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stillnotking
Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Location: Oregon, USA
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 Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 9:46 am Post subject: The ultimate in anti-Semitism |
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That'd be a literal belief in Christian eschatology:
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| A small minority of evangelical Christians have entered the Middle East political arena with some of the most un-Christian statements I have ever heard. . . . [Rev.] Hagee, a popular televangelist who leads the 18,000-member Cornerstone Church in San Antonio, ratcheted up his rhetoric this year with the publication of his book, "Jerusalem Countdown," in which he argues that a confrontation with Iran is a necessary precondition for Armageddon (which will mean the death of most Jews, in his eyes) and the Second Coming of Christ. In the best-selling book, Hagee insists that the United States must join Israel in a preemptive military strike against Iran to fulfill God's plan for both Israel and the West. |
So who is this Hagee nutball, and why should we care? I'll let Glenn Greenwald explain:
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One of this week's hysterical press scandals was that Minister Louis Farrakhan praised Barack Obama's candidacy even though Obama had previously denounced numerous Farrakhan remarks and the Obama campaign did nothing to seek out the Farrakhan praise. Nonetheless, Tim Russert demanded that Obama jump through multiple hoops to prove that he has no connection to -- and, in fact, "rejects" -- the ideas espoused by Farrakhan deemed to be radical and hateful.
Yesterday, though, the equally fringe, radical and hateful (at least) Rev. John Hagee -- a white evangelical who is the pastor of a sprawling "mega-church" in Texas -- enthusiastically endorsed John McCain. Did McCain have to jump through the same hoops which Russert and others set up for Obama and "denounce" Hagee's extremism and "reject" his support? No; quite the opposite. McCain said he was "very honored" to receive this endorsement and, when asked about some of Hagee's more twisted views, responded: "all I can tell you is that I am very proud to have Pastor John Hagee's support."
McCain's sainted supporter, Joe Lieberman, last year spoke to Hagee's group and lavished him with such obsequious praise that Lieberman actually compared Hagee, favorably, to Moses. Why is Louis Farrakhan deemed by our political establishment to be so radioactive as to not be fit for good company -- black candidates are required to repudiate his support even when they haven't sought it and denounce his views even when they've never advocated anything close to those views -- but John Hagee is a perfectly acceptable figure whom mainstream GOP politicians are free to court without any consequences or media objections? |
Good question, Glenn! I suppose it couldn't possibly be that Hagee is white and Farrakhan is black, or that Hagee is a Christian and Farrakhan a Moslem? |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 10:28 am Post subject: |
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I agree that it is a bit of a double-standard to condemn alleged Democrat equivocation on Farrakhan, while remaining silent about people like Hagee and the respected GOP power-broker Pat Robertson.
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In his book Robertson tries to convince readers that there is a secret international conspiracy of anti-Christian forces which manipulates both governments and financial markets in an effort to control all of humanity. The ultimate goal is a one-world government centered around the United Nations which will eventually be controlled by the Antichrist and leading to Armageddon.
Leading the cast of characters in betraying America to Satan are the usual suspects from centuries of conspiracy-mongering: Freemasons, the Illuminati, the Trilateral Commission, the Federal Reserve, mysterious "European bankers" (all Jewish, coincidentally?), and more. The anti-semitic undertones are not at all coincidental - many of his sources for his conspiracy ideas are virulently anti-semitic, and all Robertson did in some cases was repackage the anti-semitism in vague terminology.
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Okay, so Robertson doesn't come right out and say that it's Jews running the world, but let's be honest. Nobody who uses "Freemasons", "Illuminati", and "European bankers" in the same paragraph is talking about Methodists.
http://tinyurl.com/2zohaw |
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nicholas_chiasson
Joined: 14 Jun 2007
Location: Samcheok
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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| the gnomes of zurich are swiss. |
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Czarjorge
Joined: 01 May 2007
Location: I now have the same moustache, and it is glorious.
