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in depth 60 minutes: KBS' expose on English teachers.
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earthbound14

Joined: 23 Jan 2007
Location: seoul

Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 6:53 pm Post subject:

stevemcgarrett wrote:

This journalistic "expose" only goes to further cement my view that not only is Korean society xenophobic but unwilling to treat foreigners as guests.

Consider this irony: in China, which has a more authoritarian government and completely controls the mass media, you will NEVER, repeat NEVER, see a show like this.

Despite the fact that some expat teachers in China are deserving of scrutiny, jail time, and being deported, it just won't happen.

The reason is simple: the Chinese play the role of host to their foreign guests. They value their image as good hosts. They care about mutual face and they consider very rude to reveal in public transgressions that even the West receive exposure.

Whenever I read Korean apologist posters here declare or insinuate that the Chinese are disdainful of foreigners, xenophobic, etc. I will remember stories like these.

And, yes, this is yet another reason why I don't like living here and why I'm counting down the months to departure.

well said

jaganath69

Joined: 17 Jul 2003

Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 7:40 pm Post subject:

mrsquirrel wrote:

For example (no passport photo though)

Quote:

Korean locked-up after alleged sexual assault inside Entertainment Complex in Naklua.

A case now which originated from the Star Dice Entertainment Complex in Naklua and led to the arrest of a Korean Tourist. Police Lieutenant Colonel Chayaporn from Pattaya Police Station was called to the venue in the early hours of Thursday Morning after a complaint was received by a singer employed at the venue. She claimed that the Korean Man had placed his hands on her chest as she was performing. Police arrived and had to restrain Mr. Jun Yong Kim aged 32 after he showed aggression towards the arresting officers. At the Police Station, Mr. Kim denied the allegations made by Khun Monchadar aged 32 who confirmed that she slapped the man on his face after he placed his hands on her chest who then attempted to repeat his actions. Mr. Kim, who was in a drunken state, was placed behind bars for the night pending further investigations.

http://www.pattayacitynews.net/news_06_09_50_4.htm

Thanks for that, I am an avid fan but missed that story. Made my day.

The_Eyeball_Kid

Joined: 20 Jun 2007

Posted: Fri Sep 07, 2007 8:00 pm Post subject:

CentralCali wrote:

The_Eyeball_Kid wrote:

CentralCali wrote:

Eyeball, I certainly hope you don't think your post above was either contributing to the discussion or representative of polite discourse.

Sorry - I was making a rhetorical point that was possibly lost on you.

It wasn't lost. Neither was the fact that it was quite impolite and not very conducive to intelligent debate.

How so?

The_Conservative

Joined: 15 Mar 2007

Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 1:21 am Post subject: Re: in depth 60 minutes: KBS' expose on English teachers.

earthbound14 wrote:

[, it seems to implicate only foreigners (who do you think grew it....probably some Koreans), the fact that all native ESL instructors are being put into question by a few pot smokers.

I bolded the part of your quote that I would like you to look at. This is another reason and a very big one at that why I don't think pot smokers should be coming here. Not unless they can lay off the herb while here.

CentralCali

Joined: 17 May 2007

Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 1:52 am Post subject:

The_Eyeball_Kid wrote:

CentralCali wrote:

The_Eyeball_Kid wrote:

CentralCali wrote:

Eyeball, I certainly hope you don't think your post above was either contributing to the discussion or representative of polite discourse.

Sorry - I was making a rhetorical point that was possibly lost on you.

It wasn't lost. Neither was the fact that it was quite impolite and not very conducive to intelligent debate.

How so?

a) It was childish.
b) It was not an intelligent comment.
c) It showed your complete disrespect for any founded opinion of the person you were addressing.
d) It made no actual contribution to the discussion at hand.
e) Your so-called point could have been made in a mature manner.

On the other hand

Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue

Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 2:05 am Post subject:

Steve wrote:

Quote:

Despite the fact that some expat teachers in China are deserving of scrutiny, jail time, and being deported, it just won't happen.

The reason is simple: the Chinese play the role of host to their foreign guests. They value their image as good hosts. They care about mutual face and they consider very rude to reveal in public transgressions that even the West receive exposure.

I am no expert on China, but I suspect there is a certain amount of romanticization involved in Steve McG's portrayal of Chinese "hospitality".

