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baccus
Joined: 09 May 2003
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 Posted: Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:08 pm Post subject: |
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| homer, your more than welcome to take the pillowcase off my hands as i sure you need it! |
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Zyzyfer
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?
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| Posted: Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:16 pm Post subject: |
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| baccus wrote: |
final response,
let me address some of the questions:
no i do not have anything against gyopos. i find them no dofferent than other koreans or foreigners for the most part, but yes, i have met a handful that were nothing but trouble and this is not just my perception, but that of fellow colleagues and aquaintainces.
i have come to believe anyone who brags too often, too much can not be fully believed and thus have responded accordingly.
i have made a typo - heresy - heresay - and yes, scott you have a valid point, but i would argue my examples are more objective as opposed to people who have used personal experiences, however anecdotal. accurate enough to be considered factual. the responses i have recieved were too defensive and thus pointless.
i suggest a certain individual look up the various meanings of the word 'just' and make a logical conclusion. my man, you are too predictable. anyone who waits in anticipation to stomp on someone over an non-issue can only said to be deficient. thus i gave you something chew on.
my close colleagues know i speak korean, but for the most part, in a large office, most people do not know and i like to keep it that way. my job involves working using western practices, and thus everyone has a more than adequate understanding of the english language.
the point(s)
money plays a major role in korea and many koreans are after the money. however, no matter how much money one has, it cannot buy status. koreans with an education do not respect wealthy people without an education because there are just too many people who have made money through real estate, business, etc. politicians are the most powerful people in korea, more powerful than any chaebol owner. the recent supposed suicide of a chaebol chief is believed among the elite to have been forced out, as opposed to willingly under his own accord. why? too many answers to questions that could destroy too many politicians and other businessmen. ever wonder why people live in *beep* but drive expensive cars. i see people living in one rooms driving foreign cars. i know these people have very little money, yet they drive beamers. because they don;t have the education, the next best thing is the illusion of wealth. no amount of money can make up for the lack of an education and all the associations that naturally come with it.
i know an individual from a wealthy family who is unmarried. his chances of marriage are not good because he is handicapped. he has a limp and he is shorter than average. this is only one case in many i have witnessed.
any beautiful girl will have an inordinate among of suitors and chasers(stalkers) whereas a less than average girl will be hard pressed to find anyone. this is an indisputable fact of korean life, more so than in the west.
my job and that of friends and colleagues require we frequent establishments where women are prominent. statistical evidence backs up my claims that at least 10% of girls have between the ages of 20-30 have at one time or another worked in the sex industry - prostitution, room salons, massage parlors, etc.
i frequent bars after work for a nightcap. i live and work in an affluent area where there are a large number of such venues including western hotels. there are many working girls everywhere i go. some are working, some are just out for fun. did you guys know that 588 girls will go to nightclubs to take a break from work and have a one night stand? i met a girl in a bar who was a college student. after talking to her for a while over a drink, she propositioned me. i declined. as it was a slow night, we started discussing our personal lives and i found out she had a finance and he did not know she moonlighted to make extra money. she had not even had sex with him yet and responded incredulously when i asked why. yet, she didn't seem too fazed about getting money to buy things her parents weren't willing to buying for her. her parents wer paying for an apt. and all her other expenses.
i have met many people and i have come to the conclusion koreans have more secrets than the average person. i know of many examples. one girl, who has a foreign fiance regularly meets other people to engage in extra curricular activity. i know korean girls who have more than one phone and as many boyfriends. i inquired about this to older (parental age) people and they saw nothing wrong in dating more than one person while they are looking for a suitable partner for marriage.
there are just too many examples of which these are but just a few.
how does this all fit in to the larger picture?
money matters but education is more important and a combination of the two is better. generally, if you can get into the top school, chances are the money and power and respect will follow. hubeh, sombeh are necessary if you want to succeed in korea. thus the background plays a significant role in all koreans lives.
looks - need i say more.
the past plays a large part in the decision making process because of the burden of guilt and as i mentioned above, secrets are numerous.
obviously this does not answer everything and everyone has every right to disagree with my assessment, but in defense i ask you to disprove what i have said.
this by no means suggest your personal lives must fall under such, but this only illustrates the larger picture and provides some insight into the factors that affect the lives of many koreans.
love - is not important in korea. family duty takes precedence. |
:B |
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jurassic5
Joined: 02 Apr 2003
Location: PA
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| Posted: Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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| baccus wrote: |
no i do not have anything against gyopos. i find them no dofferent than other koreans or foreigners for the most part, but yes, i have met a handful that were nothing but trouble and this is not just my perception, but that of fellow colleagues and aquaintainces.
