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Mr. Pink
Joined: 21 Oct 2003 Location: China
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 5:54 am Post subject: |
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htrain wrote: |
Thanks for everyone's comments and opinions. I've come to terms with things and have established some long term goals. Over the next 5-10 years I'm going to focus on getting fatter, growing a beard, and getting older. I know it's going to be a tough road to travel, but it's best for my career. It will take a lot of dedication, but at the end of the tunnel I see that sparking 2.2 mil a month just waiting for me. It will all be worth it in the end! Wish me luck! |
Instead of being hell bent on university gigs, why not look to high schools? They shouldn't have to worry about you sleeping with the students there (and if they should, please leave Korea NOW). At 25 you have enough of an age difference from a high schooler that you can get some respect, but enough of an age gap that you can identify with some of them.
Most Korean university gigs are over-rated anyways. |
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Masta_Don
Joined: 17 Aug 2006 Location: Hyehwa-dong, Seoul
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 6:17 am Post subject: Re: Sorry, you're too young to work here. |
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[/quote]
Oh ho ho, where I come from it means to prostitute your girls, pimp out. Like, your group has a few girls that they keep around for kicks, and then for money, when it's needed. |
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htrain
Joined: 24 May 2007
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 6:18 am Post subject: Re: Sorry, you're too young to work here. |
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Oh ho ho, where I come from it means to prostitute your girls, pimp out. Like, your group has a few girls that they keep around for kicks, and then for money, when it's needed. |
You saw a certain movie called American Pimp by the Hughes Brothers... |
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freshking
Joined: 07 Dec 2006
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 7:35 am Post subject: |
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Unfortunately, this is a society where age is supremely important, especially in male to male relationships. I'm 30 but I look young. I taught an intensive course at my university last summer where the students were 24-27 years old. I could tell that a few of them thought they were older than me and the vibe was far different from the freshman courses I usually teach.
Anyway, the bottom line is that you can teach at a uni at 25, but if you look young you will be in for a bit of a power struggle with your older male students. If they want to be a-holes though, just let them know up front that they're going to fail from lack of participation. Then they can shape up or quit showing up. |
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Homer Guest
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 7:40 am Post subject: |
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htrain,
Sorry for your bad experience. As someone who works for a University (same one for a few years now) I can tell you that age does play a role. Not a dominant role but it comes into the hiring equation.
Your qualifications are decent but as pointed out not extraordinary (no offense intended). Experience in China is not widely recognized as very valid or valuable yet when it comes to university positions here.
There could be many other factors at play. How did they react to you? What are the hiring policies at the university? Requirements?
The age thing comes into play for administrators as it would be strange for some to have a teacher that is barely older than his students. This links up with credibility and the image of the university.
Anyway, I hope you find what you want here htrain. |
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bassexpander
Joined: 13 Sep 2007 Location: Someplace you'd rather be.
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 7:54 am Post subject: |
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Our uni flat-out refused a guy based on age. I was disappointed, but they just don't want people below 28 or so. Too close in age to the students.... a host of problems can result from this.
It happens at international companies here, too. I know someone working for a German company. She does hiring, and says they don't even consider a Masters Degree as a useful thing to someone who had no life experience between the BA and the MA. She made the statement that an MA is of more use to someone in their 30s. Interesting.
She also said that they only hire people within 6 months of graduation from their university (either 6 months before or after graduation). The other resumes, they just toss. Age doesn't matter to them so much, but they only want recent grads. |
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PRagic
Joined: 24 Feb 2006
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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You could try SNU's ELI (NOT the department job). They were looking for people who can teach content courses in Business or Engineering. Just a thought. |
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IlIlNine
Joined: 15 Jun 2005 Location: Gunpo, Gyonggi, SoKo
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:06 pm Post subject: |
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htrain wrote: |
IlIlNine wrote: |
Would a university in you home country hire you as a professor if you had adequate qualifications but were only 25? Probably not. |
Would a university in your home country hire 95% of the professors here? Probably not.
Would a university in your home country pay 2.2 mil won a month? Probably not. |
Perhaps community colleges would make a better comparison since it seems that most Korean universities are more similar to those than 'real' universities anyway. The average salary (average, not starting!) hovers around $40,000 a year in Canada. Factoring in deductions, a sarting salary of 2.2 mil seems like it's in the ballpark...
... and you're right, those same CCs would not hire 95% of the people who teach here at universties. That makes it easier to find a job here, which I personally see as a benefit.
You have the rest of your life ahead of you - plenty of time to do he uni thing here or elsewhere. Try a foreign language high school. They seem to be the next best thing. |
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htrain
Joined: 24 May 2007
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:22 pm Post subject: |
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Homer wrote: |
htrain,
Sorry for your bad experience. As someone who works for a University (same one for a few years now) I can tell you that age does play a role. Not a dominant role but it comes into the hiring equation.