If Chinese TV were to run stories about dope-smoking ESL backpackers, you'd probably have a lot of viewers thinking to themselves "Jesus Christ, what sort of boneheaded bureaucrats let these assholes into the country?" And if some of those ESLers happened to be employed at state-run schools, the viewers would be thinking "Holy crap, our education system is going right into the toilet." In other words, saving face for foreigners is probably related, in no small way, to the self-interest of the Chinese authorities.

Again, I'm no expert on China. If the Chinese media routinely runs stories likely to incite animosity toward government bureaucrats and state schools, I'm sure one of our "China hands" on the board will offer me a polite correction.

stevemcgarrett

Joined: 24 Mar 2006

Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 7:29 pm Post subject:

OTOH speculated:

Quote:

Nice try, bruddah. It's not an attempt to romanticize at all: most Chinese hold their leadership in contempt and find their educational system severely lacking. So there would be no backlash by exposing these foreigners.

As I said, most Chinese value their role as host, which is why these days so much effort is made to make African students feel welcome on campuses nationwide and why you do not find Chinese university waibans discriminating in hiring on the basis of skin color (although it does sometimes happen in the middle schools and private tutoring salons). Indeed, some of the recruiters that advertize here on Dave's make a point of saying that race and ethnicity are no object.

Chinese, in the main, do not want to be accused of being xenophobic; for far too many Koreans, however, the label is a badge of honor.

On the other hand

Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue

Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 8:28 pm Post subject:

Quote:

And is this contempt for leaders and teachers often expressed openly in the media?

The_Eyeball_Kid

Joined: 20 Jun 2007

Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 8:42 pm Post subject:

CentralCali wrote:

The_Eyeball_Kid wrote:

CentralCali wrote:

The_Eyeball_Kid wrote:

CentralCali wrote:

Eyeball, I certainly hope you don't think your post above was either contributing to the discussion or representative of polite discourse.

Sorry - I was making a rhetorical point that was possibly lost on you.

It wasn't lost. Neither was the fact that it was quite impolite and not very conducive to intelligent debate.

How so?

I disagree, on all counts.

What is more, if you thought THAT was immature, try this:

Go fuck yourself, prick.

stevemcgarrett

Joined: 24 Mar 2006

Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 12:05 am Post subject:

OTOH inquired:

Quote:

And is this contempt for leaders and teachers often expressed openly in the media?

That's a rhetorical question, right? It's also irrelevant to what I expressed.

CentralCali

Joined: 17 May 2007

Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 12:55 am Post subject:

The_Eyeball_Kid wrote:

I disagree, on all counts.

Color me surprised. Rolling Eyes

Quote:

What is more, if you thought THAT was immature, try this:

Go **** yourself, ****.

Welcome to permanent ignore.

TheUrbanMyth

Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 3:39 am Post subject:

Well this thread went downhill fast... some people shouldn't be let out at recess to play.

On the other hand

Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue

Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 8:25 am Post subject:

deleted, see below. Last edited by On the other hand on Sun Sep 09, 2007 8:26 am; edited 1 time in total

On the other hand

Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue

Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 8:26 am Post subject:

stevemcgarrett wrote:

OTOH inquired:

Quote:

And is this contempt for leaders and teachers often expressed openly in the media?

That's a rhetorical question, right? It's also irrelevant to what I expressed.

No, it's quite relevant. Because if...

A. Anti-foreign teacher stories are regarded as anti-government stories, and...

B. The Chinese media has a policy of not running anti-government stories, then...

It follows that the Chinese media's taboo on anti-foreigner stories has at least as much to do with being pro-government as it does with being nice to foreigners.

And I base my "anti-foreigner = anti-government" equation on many hours logged listening to anti-immigration discourse in North America. There, almost any discussion of how bad foreigners are eventually evolved into a bitter diatribe against the government for letting them in. Since you assure us that the Chinese regard their government with contempt, I'd imagine things are roughly the same over there.

The_Eyeball_Kid

Joined: 20 Jun 2007

Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 8:33 am Post subject:

CentralCali wrote:

The_Eyeball_Kid wrote:

I disagree, on all counts.

Color me surprised. Rolling Eyes

Quote:

What is more, if you thought THAT was immature, try this:

Go **** yourself, ****.

Welcome to permanent ignore.

Thanks. It's nice here.

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