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garykasparov
Joined: 27 May 2007
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 Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 2:54 pm Post subject: Customers Are Not Always Right in Banking Practices |
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The Korea Times
Customers Are Not Always Right in Banking Practices
Bank of Korea
Luis Riestra, CEO of Wise and Wealthy, has put together a five-part series to educate foreigners on getting their banking needs met while residing in South Korea. This is the second part of the series. ― ED.
By Luis Riestra
Contributing Writer
Bilateral Action
Once in a while, a number of banks will come up with isolated yet useful initiatives. Catch the wave and ride it.
It's highly probable that banks handing out international ATM cards to foreigners will stop doing so at some point in the near future and deem the strategy a failure based on low numbers unless they see a huge surge in expats opening accounts.
When this happens, it will be difficult for the bank to take your card and it will most probably take a while to block it from overseas use.
If you work with a relatively cohesive group of teachers, diplomats, corporate staff, and you all share similar views on the humiliating attitude of bank staff toward non-Koreans, you are in a good position to lead change by staging a group walk-out.
It's not reasonable to say that everyone in the team must be eligible for a house loan, but it is fairly acceptable to encourage your colleagues to switch to a bank where you received good treatment, and let both banks know of your intentions; let your ``bad'' bank know you and your friends are moving to a new bank with better treatment and let the new bank know ``We're all here because you treat this person well and we expect similar treatment.''
You'll be amazed at what banks are willing to do when they see birds of the same feather flocking away together. The strength of this idea resides in the unity; we can lead and promote change under a united and firm attitude.
Working as single individuals we pose a weak threat to service suppliers and no change will be inspired.
The customer is not always right: Each country operates a series of domestic banking practices and a number of global ones. Despite the fact Korea aims at becoming a financial hub, it's still, for many practical purposes, an isolated island, with few managerial practices similar to the rest of the world.
It's not assertive to approach a bank here requesting services that simply don't exist or are set in the way they are for the Korean population, just because you use them back in your country.
For example, the fact that joint-accounts are not popular in Korea and that many foreigners complain about this being so is not about to propel changes as this is a reality the whole Korean population is subject to.
Foreigners not getting international ATM cards versus Koreans having them is a brutal fault of the system. If there is a service Koreans can obtain, it must become available to foreigners at all banks. Only this principle can help set the pace of a new banking era.
You are encouraged to fill out the Foreigners' Retail Banking Survey, which can be accessed through www.korea4expats.com
You can submit as much information as you wish and leave an email address (optional) if you wish to obtain a USB memory device as a gift (limited quantities, to be issued in April).
The writer can be reached at [email protected] |
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GoldMember
Joined: 24 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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This whole thing is a huge exercise in futility.
Fact is you are not Korean therefore you are different. Period.
Non Korean: Hello I need____________ (insert service that all Koreans get)
Korean (thinking): Mmmm this person doesn't look Korean, therefore for that reason and that reason alone they can't have ___________(insert service).
On top of that there is the us versus them mentality. Foreigners send money OUT of Korea.
This attitude will continue indefinitly whilst the education system continues to promote racism and nationalism.
Not an anti Korean rant, just that's the way it is. Period. |
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Bibbitybop
Joined: 22 Feb 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/opinon/2008/02/197_3908.html
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One Reason Why Korea is Not the �Hub of Asia�
By J. Scott Burgeson
Last year I worked my butt off at Hongik University writing my latest book, and hadn't had a real vacation in over two years. So I decided to spend a month in Northeast China in February during the winter break, doing a little research on the ethnic Korean areas there but mostly just having fun.
Of course, one requires money to travel and have fun, so in late January I visited my local branch of Hana Bank in Jongno to apply for an international cash card (alternately known as an int'l debit or ATM card), in order to access my account there from abroad. I don't have or want a credit card, and certainly didn't want to travel around for a month carrying all of my money on me. I also knew that since I was going to be in China until the end of February, and my university wires my salary into my account on the 25th of every month, I might need to use some of my pay from February in case I emptied out my account before then.
I was a little worried about whether or not Hana would give me an international cash card, since for the past two years I had heard countless stories and complaints from local expats about how Korean banks had suddenly stopped issuing international cash cards to resident foreigners here. Even worse, many expats who had been given international cash cards from Korean banks in the past were finding that they now didn't work overseas, or were denied replacement when they were lost, damaged or reached their expiration date. No one was quite sure why Korean banks had decided to enforce this new policy, but it was clear that many foreigners here were very ticked off about it.
To my relief, however, the nice young lady at Hana processed my application without a hitch, and told me with a cheerful smile that my new international cash card would be mailed to me in a few days. It was still unclear why so many other foreigners were being denied international bankcards, but being a typically self-absorbed expat I wasn't about to complain since I had gotten exactly what I needed.
Or so I thought. Two days later, I received a call from the same teller. ``I'm sorry,'' she said, ``but we won't be able to send you an international cash card.''
``Why not?'' I asked, already sensing what the answer would be.
``Because foreigners aren't allowed to receive them.''
I couldn't understand why she hadn't known this when I'd first come in to apply, and went back to see the manager the next day. He was most apologetic and even offered me a cup of green tea, but when I asked where this discriminatory policy had originated from, he was unable to answer and simply kept repeating, ``I'm sorry.''
I was sorry, too, and told him before leaving, ``You know, I'm a respected instructor at a well-known Korean university. I think I have a right to access the money I've earned here legally, don't you? Isn't this the era of globalization that Koreans are always talking about?''
