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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 9:28 am Post subject: Why is Joe Biden doing as poorly as Kucinich? |
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From what I read in the news, Joe Biden seems to know a thing or two about foreign policy. Since the Dems took control of Congress, he has been the Chair of the Foreign relations committee. None of that can be said about Rep. Kucinich. Why do the two of them poll about the same? Is there something about Biden that I'm missing?
Latest poll #s for Dem candidates |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 1:11 pm Post subject: |
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I'm surprised at this, too. I expected him to be a major player this time around.
Is it possible other people remember the scandal of 30 (?) years ago when he was caught cribbing a speech of Tony Blair's? If I remember correctly, he was running for pres then too, but crashed and burned because he was using a 'socialist' speech from an unknown TB. It was the first any of us had heard of that Blair guy. Who'd a thunk he'd turn out to be who he did? |
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cbclark4
Joined: 20 Aug 2006
Location: Masan
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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I think Joe's problem is
that he tends to come across as an "Angry Old Man".
Ralph Nader has this problem too.
The smile has no sincerity.
When pausing to think the face contorts to an angy face.
Look at the other Joe (Leiberman) he seems to be
smiling even when he's obviously angry.
Joe doesn't have the karma.
He is though in my opinion
one of the most qualified individuals in the race. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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He would run well in the general election against anyone.
But just as the Republicans have problems in the primaries for not being conservative , democrats face problems in the primaries for not being liberal enough. |
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Tiger Beer
Joined: 07 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 6:29 pm Post subject: |
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The media just doesn:t talk him up.
ROMNEY for example, why is he popular? For whatever reason, the media just talks him up all of the time. There is nothing that makes him stand out, and his Mormon background would generally make him irrelevant. But the media always brings up his name, and people hear about him, and then they say, finally someone new! |
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Rteacher
Joined: 23 May 2005
Location: Western MA, USA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 6:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Kucinich at least has a lot of anti-war, vegan, and UFO voters to draw from (probably enough to win it all if he had enough money to buy the nomination ... ) |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 7:02 pm Post subject: |
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He is though in my opinion
one of the most qualified individuals in the race.
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I think he is, too. Maybe Tiger Beer has a point--just not enough media attention, for whatever reason. It's too bad, actually. At the risk of sounding totally superficial, he looks presidential to me. |
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cbclark4
Joined: 20 Aug 2006
Location: Masan
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 7:12 pm Post subject: |
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I think he'd be unstoppable at the top of an independant ticket
with either McCain or Powell as a running mate. |
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Berghoff
Joined: 25 Oct 2007
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 1:11 am Post subject: |
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| cbclark4 wrote: |
I think Joe's problem is
that he tends to come across as an "Angry Old Man". |
There's something to this. Did you see the last Dem debates, on Oct. 30th? He debated quite well, and I even laughed when he brought up Rudy Giuliani. But still, there was something upsetting about him.
Really, he's probably just not doing as well because he's not funded and has not the national image the way the others do. Even Kucinich has a more recognizable reputation... He's run so many times, and all the ultra lefty dems love him. I kind of love him too, but only because he's so gosh darn adorable. Biden is white bread and really, he's not presented as being quite as progressive as the other front runners. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 10:49 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
Is it possible other people remember the scandal of 30 (?) years ago when he was caught cribbing a speech of Tony Blair's? If I remember correctly, he was running for pres then too, but crashed and burned because he was using a 'socialist' speech from an unknown TB. It was the first any of us had heard of that Blair guy. Who'd a thunk he'd turn out to be who he did?
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Actually, it was more like twenty years ago, and the politician was Neil Kinnock, then the leader of the British Labour Party. The speech was about how the politician was the first in his family to have gone to university, thanks to government support for the working class.
If Biden was stealing actual details from Kinnock's life, or stealing lines verbatim, I can see why that would be cause for him to drop out. But if his family history really was that similar to Kinnock's, I don't really see the problem with using the same general theme in his speech. Advertisers, politicans etc lift themes from each other all the time. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 10:54 am Post subject: |
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According to Wiki, Biden repeated the same speech with only minor modifications, but usually gave Kinnock credit for it. Except that he didn't the one time that it was recorded.
I wonder: does this mean that each time he gave the speech, Biden announced that he was about to quote an entire speech by another politician?
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1988
Main article: Joe Biden presidential campaign, 1988
In 1987, Joe Biden ran as a Democratic presidential candidate. When the campaign began, he was considered a frontrunner because of his moderate image. However, the campaign ended when he was accused of plagiarizing a speech by Neil Kinnock, then-leader of the British Labour Party. Though Biden had correctly credited the original author in all speeches but one, the one where he failed to make mention of the originator was caught on video. In the video Biden is filmed repeating a stump speech by Kinnock, with only minor modifications. �Why is it that Joe Biden is the first in his family ever to go a university? Why is it that my wife . . . is the first in her family to ever go to college? Is it because our fathers and mothers were not bright? . . . Is it because they didn't work hard? My ancestors who worked in the coal mines of northeast Pennsylvania and would come after 12 hours and play football for four hours? It's because they didn't have a platform on which to stand.� After Biden withdrew from the race it was learned that he had correctly credited Kinnock on all other occasions. He failed to do so, however, in the Iowa speech that was recorded and distributed to reporters (with a parallel video of Kinnock) by aides to Michael Dukakis, the eventual nominee. Dukakis fired John Sasso, his campaign manager and long-time Chief of Staff, but Biden's campaign could not recover.[19
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bluzusi
Joined: 29 Jul 2007
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 11:07 am Post subject: |
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| Biden is definitely my first choice among the Democratic candidates for President. As has been stated previously though he lacks the funding necessary to compete successfully in the primaries and is viewed as less progressive than other Democratic primary candidates. It is kind of disappointing because I think he has the skills to be an effective President. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 1:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Thanks for straightening that out, OTOH. So Neil Kinnock, not Tony Blair. |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 5:46 pm Post subject: |
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I mean how could you not vote for a man who has lines such as:
�I know you�re not supposed to answer questions, based on what I�ve heard [at the debates].�
Nytimes blog |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Joe Biden is running for VP. This is (partly) why he makes a big deal of being concilliatory with his colleagues, and polite to Hillary. |
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