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Nowhere Man
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
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 Posted: Wed May 25, 2011 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm eager to hear how China "fought" the US during the Vietnam War. |
The same way the U.S. fought the Russians in Afganistahn in the 1980's |
FAIL!
Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? |
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soupsandwich
Joined: 20 May 2011
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2011 6:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Ok, aside from quoting Animal House, how is that a fail? |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2011 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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| soupsandwich wrote: |
| Ok, aside from quoting Animal House, how is that a fail? |
Ignore that. You're right.
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After the launch of Operation Rolling Thunder, China sent engineering battalions and supporting anti-aircraft units to North Vietnam to repair the damage caused by American bombing, build roads, railroads and to perform other engineering works. This freed North Vietnamese army units to go to the South. Between 1965 and 1970 over 320,000 Chinese soldiers served in North Vietnam; the peak year was 1967 when 170,000 were serving there. |
The US in Afghanistan analogy is uncanny, too.
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| In February 1979 China attacked along virtually the entire Sino-Vietnamese border in a brief, limited campaign that involved ground forces only. The Chinese attack came at dawn on the morning of 17 February 1979, and employed infantry, armor, and artillery. Air power was not employed then or at any time during the war. Within a day, the Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) had advanced some eight kilometers into Vietnam along a broad front. It then slowed and nearly stalled because of heavy Vietnamese resistance and difficulties within the Chinese supply system. On February 21, the advance resumed against Cao Bang in the far north and against the all-important regional hub of Lang Son. Chinese troops entered Cao Bang on February 27, but the city was not secured completely until March 2. Lang Son fell two days later. On March 5, the Chinese, saying Vietnam had been sufficiently chastised, announced that the campaign was over. Beijing declared its "lesson" finished and the PLA withdrawal was completed on March 16. |
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soupsandwich
Joined: 20 May 2011
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| Posted: Wed May 25, 2011 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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| fair enough |
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Nowhere Man
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Thu May 26, 2011 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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In the summer of 1962, Mao Zedong agreed to supply Hanoi with 90,000 rifles and guns free of charge. Starting in 1965, China sent anti-aircraft units and engineering battalions to North Vietnam to repair the damage caused by American bombing, rebuild roads and railroads, and to perform other engineering works. This freed North Vietnamese army units for combat in the South.
Sino-Soviet relations soured after the Soviets invaded Czechoslovakia in August 1968. In October, the Chinese demanded North Vietnam cut relations with Moscow, but Hanoi refused.[210] The Chinese began to withdraw in November 1968 in preparation for a clash with the Soviets, which occurred at Zhenbao Island in March 1969. The Chinese also began financing the Khmer Rouge as a counterweight to the Vietnamese communists at this time. China's withdrawal from Vietnam was completed in July 1970 |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_War#People.27s_Republic_of_China |
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Nowhere Man
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Thu May 26, 2011 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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| The only subsequent President to try to deal with debt was Clinton. |
Patent nonsense. You couldn't back that statement up if you tried (and we already know you probably won't try) |
Clinton balanced the budget, did he not? |
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visitorq
Joined: 11 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Thu May 26, 2011 5:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Nowhere Man wrote: |
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| The only subsequent President to try to deal with debt was Clinton. |
Patent nonsense. You couldn't back that statement up if you tried (and we already know you probably won't try) |
Clinton balanced the budget, did he not? |
No, he did not. Don't make me laugh. |
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soupsandwich
Joined: 20 May 2011
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| Posted: Thu May 26, 2011 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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Nowhere Man wrote:
Quote:
Quote:
The only subsequent President to try to deal with debt was Clinton.
Patent nonsense. You couldn't back that statement up if you tried (and we already know you probably won't try)
Clinton balanced the budget, did he not?
No, he did not. Don't make me laugh |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu May 26, 2011 5:44 pm Post subject: |
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Interesting, and somewhat related...
[url="http://defence21.hani.co.kr/9875"]http://defence21.hani.co.kr/9875[/url]
English summary...
[url="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2011/05/26/china-to-intervene-in-n-korea-in-emergency-hani-defense-21/"]http://www.rjkoehler.com/2011/05/26/china-...ani-defense-21/[/url]
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This secret plan is named �the Chick Plan,� meaning that China would protect and manage North Korea like a hen does her eggs. This plan reportedly includes plans to occupy those areas of North Korea north of a line stretching from Nampo in the west to Wonsan in the east, maintain security throughout North Korea and block the flow of refugees into China.
The existence of this plan was learned during the trial of Park Chae-seo, a former South Korean spy recently sentenced to seven years in jail for leaking secret military documents to North Korea. Park said around 2004, during a period of tension between South Korea and the United States over OPLAN 5029, he learned of the plan from a director-level Chinese intelligence official. This was a time when Korea was on-guard regarding Chinese intervention in Korea due to Beijing�s �Northeast Project.� Park said the existence of the plan was reconfirmed by multiple Chinese officials afterwards. According to Kim, this gives Park�s claims substantial credibility.
Assuming Park is telling the truth, this means both China and the United States are preparing to intervene in Korea in the event of an emergency in North Korea, and in a worst case scenario, this could lead to a clash.
