIT!
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| But that doesn't mean its going to happen, nor should you base decisions off such possibilities. |
I know.. but obviously the American government try to asses every possible scenario. be stupid not too.
http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/dprk/bw/index.html
Im not saying they have some virus which is the mother of all viruses.
but Im sure they spend money and research to find one.
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| Their bomb lacks the yield to kill 20 million people. |
and you know this how?
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| Do you seriously believe what you are writing? The sad thing is I have talked to people like you before and there are people out there that genuinely think like you and believe what they write. |
look in the mirror.
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Right.....Again look at the economic data. Those three states could disappear and the U.S. would still be the largest economy in the world and the equivalent of numbers 3,4, and 5 put together.
No, you are the one deluding yourself. |
DREAM ON!
America would collapse. study some economy.
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No, its not as good as the USA's. Take another look. They lack the ability to deploy large numbers of troops overseas.
I don't think they are a joke, but they do not have the ability to project heavy ground forces 8,000 miles away. |
not right now. but they could if they need too,
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| I'm not a great military strategist, just an armchair, but I know enough to know that before I declare that Russia has the ability to deploy 500,000 troops overseas that I need more than just "I'm sure they can." |
WHY? what makes the Americans better than Russia?
I don't remember USA wasting Russia like taking candy from a baby!
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| You're great at cooking up entertaining doomsday scenarios. But again, tell me what it takes to deploy 500,000 troops overseas and you'll realize how staggering the requirements are and how ill-equipped the Chinese and Russians are to do that. |
basically if USA can do it. so can Russia or China.
Who were the first into Space?
you think the Russians are idiots?
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| Just saying "I'm sure they could" is not an answer. You know that deep down. You also know deep down that you can't answer that question. Maybe you should go out and read some more instead of spouting off plots for political thriller novels. |
try are different forum and ask someone who can give you a detailed answer. I believe than can because judging by the past performance of the Russia military, the cold war , ww2 I believe if Russia wants to spend 1 trillion dollars a year on its military then can have the men deployed.
its not rocket science. well even if it was. the Russians can do it.
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Somehow I don't think Sun Tzu would have said "Well we'll just deal with supplies when that problem confronts itself" |
Sun tzu was chinese by the way
he has said many great things
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| Everyone knows that geography dictates that SK and China will inevitably be major trading partners and to a degree that dwarfs the NKs. |
people keep saying that.
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| Go back to playing video games |
I don't play games..
you say will most likely not happen. well The South Korean president has said, "We will strike back with relentless force if provoked again"
basically meaning, the next time you shoot one of our boats, fire one of your missiles, shoot one of our people. DO ANYTHING!
which in the past have been countless. so basically one more time. and it's on like donkey kong.
so basically it's not a matter of how, why, or what with. it's a matter of when. so when the North fire at the south navy which they will..
The South Korean president has to retaliate because if he doesn't he will lose face from the people.
so he orders an attack and then it's on..
jab , jab, punch punch. and then what?
If USA think this is the perfect time to take the nation once and for all and go for it. start an invasion, the North will nuke us. because he knows once we take him alive. we will pull down the statues, burn the monuments, shoot his kids, and then hang him.
so he would rather go down with us all.
that's what I think anyway. |
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Steelrails
Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System
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| Posted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 3:13 am Post subject: |
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| I have answered it. I said I am not a military strategist. |
Well if you can't talk about what's involved in logistics and waging war in an educated, informed fashion, maybe you shouldn't make grandiose claims about KJI's death legions or the logistical capacities of Russia or China.
If you actually took time to study military strategy and read up on what is required to put 500,000 people halfway around the world, you might realize it is not just something that Russia and China can whip up. You might realize that KJI's nuclear arsenal is not what you have ti cracked up to be. Maybe you'd realize that the NK Army is markedly inferior to the SK Army.
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I have mentioned this twice already, I will say it again.
the North spies have managed to smuggle in the bomb into SOUTH KOREA
the bomb is sitting in some random farm house. A plane is purchased with the pilot paying all his airplane taxes and fees yearly, one day he decides to take his plane up for a spin departing from an Airfield in Seongnam..
he decides to fly over seoul and DROP A BOMB out of it!
KABOOM!!!!