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so thus, rather than saying that gyopos in general are trouble...just say that the few individuals you met were nothing but trouble, regardless if they are gyopo, american, canadian, dutch, el salvadorian etc.
i've met a handful of English teachers here in Korea and there were nothing but trouble  |
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Ody
Joined: 27 Jan 2003
Location: over here
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| Posted: Wed Apr 21, 2004 9:08 pm Post subject: |
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| baccus wrote: |
final edited response,
money plays a major role in korea and many koreans are after the money. however, no matter how much money one has, it cannot buy status. koreans with an education do not respect wealthy people without an education because there are just too many people who have made money through real estate, business, etc. ....... too many answers to questions that could destroy too many politicians and other businessmen. ever wonder why people live in *beep* but drive expensive cars. i see people living in one rooms driving foreign cars. i know these people have very little money, yet they drive beamers. because they don't have the education, the next best thing is the illusion of wealth. no amount of money can make up for the lack of an education and all the associations that naturally come with it.
i know an individual from a wealthy family who is unmarried. his chances of marriage are not good because he is handicapped. he has a limp and he is shorter than average. this is only one case in many i have witnessed.
any beautiful girl will have an inordinate among of suitors and chasers(stalkers) whereas a less than average girl will be hard pressed to find anyone. this is an indisputable fact of korean life, more so than in the west.
money matters but education is more important and a combination of the two is better. generally, if you can get into the top school, chances are the money and power and respect will follow. hubeh, sombeh are necessary if you want to succeed in korea. thus the background plays a significant role in all koreans lives.
looks - need i say more.
the past plays a large part in the decision making process because of the burden of guilt and as i mentioned above, secrets are numerous.
obviously this does not answer everything and everyone has every right to disagree with my assessment, but in defense i ask you to disprove what i have said.
this by no means suggest your personal lives must fall under such, but this only illustrates the larger picture and provides some insight into the factors that affect the lives of many koreans.
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and this is different in western countries how?
further edited for clarity.
Last edited by Ody on Wed Apr 21, 2004 9:39 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Alyallen
Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Location: The 4th Greatest Place on Earth = Jeonju!!!
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| Posted: Wed Apr 21, 2004 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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I totally am in accord with what Ody said. Baccus, seriously, I read your latest post and I thought of a number of relevent examples of that same kind of stuff happening in the US.
You are just stuck on the fact that  :GASP!: Koreans are doing it too. Whether the behavior is right or wrong is not for me (or really anyone else) to say, but seriously you can go wandering around the world and find the same kind of "devious" behavior all over the place.
People get played by the opposite sex, people sell themselves for sex, people pretend to be rich by having fancy cars, rich people have a hard time finding someone because they generally want to keep their money inclusive by marrying other rich people, blah blah blah....Why should Korea or Koreans get called out for doing what (darn near) eveyone else does? |
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kiwiboy_nz_99
Joined: 05 Jul 2003
Location: ...Enlightenment...
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| Posted: Wed Apr 21, 2004 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Bachus wrote: |
| homer, your more than welcome to take the pillowcase off my hands as i sure you need it! |
I just read this whole thread, and while I was struck from the outset by the fact that Bachus doesn't know what he's talking about, and is perhaps thinking of a Korea that is maybe 10 or 15 years old, not to mention a very small sector of Korean society, I couldn't really get to the point of taking his poorly constructed argument seriously. For all his vaunted intellegence and knowledge, not to mention his condescention, I just can't muster the energy to write a serious reply to someone who talks down to me and then spells the word "you're" as "your", not just once, but several times.
