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Old fat expat
Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Location: a caravan of dust, making for a windy prairie
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 Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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Rockhard:
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| Our culture, our religion, our language, our beliefs might not be genetic, but they are imbued in us at such an early age by our family that it might as well be genetic. |
You seem happy to mix ontogeny and phylogeny and say they are the same thing. I think that is a lazy shortcut, but that's just me.
I see culture and belief systems as constructs aimed to help societies not have to re-invent the wheel with every generation. I think in the past these belief systems worked by providing a sense of being and place -an antidote to anomie.
But the world is changing, so the social conservatives wanting their Ozzie and Harriet paradise are no more likely to achieve that goal than are American Indians longing for their golden era, life on the prairie hunting buffalo.
The nuclear family you are romanticizing worked in an emerging post industrial state and was beneficial for some and I can see why many right-wingers yearn for a past that existed for the fortunate class.
Feminists do not see themselves as part of that fortunate class. In democratically organized societies they wanted the promise of equality and the right to self determination. Although parts of the feminist movement appear to have been co-opted by radicals with a Marxist influence, not all feminists see themselves as you appear to.
As societies have evolved and come under the influence of neo-liberal economics, efficiencies have become an important part of how societies organize themselves. America could not survive in the modern world with productivity from the 1950s, the golden era conservatives want to re-introduce.
To be efficient, societies must include all members. To be democratic, societies must include everyone equally. The golden era you want back has gone. Whaaaa! |
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Rockhard
Joined: 11 Dec 2013
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| Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 3:51 am Post subject: |
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| Old fat expat wrote: |
Rockhard:
| Quote: |
| Our culture, our religion, our language, our beliefs might not be genetic, but they are imbued in us at such an early age by our family that it might as well be genetic. |
You seem happy to mix ontogeny and phylogeny and say they are the same thing. I think that is a lazy shortcut, but that's just me.
I see culture and belief systems as constructs aimed to help societies not have to re-invent the wheel with every generation. I think in the past these belief systems worked by providing a sense of being and place -an antidote to anomie.
But the world is changing, so the social conservatives wanting their Ozzie and Harriet paradise are no more likely to achieve that goal than are American Indians longing for their golden era, life on the prairie hunting buffalo.
The nuclear family you are romanticizing worked in an emerging post industrial state and was beneficial for some and I can see why many right-wingers yearn for a past that existed for the fortunate class.
Feminists do not see themselves as part of that fortunate class. In democratically organized societies they wanted the promise of equality and the right to self determination. Although parts of the feminist movement appear to have been co-opted by radicals with a Marxist influence, not all feminists see themselves as you appear to.
As societies have evolved and come under the influence of neo-liberal economics, efficiencies have become an important part of how societies organize themselves. America could not survive in the modern world with productivity from the 1950s, the golden era conservatives want to re-introduce.
To be efficient, societies must include all members. To be democratic, societies must include everyone equally. The golden era you want back has gone. Whaaaa! |
I have no idea what you are rattling on about. If feminism can't produce children it is a dead concept because it won't produce future generations. It's that simple. Anything else we say is moot. It will be just a dead a culture as the Aztecs. |
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Al Borland's Beard
Joined: 25 Aug 2013
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| Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 4:19 am Post subject: |
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| I have no idea what you are rattling on about. If feminism can't produce children it is a dead concept because it won't produce future generations. It's that simple. Anything else we say is moot. It will be just a dead a culture as the Aztecs. |
Yeah, because ideologies rely solely on genetics to live on. They're gonna be in real trouble once there's no more feminist babies. |
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Rockhard
Joined: 11 Dec 2013
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| Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 5:18 am Post subject: |
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| Al Borland's Beard wrote: |
| Quote: |
| I have no idea what you are rattling on about. If feminism can't produce children it is a dead concept because it won't produce future generations. It's that simple. Anything else we say is moot. It will be just a dead a culture as the Aztecs. |
Yeah, because ideologies rely solely on genetics to live on. They're gonna be in real trouble once there's no more feminist babies. |
Why is China the world's super power? Why is the Chinese language one of the most popular languages to learn these days? Why totalitarian capitalism making a come back these days?
Because China has 1.3 billion people.