"Sir we have been fired on"
NO CHIT! |
So you think unauthorized civilian aircraft will be able to take to S.Korean skies during wartime? You do realize that for an aircraft to carry an atomic bomb we're talking something like a Learjet (doubtful), probably a DC-9 or something like that or maybe even it would take a medium size passenger jet. A Cessena 152 wouldn't be able to carry a bomb underneath it.
| Steelrails wrote: |
Right because the Norks have come up with magic diseases that only they know about but the U.S. doesn't. And the NK biowarfare research capability is so much more advanced than the U.S.'
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| Koreadays wrote: |
| YES, they have. look into it.. |
[quote="Koreadays"NO because they would have the vaccine. we wouldn't.[/quote]
| Koreadays wrote: |
| http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/dprk/bw/index.html |
I invite any readers to look at Koreadays' link and what it says. It basically confirms what I've said- That NK has limited capability, that any weapon they used would run the risk of infecting them, and that most, if not all of their diseases we have vaccines for.
Nice link there, did you even bother to read it?
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DREAM ON!
America would collapse. study some economy. |
Not dreaming. You really think that with the other 47 states still going that America would turn into Ukraine?
Study some economics.
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| not right now. but they could if they need too, |
It would take a long time, a lot of money, and for fantasy to become reality. Stop watching Red Dawn. Go study Military Strategy and Operations.
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basically if USA can do it. so can Russia or China.
Who were the first into Space?
you think the Russians are idiots? |
No but they aren't about to spend a Gazillion Rubles on sending 500,000 soldiers to Mexico. And it would take them about 20 years to develop that capability.
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Sun tzu was chinese by the way
he has said many great things |
Yes, I've read Sun Tzu. My Thomas Cleary Translation is on my booksheltf next to Robert Citino's "Path to Blitzkrieg" and E.P. Alexander's "Military Memoirs of a Confederate"
I'd recommend reading something beyond Military Strategy for Stoners, Hipsters and Beginners aka The Art of War.
The Art of War is great, but its a general guide of basic military principles that have been in play for the history of warfare.
Try reading "The Canon" as suggested by William S. Lind. Read Admiral Owens' paper on Network Centric Warfare. Read Thomas P.M. Barnett for looking into the nature of current and future conflicts. Read Russel F. Weigley's "The American Way of War" to examine the development of the American Military. Read Douglass Southall Freeman's "Lee's Lieutenants" to study the nature of military command and decision making.
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| people keep saying that. |
So which is more likely in 20 years? You doomsday scenario featuring a warlike China and Russia or an increase in S.Korean-Chinese trade leading to a deteriorating NK-China alliance?
Go study that military strategy you claim to be ignorant of and then come back and post. |
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Koreadays
Joined: 20 May 2008
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| Posted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 6:58 am Post subject: |
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| Steelrails wrote: |
So you think unauthorized civilian aircraft will be able to take to S.Korean skies during wartime? You do realize that for an aircraft to carry an atomic bomb we're talking something like a Learjet (doubtful), probably a DC-9 or something like that or maybe even it would take a medium size passenger jet. A Cessena 152 wouldn't be able to carry a bomb underneath it.
t. |
war time? you mean like tomorrow morning? or next Tuesday?
Surprise!
for the norks to launch their Nuke they could use many different delivery systems. perhaps if you stopped chanting USA USA USA all day and actually read up on what the enemy is capable of doing you might be thinking differently.
the norks could use ICBM's, SLBMs or even a ground-detonation could be possible.
Are you telling me you believe North Korea could in no way set off a nuke in Seoul? you swear by this??
and btw, every decade that passes more and more advanced he will get.
or he will sell the nukes to terrorists.
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| Nice link there, did you even bother to read it? |
yes I read it. and it shows you that it's a threat to not take likely.
for all we know they might have invented something which we don't know.
we don't know anything about North Korea. the country is CLOSED OFF.
we have never been allowed in to wonder about.
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| Not dreaming. You really think that with the other 47 states still going that America would turn into Ukraine? |
maybe not Ukraine, but dude. seriously a bomb on NYC and you think people are going to get on the L train and head to work?
the stock market will panic! and cause a worldwide recession. and the American dollar will collapse on the markets. it will be worthless.
then roughly 2 million people will be dead off the get go. if the target was Manhattan. then the radius around it maybe another million. then the 3rd degree burn victims, the hospitals, the emergency workers, the looting, the transportation, the risk of disease etc etc etc... the total destruction of the city in rumbles. yeah sure the kids out in Jersey might be fine. but seriously. dude.. come on...