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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I had a brief love of Tom Robbins in High School. A few of his books are worth reading, and one "Skinny Legs and All" are interesting in light of this discussion.
In the novel a number of religious figures actively try to bring about Armageddon by attempting to destroy the Mosque on the Temple Mount. I couldn't find the reference but I read a few years ago of Bush's interaction with some Evangelicals would were suggesting the same thing. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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I want to nit-pick about the title. I think Adolf has a permanent corner on the 'ultimate' market in anti-Semitism.
There ought to be a way of taking away the right to vote from people who want to commit international suicide by attempting to bring on the end of the world.
PS: A 'brief love' of Tom Robbins? You cad! Your inconstant heart should be returned to the shop for repairs. TR is a literary god. |
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Czarjorge
Joined: 01 May 2007
Location: I now have the same moustache, and it is glorious.
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 3:52 pm Post subject: |
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I'm not sure I would agree that Tommy is a literary god. It is entertaining fiction, but its not as if he's knocking Dickens out of the pantheon. SLAA is the first novel I ever read with inanimate objects as characters.
I've been reading Cormac McCarthy and Nathanael West in the last few weeks. That's literary godhood. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 5:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
| I want to nit-pick about the title. I think Adolf has a permanent corner on the 'ultimate' market in anti-Semitism. |
Yup, I pretty much came into this thread to mention the same thing.
Notion strongly seconded. |
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stillnotking
Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Location: Oregon, USA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Kuros wrote: |
| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
| I want to nit-pick about the title. I think Adolf has a permanent corner on the 'ultimate' market in anti-Semitism. |
Yup, I pretty much came into this thread to mention the same thing.
Notion strongly seconded. |
I dunno, guys. Hitler killed six million Jews. The end-timers are trying to bring about an event that will, in their view, pretty much kill all of them. Not to mention the "eternal damnation" part.
In terms of actions, of course Hitler's the nadir. In terms of beliefs I'm not so sure. |
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mistermasan
Joined: 20 Sep 2007
Location: 10+ yrs on Dave's ESL cafe
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| Posted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 4:39 pm Post subject: |
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| anyone working/striving for the end times/armageddon/the rapture is a terrorist. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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Possibly still nit-picking...
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| pretty much kill all of them |
While that's true, to me anti-Anybody requires a good helping of hate and I don't see that in this movement. It looks to me like they consider it 'colateral damage' on the way to Paradise. 
I do agree with mistermasan about the terrorism. <<Ya-ta>> <-- me shuddering. |
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mistermasan
Joined: 20 Sep 2007
Location: 10+ yrs on Dave's ESL cafe
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| Posted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 5:48 pm Post subject: |
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IIRC, that is twice in one week. snap out of it...what...are you coming to your senses? 
so much terrorism is based in religion. the religion will create double standards: making a chosen people (of which it is OK to have double standards based upon faith) or supporting a caste system based upon faith (taxes for non-believers). from this age old tradition of "we are right and everyone else is wrong" it is not a far step to demonizing the other to the abusing the non-believer. remember, gandhi is burning in hell for all eternity because he was never baptized.
what is to be done with folks who see it as their god given right/duty/obligation to dispose of adherents of other belief systems? to what extent can religions of hate be tolereted in secular society? what is to be done with splinters/sects/factets of such religions actively working to acheive the end times/bring the world the to an end?
you show me a well organized terrorist organization and i'll show you a well organized religious organization. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 5:58 pm Post subject: |
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| what...are you coming to your senses? |
As they say, even a stopped clock (you) is right twice a day. 
But the point stands. People who actively seek the end of the world, and happen to live in a state armed to the teeth with weapons that can do it, are to be feared.
As far as I can tell, any religion or ism should be feared, whether it be Christianity, Marxism, free market capitalism, libertarianism... They all have 'sacred texts' that are not to be questioned and their most devout adherents insist the the KoolAid is good for health.
Indeed, what is to be done with them? |
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