Why was the US the world's super power? Why did English become a dominant language through out the world? Why did the US win world war 2 and get to impart their institutions on other countries?
Because they had more people than all of Europe combined.
Why did English culture take hold so firmly in Canada but have a minor effect on British India? They didn't displace the major religion. They didn't displace the local languages. They didn't change the culture much at all except to influence politics.
Because Canada was colonized with babies and India with guns.
Why is it that Italy is pre-dominantly Catholic and Greece is predominantly Othordox? If blood has nothing to do with it then ideas should freely flow between all peoples.
Because Catholics pass their beliefs onto their children who by and large imitate their parents. Catholic places stay Catholic. Orthodox places stay Orthodox, barring an influx of people from somewhere else.
Why is Spanish the dominant language and culture of South America?
Because the Spanish systematically eliminated the native population either through murder, disease, or intermarriage.
I think it's time you stopped being so childish and woke up to how the real world works. In the real world people rarely change their beliefs as they get older. In the real world numbers equals influence. In the real world cultures of thriving populations survive and cultures of dying populations die. |
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Al Borland's Beard
Joined: 25 Aug 2013
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| Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 6:07 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
Why is China the world's super power? Why is the Chinese language one of the most popular languages to learn these days? Why totalitarian capitalism making a come back these days?
Because China has 1.3 billion people.
Why was the US the world's super power? Why did English become a dominant language through out the world? Why did the US win world war 2 and get to impart their institutions on other countries?
Because they had more people than all of Europe combined.
Why did English culture take hold so firmly in Canada but have a minor effect on British India? They didn't displace the major religion. They didn't displace the local languages. They didn't change the culture much at all except to influence politics.
Because Canada was colonized with babies and India with guns.
Why is it that Italy is pre-dominantly Catholic and Greece is predominantly Othordox? If blood has nothing to do with it then ideas should freely flow between all peoples.
Because Catholics pass their beliefs onto their children who by and large imitate their parents. Catholic places stay Catholic. Orthodox places stay Orthodox, barring an influx of people from somewhere else.
Why is Spanish the dominant language and culture of South America?
Because the Spanish systematically eliminated the native population either through murder, disease, or intermarriage.
I think it's time you stopped being so childish and woke up to how the real world works. In the real world people rarely change their beliefs as they get older. In the real world numbers equals influence. In the real world cultures of thriving populations survive and cultures of dying populations die. |
Oh, please educate me on how the world works. This real world where nobody ever changes their beliefs and everyone just adopts the belief of their parents. Everything just keeps up with the status quo. Ever think that there other things out there besides our parents that influence our belief system? |
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Rockhard
Joined: 11 Dec 2013
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| Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 7:37 am Post subject: |
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| Al Borland's Beard wrote: |
| Quote: |
Why is China the world's super power? Why is the Chinese language one of the most popular languages to learn these days? Why totalitarian capitalism making a come back these days?
Because China has 1.3 billion people.
Why was the US the world's super power? Why did English become a dominant language through out the world? Why did the US win world war 2 and get to impart their institutions on other countries?
Because they had more people than all of Europe combined.
Why did English culture take hold so firmly in Canada but have a minor effect on British India? They didn't displace the major religion. They didn't displace the local languages. They didn't change the culture much at all except to influence politics.
Because Canada was colonized with babies and India with guns.
Why is it that Italy is pre-dominantly Catholic and Greece is predominantly Othordox? If blood has nothing to do with it then ideas should freely flow between all peoples.
Because Catholics pass their beliefs onto their children who by and large imitate their parents. Catholic places stay Catholic. Orthodox places stay Orthodox, barring an influx of people from somewhere else.
Why is Spanish the dominant language and culture of South America?
Because the Spanish systematically eliminated the native population either through murder, disease, or intermarriage.
I think it's time you stopped being so childish and woke up to how the real world works. In the real world people rarely change their beliefs as they get older. In the real world numbers equals influence. In the real world cultures of thriving populations survive and cultures of dying populations die. |
Oh, please educate me on how the world works. This real world where nobody ever changes their beliefs and everyone just adopts the belief of their parents. Everything just keeps up with the status quo. Ever think that there other things out there besides our parents that influence our belief system? |
Now you've got it. |
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