America already has trillions of dollars in debt.
the economical impact would be devastating.
you think it would be just a little scratch.
dude, the Sub prime mortgage recession of 2007-2008 was nothing
the crash of 29, 87 will be nothing compared to what will happen if a nuke goes off in NYC.
if terrorists get hold of nukes. Manhattan will be the target.
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| It would take a long time, a lot of money, and for fantasy to become reality. Stop watching Red Dawn. Go study Military Strategy and Operations. |
good movie.. come on you got to admit was cool when we were 10.
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| No but they aren't about to spend a Gazillion Rubles on sending 500,000 soldiers to Mexico. And it would take them about 20 years to develop that capability. |
yeah , I did say give them a 20 year deadline. 20 years isn't that long.
and when USA has burnt up all it's Oil, Russia will have PLENTY as it's sitting on TONS! last I heard USA is very dependent on Oil.
the days of JD Rockefeller are over for the Americans. it's the RUssians and Arabs now. America burnt up all their goodies to early.
and I doubt Chavez will take our call. He hates us.
and what will we be paying in,? American Dollars?
yes it wont be the end of USA. but the number 1 ranking will be a thing of the past.
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| The Art of War is great, but its a general guide of basic military principles that have been in play for the history of warfare. |
riiight.. so you believe that the USA Military can destroy any country in world don't you?
Americans also thought the Vietnam war would be over in a couple months. what happened there? they got their asses handed to them on a plate and sent running home with their tails between their legs by the Vietcong.. THE VIETCONG!
no flash toys, no trained military, no bells and whistles.
and then they go and use napalm on innocent people.
the US military has always been good at that.
and again the bell tolls with the Iraq war and Afganistan. 10 years and we are still going.
but again, you think North Korea will be a cake walk. in and out like a kimchi jigae from Kimbab nara.
yeah right....
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| So which is more likely in 20 years? You doomsday scenario featuring a warlike China and Russia or an increase in S.Korean-Chinese trade leading to a deteriorating NK-China alliance? |
neither.
a South Korean and CHinese alliance in trade would not deteriorate the relationship with NK and China.
Because China will have no problem in swallowing up North Korea and taking it as china. And they are probably eying it up for themselves anyway.
you think China really wants the South to take over the North?
I don't. The North are gamblers, and so are the Chinese.
the North are running up a huge tab to China and one day China is gonna say pay up.. and KJI will hand over the keys.
Once that happens, The USA will be pressured to leave the border and retreat to okinawa and South Korea can spend the next thousand years crying as it will never get their land back.
Lets hope that never happens.
I mean if KJI did hand over his country to China.. nothing the world can do about it. I doubt China would just hand it over to South Korea because its the right thing to do
hahahahaha
might sell it back, who knows.
China will not support the Americans in invading North Korea.
because I don't see the point in USA paying off their debt to China with the money they will make from South Korea and China loosing out on their money which is owed to them by KJI.
so CHina will support North Korea. because if it comes down to a country taking North Korea. China wants it.
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| Go study that military strategy you claim to be ignorant of and then come back and post |
dude.. you honestly thing reading a few books makes you a tactician on military warfare? give me break.
North Korea can deliver pain to us. no question. I don't care about the final result what happens to his nation. I care about my family and friends living here in Seoul if he did decide to push the button one day.
Apeaceful reunification is the only solution but for that to happen USA need to pack up their military and leave this country and let the Koreans deal with it without pointing guns at each other. it's the only way for a win win situation.
LET'S GIVE PEACE A CHANCE
the Americans provoke nations. it's not the way. but perhaps your tactical warfare genius thinks otherwise.
Do you know why USA have remained in South Korea for 60 years?
MONEY and lot's of it.