Your qualifications are decent but as pointed out not extraordinary (no offense intended). Experience in China is not widely recognized as very valid or valuable yet when it comes to university positions here.
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Oh yeah... I fully and completely realize my qualifications are nowhere even close to a lot of your guys'. I don't dispute that at all and I know I've got a long way to go and a lot to learn. What irked me was the fact I was told I made it through the screening and have a good resume but I'm too young.
I would have much rather heard "Sorry, we found a more qualified applicant." I would have said ok I completely understand, my resume/experience aren't that hot. Even if the "more qualified" guy was "more qualified" simply because of age, just don't tell me the reason is because of something out of my control.
Anyway, if it bothers me that badly I can always go home... I'm not an indentured servant. |
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Bibbitybop
Joined: 22 Feb 2006 Location: Seoul
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:22 pm Post subject: |
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IlIlNine wrote: |
Would a university in you home country hire you as a professor if you had adequate qualifications but were only 25? Probably not. |
Hell yeah they would! If you had a PhD at 25 (or adequate credentials), U.S. universities would jump on that opportunity because they know the potential of the professor and his/her research that would excell the University's credentials.
I taught freshmen level courses at a public American university at the age of 24. |
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htrain
Joined: 24 May 2007
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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Bibbitybop wrote: |
IlIlNine wrote: |
Would a university in you home country hire you as a professor if you had adequate qualifications but were only 25? Probably not. |
Hell yeah they would! If you had a PhD at 25 (or adequate credentials), U.S. universities would jump on that opportunity because they know the potential of the professor and his/her research that would excell the University's credentials.
I taught freshmen level courses at a public American university at the age of 24. |
I was gonna mention graduate assistant teaching too, but I let it go. I taught Spanish my senior year in high school even... in the West we look at maturity but it's a different ball game here. Being older makes you more mature. In the past I've been quickly promoted in all my jobs because I have an intense work ethic and focus on my goals. In the military I was an e-4 at 19 years old and had to supervise 26, 27, 28 year old e-3s... did they like it? No. Did I care? Nope. Did the job get done quickly and efficiently? You bet your @$$ it did.
Last edited by htrain on Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:41 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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ajstew
Joined: 04 Feb 2004 Location: Korea
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:38 pm Post subject: it's possible |
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I wouldn't give up in your search here just yet. There will be about 20 more universities and colleges hiring in Korea before the end of this hiring period (on the job board). All it takes is one to give you a shot. I had an MA and one year at an institute teaching elementary and middle school, and sent out a ton of application packages after that first year. I didn't hear back from many and it became frustrating (asking you to have experience at the university level, and being unwilling to give you the chance to get that experience.) Then I got an interview for one and got the job out in a smaller town's university. I was 25 at interview time and 26 at hiring time. It is possible. |
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anyangoldboy
Joined: 28 Sep 2007
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:48 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah really you should be older than most of your students when teaching. 25 sounds ok for a university but when some of students might be 26 when they leave they might be older and they might find it harder to learn from you etc etc.
Sounds logical to me if someone says you are too young. |
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htrain
Joined: 24 May 2007
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 3:52 pm Post subject: |
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anyangoldboy wrote: |
Yeah really you should be older than most of your students when teaching. 25 sounds ok for a university but when some of students might be 26 when they leave they might be older and they might find it harder to learn from you etc etc.
Sounds logical to me if someone says you are too young. |
OK so where does the line get drawn? What if the answer had been "Hey your qualifications are good and you made it to the final selection, but the board rejected your app because you're black. As you know it's part of Korean culture that students just don't respect black people and we hope you understand." Maybe some of you will say that's extreme, but I think it's on the same level. I personally would not sit on a hiring board that rejects people based on age, race, creed, etc. I get asked on apps if I'm Christian too, that's a "QUALIFICATION." Come on, what does that have to do with my teaching ability. |
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mateomiguel
Joined: 16 May 2005
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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htrain wrote: |
anyangoldboy wrote: |
Yeah really you should be older than most of your students when teaching. 25 sounds ok for a university but when some of students might be 26 when they leave they might be older and they might find it harder to learn from you etc etc.
Sounds logical to me if someone says you are too young. |
OK so where does the line get drawn? What if the answer had been "Hey your qualifications are good and you made it to the final selection, but the board rejected your app because you're black. As you know it's part of Korean culture that students just don't respect black people and we hope you understand." Maybe some of you will say that's extreme, but I think it's on the same level. I personally would not sit on a hiring board that rejects people based on age, race, creed, etc. I get asked on apps if I'm Christian too, that's a "QUALIFICATION." Come on, what does that have to do with my teaching ability. |
uh, dude, that happens all the time. Black people routinely get rejected by schools here in Korea. |
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