Bachus you're a buffoon, go back to your sandpit ... |
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baccus
Joined: 09 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Apr 22, 2004 4:58 am Post subject: |
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jurassic - noted.
ode, aly - although aly has made this point before, and it can be said to be true to an extent, both of you - it only scratches the surface. there are many truths but how do they help us to understand the underlying reasons behind them. cultures are much more complex and no simple reading can begin to scratch the surface. the degree to which things occur here are much more extreme and also very different than in the west. and if the case you two make is that it's the same everywhere, then why the cultural problems, why special marketing teams for every culture. have you ever heard of the three keys in another country? do americans only/prefer to marry peole ofthe same blood/race? too simplistic of a reading. what's the point of higher education?
kiwi - we all make spelling and grammar mistakes, especially when we are typing quickly while we are working. i'm sure a stellar fellow like yourself never makes mistakes. so what, you read this and say - i don't know what i'm talking about - yet you have offered nothing to counter it - why? it is too easy to brush something off - show your worth and offer soemthing then - or could it be you can't because you don;t have the capacity to go beyond making simplistic remarks. what you have siad though is quite funny and way off. try again! you don't have the energy to reply because you can't. making specious remarks must make youfeel better - heh? |
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Crois
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Location: You could be next so watch out.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 22, 2004 5:05 am Post subject: |
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| Kiwiboy stop being a troll on the spelling and grammar. HEE HEE |
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baccus
Joined: 09 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Apr 22, 2004 5:17 am Post subject: |
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kiwi,
i couldn't resist - did you actually go through looking for spelling/grammar mistakes because that is all could find to fault me on. it takes a special person to do such as thing. oh, man - thanks for the laugh. |
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kiwiboy_nz_99
Joined: 05 Jul 2003
Location: ...Enlightenment...
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| Posted: Thu Apr 22, 2004 5:30 am Post subject: |
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| i couldn't resist - did you actually go through looking for spelling/grammar mistakes because that is all could find to fault me on. it takes a special person to do such as thing. oh, man - thanks for the laugh. |
Don't laugh, seriously, don't laugh, I wouldn't laugh if I were you, there's nothing to laugh about.
No, I didn't go through the thread looking for errors, I was interested in the thread, your errors just stood out that's all. Hey, I agree that in general pointing out errors is a poor way to attack someone. But it's just that you come across so pompous and high minded, so you really should have your thing together if you want to talk down to the whole board. I don't like your attitude, your style, or your approach. I won't be wasting time on you like some of the highly intellegent and generous folks on here have been kind enough to do.
Let's just say you have a serious agenda, and you're no sociologist. What you have to say is strongly contradicted by several real life accounts in this thread alone, and you haven't answered them, because in your mind they are all 'aberations' or 'exceptions to the rule'. You're doing your science backwards, you've decided what you think, and now you're setting about finding ways to prove it. You're not really interested in the reality of the situation, and your enquiry is flawed.
Time for you to look deep inside and ask yourself what is really driving you in this endevour ... |
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Zyzyfer
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?
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| Posted: Thu Apr 22, 2004 6:17 am Post subject: |
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| kiwiboy_nz_99 wrote: |
| I couldn't really get to the point of taking his poorly constructed argument seriously. |
Hence the ":B" faces.
I know someone who does the same schtick on another message board I used to go to, going by the monicker maz78. His posting style was a spitting image of what this guy is doing...same condescension, same crackpot theories, same obliviousness to what people are actually saying; if I didn't know any better, I'd believe they were one and the same. Despite the consistent and often misplaced usage of the word "troll" on this message board, what you see before you in baccus is an honest-to-goodness bridgedweller, and there's not a lot to say that can actually get through his thick head.
-----
Since Aly said what I was saying anyways, I'll roll with that response.
| baccus wrote: |
| ode, aly - although aly has made this point before, and it can be said to be true to an extent, both of you - it only scratches the surface. there are many truths but how do they help us to understand the underlying reasons behind them. cultures are much more complex and no simple reading can begin to scratch the surface. the degree to which things occur here are much more extreme and also very different than in the west. |
Hard examples of how Korean culture is extreme, while Western culture is not. You're babbling without anything to back it up again. Come on you imbecile. Didn't you study English Composition in Uni?