I believe if USA left. The Asians would sort it out peacefully. |
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comm
Joined: 22 Jun 2010
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| Posted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 9:19 am Post subject: |
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Koreadays, you really are just making stuff up that you think sounds good. It's kinda fun to think that the entire world is on the brink, but right now you're ignoring the reality of everything from established geopolitical theory to nuclear physics. You've got kind of a mountain of crap going, but I'll knock one thing off for ya.
| Koreadays wrote: |
It doesn't take the greatest military in the world to drop a nuke and kill 20 million people. takes a small plane and a target . once the bomb is made its all down hill from there. The Norks already have built the bomb. |
So first off we should clarify that the Norks have a fission device (Hiroshima/Nagasaki style) which has roughly 1/10th the power of the fusion devices the US/Russia/China use.
That said, here's a simple breakdown of the destructive radius of a fission device detonated at ideal air burst height.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Abombdamage1945.svg
Detonation at ground level would deal a lot less damage.
Now just pull up Google Maps and center on Seoul. Zoom in to where the legend shows you the 5km distance and that's about the diameter of significant destruction.
This amounts to about 28.26 square kilometers out of Seoul's 605.25 square kilometers receiving up to "moderate" destruction. (using a blast radius of 3km for moderate damage). You can tack on additional deaths from radiation poisoning, though those casualties SHOULD be far lower than in 1945 due to our knowledge of it.
In any case, the vast majority of Seoul would be in good shape and after a period of evacuation (which would happen during a war anyway) things would get back on track in a hurry.
As for your quips about the navies of Russia and China... The U.S. currently has a policy of maintaining a navy equal to the tonnage of the next 17 navies combined. Currently, U.S. naval tonnage is 3x that of Russia and China combined. If one of them ramped up naval spending, so would we. The difference is, our economy can win an arms race. And before you start into how the U.S. is dying, here are the economic stats:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_future_GDP_(nominal)_estimates
And keep in mind that a top Chinese official regards the nation's GDP numbers as being "man-made". |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Koreadays wrote: |
| and what combat experience has the Americans had in the past 10 years?shooting innocent people in Iraq? the North Soldiers are not sitting around in Bars in Itaewon getting their drink on. they are probably living a serious hard combat training life. 24/7! |
No.
They have been gardening and working on construction.
You over-estimate them. |
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Koreadays
Joined: 20 May 2008
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| Posted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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| comm wrote: |
Koreadays, you really are just making stuff up that you think sounds good. It's kinda fun to think that the entire world is on the brink, but right now you're ignoring the reality of everything from established geopolitical theory to nuclear physics. You've got kind of a mountain of crap going, but I'll knock one thing off for ya.
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no, I don't think the world is on the brink of war.
everything I have said I believe is possible.
China or Russia could take over the number 1 position in the future if they wanted too,
and North Korea, pakistan, IRan, could sell Nukes to Terrorists. Anti American Jihadists or what not and they could bomb Manhattan with it.
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| geopolitical theory to nuclear physics |
maybe not today. but a decade goes by quick. and what about 20 years from now. it doesn't matter how big and strong the American military become. what can it do to KJI getting the know how to build a first grade bomb something like a Tsar Bomba. but you guys think North Korea will never be able to do it. I think one day he will. the more and more we leave him alone, the more and more he is getting closer to building the mother of all bombs!
I believe he doesn't need to spend billions of money on tanks, jets, boats. just research into building the bomb. that's enough,that's where the gold is
for him. he knows he will never win a military assault. but a TSAR bomb he knows he can do damage. this is what I believe this mad man is working towards
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| So first off we should clarify that the Norks have a fission device (Hiroshima/Nagasaki style) which has roughly 1/10th the power of the fusion devices the US/Russia/China use. |
how do you know what he has???
American Intelligence have no idea what he has in his classified area.
do the Russians know what USA have in its classified area?
you are assuming KJI has a bomb which is weak.
I am assuming he has a bomb which is not as weak as we believe.
if his bomb is nothing, why do we even give a chit? why don't we just wave our hand at him and say. "dude you want to nuke something go ahead" your little bomb ain't gonna do chit." Go AHEAD! MAKE MY DAY!
North Korea is a threat last I read all over the world papers,
but I guess the journalists and the military personal all on the news talk shows are just ignorant like me.
north Korea is a joke right..
we just give him attention for entertainment purposes only. yeah ok.
the more time that passes the more chance he has of getting a bigger bomb.
