Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee]

http://hotair.com/archives/2008/02/18/michelle-obama-hasnt-been-proud-of-america-in-at-least-26-years/


For the first time in my adult life, I am proud of my country,� she told a Milwaukee crowd today, �because it feels like hope is making a comeback.�

[jkelly80]

This could be a big problem. His crypto-liberalism begins to show.

[thepeel]

[mithridates]

I read a really good book for the first time this year.

(that doesn't mean I was unable to find a good book up until now)


That's besides the point though - even though I understand she's making stump speeches for her husband I think there should be a bit of lenience for spouses or family members, which would include Michelle Obama and Chelsea Clinton for example. With full-time politicians you can parse their speeches in endless ways to see what they really mean, and the slightest change in wording can mean a large change in policy but for others, not so much. Bill Clinton is the exception of course.

[Kuros]

I was going to say:

I have some sympathy for Obama. His wife said this. After all, we shouldn't pillory Hillary for Bill's shill.

But, of course, Bill Clinton is an exception. Care to explain this double standard, Mith?

[mithridates]

[Kuros]

[mithridates]

[Czarjorge]

I find it hilarious that this is the most critics of Obama can come up with to harp on. I question the reasonability of my fellow US citizens at times, but I don't think they're stupid enough to eat this poo.

[On the other hand]

[stillnotking]

[Kuros]

[Ya-ta Boy]

Only the 'My country, right or wrong' superpatriot crowd is going to pay attention to this one. But they will exploit it for all it's worth.

[mistermasan]

hmm...from killing of social leaders to vietnam to watergate to iran hostages there wasn't a whole lotta chest thumping growing up. throw in a few recessions, a gas crisis or two...and no we didn't have alot to write home about.

would you expect a black woman gto take pride in the regan era? it wasn't that great of a time to be a worker. reagan begat bush and a full fledged return to the war as an economic weapon.

i woulda guessed mrs.obama woulda enjoyed the clinton years but maybe she didn't like how for many years the administration was bogged down (impeached for oral sex!) due to partisan bickering.black hawk down.bombing other countries to change the news cycle stateside. the worst "say one thing and do something else" around. clinton gave way to bush. what has happened inthe bush years to fill us with pride?

i was raised roman catholic. in that world view, "pride" is one of the "deadly sins" and something to be avoided. nothing good comes from pride. nowthat i have grown up and recognized that atheism is the only logical route the idea that pride is deadly has yet to be refuted. avoid pride. avoid those who tell you to be proud. it is a cheap concept. be strong. be secure in who you are. don't buy into pride.

and now that she is telling us she is "proud"? well, we are the words we use.

[stillnotking]

Here's the truly interesting question: is it proper (or moral, or patriotic, or acceptable, or what-have-you) to be less proud of one's country when it is taking action of which one severely disapproves?

For example, if one believes that it is immoral to torture another human being under any circumstances, is it "patriotic" to continue to be "proud of one's country" while it tortures?

Most of the comments I'm hearing from the Right on this issue seem to carry the assumption that it is always unpatriotic and bad to say "I'm not proud of America right now". I strongly dispute that point of view, and moreover I consider it morally indefensible. (Or, if one postulates a dimension of "national pride" that is utterly divorced from the actual nation in question, logically indefensible.)