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| and if the case you two make is that it's the same everywhere, then why the cultural problems, why special marketing teams for every culture. |
Read above comment, smacktard.
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| have you ever heard of the three keys in another country? do americans only/prefer to marry peole ofthe same blood/race? |
Most of the older white folks who live in my hometown tend to think that whites should stick with whites and not dating blacks. Asians are that iffy territory where it's okay, but you'll get a bunch of stupid jokes about eating rice for three square meals and just generally be an outcast. With the exception of the youngest generations (and even then this factor is dependant entirely on whether the kids reside in the city or country), most people still find interracial dating a bizarre thing to be doing. I take no pride in the fact that America is still full of a bunch of backwards-thinking people who regularly and carelessly fling about racist comments.
It seems to me that you're trying to fault Koreans for being vain and simplistic in their dating rituals. I'm no mind-reader; I'm going by the pathetic excuse for a post that you keep making on this thread. You have no semblance of transition from idea to idea, you provide no examples to support said ideas, and you still have not provided an insightful explanation as to how Korean-Korean dating trends affect Korean-Foreigner dating trends. I can theorize, and assume that you're referring to how some Korean women are looking for more freedom than Korean culture typically provides them in dating and marriage, or that only the women who aren't at the top of the dating pool are seeping down to the foreigners. The latter actually seemed to be your initial point, but it was pigeonholed into anecdotal uselessness, and desperately needs some reinforcement if you think that it's still a standing argument.
In short, your little diatribes on this thread are weak sauce. You're forgetting the golden rule of "new" ideas (as you would pretend this little gem of yours to be, apparently).
It is up to the person presenting the new idea to give facts, data, and analysis which supports his or her idea.
That doesn't mean some stupid magazine article about one foreign CEO. You need stats, more anecdotal evidence to support each point and confront each counterpoint against you, and you need to stop insulting your readers.
It might also help if your idea wasn't retarded.
This is my last post on this thread, concerning baccus at least. |
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baccus
Joined: 09 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Apr 22, 2004 6:49 am Post subject: |
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actually i give credit where it's due.
expalin to me how one crafts a well constructed argument when one is responding to some and dismissing others.
if you z, had read the last few posts you would see how funny your misplaced anger is. could it be that your lack of aptitude in seeing the real intent of my message is boiling that little pea brain of yours. by the way your way off topic as well. your funny. who said anything about peole living in the country. i thought one of the main points was money - a la wealth and education - progressive people - are we not. so why such a reference. time to cool down so you can think a little clearer.
i think it's clear you guys are too angry to think clearly. it must be hard going through life. and no, i'm don't think of myself as being better than others. but, it is iritating when peole keep mis-interpreting things that are quite simple to understand and using a defensive motive to try to one up someone. and no - no one has yet provided an example disputing me except maybe lush - but he hasn't answered my question yet.
nobody ever siad this was conclusive. more like a general state of being.
again - thanks for the laugh. |
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baccus
Joined: 09 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Apr 22, 2004 6:53 am Post subject: |
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z,
by the way,
it seems you wait until someone makes a remark before you can build up the courage, or should i say response.
kudos to you for the effort. |
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kiwiboy_nz_99
Joined: 05 Jul 2003
Location: ...Enlightenment...
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| Posted: Thu Apr 22, 2004 7:13 am Post subject: |
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nobody ever siad this was conclusive. more like a general state of being.
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What's a "state of being"? You are a very poor writer, and despite my instructions you are still not spelling "you're" correctly. What are you, 22 years old or something?
We're not angry, don't kid yourself that you're important enough to get angry about. People do get angry on this board somethimes, but in this case we're just annoyed, and taking the time ( generously I might add, as you're clearly not worth it ) to point out to you the error of your ignorant ways. Take a tip from the big dogs, go away, learn something, and come back when you know what you're talking about and can articulate it clearly. Oh, and it might not hurt to take a writing course while you're at it.
Hugs and kisses, kiwiboy ... |
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Homer
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Apr 22, 2004 8:55 am Post subject: |
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Baccus,
Good god man, learn to write or at the very least proof read yourself.
How about using a capital letter every now and again or making complete and correct sentences.
Then perhaps people would have a better chance of understanding what you are saying. |
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