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This amounts to about 28.26 square kilometers out of Seoul's 605.25 square kilometers receiving up to "moderate" destruction. (using a blast radius of 3km for moderate damage). You can tack on additional deaths from radiation poisoning, though those casualties SHOULD be far lower than in 1945 due to our knowledge of it.
In any case, the vast majority of Seoul would be in good shape and after a period of evacuation (which would happen during a war anyway) things would get back on track in a hurry. |
well let's hope your theory is correct if KJI did nuke us.
I think his bomb might be stronger than we think.
I mean how do we really know what he has built?
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As for your quips about the navies of Russia and China... The U.S. currently has a policy of maintaining a navy equal to the tonnage of the next 17 navies combined. Currently, U.S. naval tonnage is 3x that of Russia and China combined. If one of them ramped up naval spending, so would we. The difference is, our economy can win an arms race. And before you start into how the U.S. is dying, here are the economic stats:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_future_GDP_(nominal)_estimates
And keep in mind that a top Chinese official regards the nation's GDP numbers as being "man-made" |
I agree.
but USA could not afford a war with China or Russia. if either one of those countries went into a full scale war. it would be the end of us.
of course that would never happen. I think humanity is pass that kind of thinking how. well my grandfather fought in ww2. he is still alive. that's scary when you think about it
in closing I will say this.
We have emerging countries.
India, Russia, China, Saudi Arabia
50 years from now the world might be a different place.
MONEY is needed. and USA is running out of it fast.,,
In business it's a wise move to wait for your competitors to burn themselves out and then go in for the kill and take the market share with your reserve capital. I feel like USA will be broke sooner rather than later
so hanging onto to the title as the BAD ASS DOG of the world might not be easy. |
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Koreadays
Joined: 20 May 2008
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| Posted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
| Koreadays wrote: |
| and what combat experience has the Americans had in the past 10 years?shooting innocent people in Iraq? the North Soldiers are not sitting around in Bars in Itaewon getting their drink on. they are probably living a serious hard combat training life. 24/7! |
No.
They have been gardening and working on construction.
You over-estimate them. |
hahahahah yeah right....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOS0_WEuYUU
you ever seen the MASS GAMES?
KJI has students practice all year round to put on one of the greatest demonstrations in the world. these students have to work for hours a day
you don't think KJI has his military training all day?
come on dude... |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Koreadays wrote: |
[
| Quote: |
| So first off we should clarify that the Norks have a fission device (Hiroshima/Nagasaki style) which has roughly 1/10th the power of the fusion devices the US/Russia/China use. |
how do you know what he has???
American Intelligence have no idea what he has in his classified area.
do the Russians know what USA have in its classified area?
you are assuming KJI has a bomb which is weak.
I am assuming he has a bomb which is not as weak as we believe.
if his bomb is nothing, why do we even give a chit? why don't we just wave our hand at him and say. "dude you want to nuke something go ahead" your little bomb ain't gonna do chit." Go AHEAD! MAKE MY DAY!
. |
The 2006 North Korean nuclear bomb test had a yield of less than 1 kiloton. That's pretty weak.
As for waving our hand at him...it could still do a lot of damage to South Korea...so could their army. And Dirty Harry does not run the U.S.A or South Korea. When you are 12 years old it might be fun to say "Go ahead make my day!" When you grow up you realize that dealing with real-world baddies is not always so simple. |
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Koreadays
Joined: 20 May 2008
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| Posted: Mon Dec 27, 2010 6:27 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| Koreadays wrote: |
[
| Quote: |
| So first off we should clarify that the Norks have a fission device (Hiroshima/Nagasaki style) which has roughly 1/10th the power of the fusion devices the US/Russia/China use. |
how do you know what he has???
American Intelligence have no idea what he has in his classified area.
do the Russians know what USA have in its classified area?
you are assuming KJI has a bomb which is weak.
I am assuming he has a bomb which is not as weak as we believe.
if his bomb is nothing, why do we even give a chit? why don't we just wave our hand at him and say. "dude you want to nuke something go ahead" your little bomb ain't gonna do chit." Go AHEAD! MAKE MY DAY!
. |
The 2006 North Korean nuclear bomb test had a yield of less than 1 kiloton. That's pretty weak.
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I'm no scientist but couldnt you just test a 1 kiloton bomb see if it works then multiply that by 100 with the right amount of uranium?
I mean in theory? |
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