According to Park�s lawyers, both the North Korean and Chinese governments prevent Chinese businesses from investing south of the Nampo�Wonsan line. This would suggest that even if China were to intervene in the North to protect Chinese nationals, it would not move south of the Daedong River. This would also suggest that the Nampo�Wonsan line would be the southern boundary of a Chinese occupation zone. If China were to move further south to occupy areas near the South Korean border and areas of South Korean investment, it would cause headaches. Park also said in order to carry out the operation successfully, it has assembled PLA regulars in Shenyang and built operational roads crossing the Yalu and Tumen rivers at the cost of 2.5 trillion won. |
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soupsandwich
Joined: 20 May 2011
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| Posted: Thu May 26, 2011 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Interesting, and somewhat related...
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[url="http://defence21.hani.co.kr/9875"]http://defence21.hani.co.kr/9875[/url]
English summary...
[url="http://www.rjkoehler.com/2011/05/26/china-to-intervene-in-n-korea-in-emergency-hani-defense-21/"]http://www.rjkoehler.com/2011/05/26/china-...ani-defense-21/[/url]
Quote:
This secret plan is named �the Chick Plan,� meaning that China would protect and manage North Korea like a hen does her eggs. This plan reportedly includes plans to occupy those areas of North Korea north of a line stretching from Nampo in the west to Wonsan in the east, maintain security throughout North Korea and block the flow of refugees into China.
The existence of this plan was learned during the trial of Park Chae-seo, a former South Korean spy recently sentenced to seven years in jail for leaking secret military documents to North Korea. Park said around 2004, during a period of tension between South Korea and the United States over OPLAN 5029, he learned of the plan from a director-level Chinese intelligence official. This was a time when Korea was on-guard regarding Chinese intervention in Korea due to Beijing�s �Northeast Project.� Park said the existence of the plan was reconfirmed by multiple Chinese officials afterwards. According to Kim, this gives Park�s claims substantial credibility.
Assuming Park is telling the truth, this means both China and the United States are preparing to intervene in Korea in the event of an emergency in North Korea, and in a worst case scenario, this could lead to a clash.
According to Park�s lawyers, both the North Korean and Chinese governments prevent Chinese businesses from investing south of the Nampo�Wonsan line. This would suggest that even if China were to intervene in the North to protect Chinese nationals, it would not move south of the Daedong River. This would also suggest that the Nampo�Wonsan line would be the southern boundary of a Chinese occupation zone. If China were to move further south to occupy areas near the South Korean border and areas of South Korean investment, it would cause headaches. Park also said in order to carry out the operation successfully, it has assembled PLA regulars in Shenyang and built operational roads crossing the Yalu and Tumen rivers at the cost of 2.5 trillion won |
VERY interesting indeed.......................which is why I feel the U.S. should leave Korea and let them handle their own affairs........giving them what they want.
soupsandwich |
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NohopeSeriously
Joined: 17 Jan 2011
Location: The Christian Right-Wing Educational Republic of Korea
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| Posted: Thu May 26, 2011 10:19 pm Post subject: |
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| soupsandwich wrote: |
| VERY interesting indeed.......................which is why I feel the U.S. should leave Korea and let them handle their own affairs........giving them what they want. |
This is what the Korean public trying to say for 20 years straight. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu May 26, 2011 11:38 pm Post subject: |
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| NohopeSeriously wrote: |
| soupsandwich wrote: |
| VERY interesting indeed.......................which is why I feel the U.S. should leave Korea and let them handle their own affairs........giving them what they want. |
This is what the Korean public trying to say for 20 years straight. |
Which public? I've yet to se them elect someone with a pledge of getting US forces out.
In fact, didn't they justelect a fairly conservative president a few years back?
IMO, the public, like nearly everyone else, has mixed feelings on the issue. |
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Panda
Joined: 25 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Thu May 26, 2011 11:49 pm Post subject: |
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China didn't send ground troops during the Vietnam war.
But they sent airforce, artilley and navy, also helped build roads etc. |
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caniff
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Location: All over the map
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| Posted: Thu May 26, 2011 11:51 pm Post subject: |
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| NohopeSeriously wrote: |
| soupsandwich wrote: |
| VERY interesting indeed.......................which is why I feel the U.S. should leave Korea and let them handle their own affairs........giving them what they want. |
This is what the Korean public trying to say for 20 years straight. |
Which Korea are you living in? |
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NohopeSeriously
Joined: 17 Jan 2011
Location: The Christian Right-Wing Educational Republic of Korea
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| Posted: Fri May 27, 2011 5:00 am Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
Which public? I've yet to se them elect someone with a pledge of getting US forces out.
In fact, didn't they justelect a fairly conservative president a few years back?
IMO, the public, like nearly everyone else, has mixed feelings on the issue. |
Consider that the GNP is collapsing like a dead mosquito and Park Guen-hye is not doing something significant after this GNP mess up, it's becoming a reality.
I'm a pro-American. But I think the America military bases in Korea is directly against the American interest. |
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