He agreed, which was nice to hear, but his sympathy wasn't going to be very helpful during my travels in China. In the end, I had to withdraw my last 2 million won using my domestic cash card, and exchanged it all for travelers checks that were often a pain to cash in provincial China, especially since I was traveling during the Lunar New Year when many banks and businesses there were closed for the long holiday.
Still, that was nothing compared to nearly getting fired because I was without an international cash card on my trip. When I had purchased my open-ended, round-trip ferry ticket in Korea, the clerk had neglected to tell me that they would be suspending service for two weeks for repairs during and after the Lunar New Year period. As a result, I spent the last week of February in the border town of Dandong thoroughly stressed out because I was almost out of money and the soonest ferry back to Incheon arrived on the morning of March 2, the first day of the new semester, and my first class started at 1pm that same day.
Even worse, I was unable to call the ferry company to make a reservation because it was closed throughout the holiday and repair period. It wasn't hard to imagine the ferry being fully booked after a two-week hiatus, which indeed turned out to be the case.
I would have much preferred just to buy a cheap airline ticket back to Korea rather than cutting things so close, but of course I was unable access my Hana account which had been replenished on the 25th. While I'm happy to say that I did in fact make it back to Korea in time after much high drama, I cannot say that I have especially fond memories of my last week in China.
Since I again plan to travel abroad this summer, I recently visited half a dozen local banks in Jongno inquiring if I could receive an international cash card from any of them, but Kookmin, Korea Exchange Bank (KEB), Woori, Shinhan and Standard Chartered First Bank of Korea all told me that they were no longer issuing such cards to their foreign customers.
When I asked why not, some of them didn't know, some said it was because of their own internal policy, and some said it was because of government regulations on foreign currency exchange. One teller even told me, ``It's because we think that foreigners in Korea only need to use a Korean bank while they're in Korea!''
Surprisingly, though, Nonghyup said it would be no problem for me to receive an international cash card, and even more bizarrely, the Ulchiro-1-ga branch of Hana told me that I could get an international cash card right away. I admit that I was skeptical at first given my previous experience with them, but sure enough, I had one in my hands within 5 minutes. It reads, ``Hana International Debit Card'' and works with the global ``Plus'' network. Amazing, but also incredibly strange!
I was so confused by all of this that I called up the Ministry of Finance and Economy, to see if there was really some sort of government restriction against issuing international cash cards to foreign residents in Korea. The official I spoke with, however, was just as baffled by the situation as I was.
``There is no government policy preventing foreign residents from receiving international bank cards,'' he said. ``The banks either misunderstand our policy, or it's just their excuse.'' Meanwhile, officials at the local banking industry's Financial Supervisory Service could tell me nothing more concrete, beyond the by now largely ritualistic expression, ``As a Korean, I'm sorry.''
The moral of this story? It is clear that many Korean banks are either inept, since they are incorrectly interpreting government-made banking regulations, or else they are outright discriminatory towards their foreign customers. Either way, there are hundreds of thousands of expats here with legitimate and often unmet banking needs who cannot help but roll their eyes when they hear of South Korea's oft-expressed desire to become a so-called ``Hub of Asia.'' Indeed, I'm sure many of them feel that Korea is only a ``Hub of Korea'' and not much else.
When I discuss this problem with my expat friends in Singapore, Beijing, Bangkok, Kyoto, Sydney and San Francisco, all of them resident foreigners with international cash cards from local banks, they often just laugh or shake their heads in disbelief. My Canadian friend Doug, a former colleague at Hongik who recently relocated to Beijing, was stranded in Bangkok last year without any money after his KEB ``international'' cash card failed to work, and had so many problems with Korean banks over the years that he now likes to say of his Korean experience, ``I voted with my feet.'' Then there is my American friend Dave, a long-term expat in China with many years of experience in the travel industry there, who simply asks, ``What the hell is Korea thinking?''
It's something I'd like to know myself!
J. Scott Burgeson is the author of ``Korea Consumer Report�� (Galleon, 2007) and ``Korea Bug�� (Eunhaeng Namu, 2005). www.kingbaeksu.com. |
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Young FRANKenstein
Joined: 02 Oct 2006
Location: Castle Frankenstein (that's FRONKensteen)
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:07 pm Post subject: Re: Customers Are Not Always Right in Banking Practices |
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| garykasparov wrote: |
| Luis Riestra, ... |
This is as far as I got then stopped reading... I don't trust this guy farther than I can throw him. Did he become the CEO of his company by using the money he scammed from the TESL International program he ran? |
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taobenli
Joined: 26 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Reading about this banking stuff is more and more depressing to me. I have a question- I'll be going to Korea for fieldwork in about a year, and my husband will probably teach English there. He has a USAA account (he's not military, but his dad once was). Can we just keep it when we're working in Korea and do all our banking through them, so we don't have to deal with this crap? |
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Underwaterbob
Joined: 08 Jan 2005
Location: In Cognito
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:25 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm sick of people complaining about not having the same rights as a Korean here. YOU ARE NOT A KOREAN! Do temporary residents in your home country have the same rights as you do there? NO! Get over it already. |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:31 pm Post subject: Re: Customers Are Not Always Right in Banking Practices |
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| Quote: |
| unless they see a huge surge in expats opening accounts. |
The dude's obviously on crack. Don't we all have accounts here already? Why can't the banks take care of their current customers, all of their current customers, correctly in the first place?
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| When this happens, it will be difficult for the bank to take your card and it will most probably take a while to block it from overseas use. |
 Again, the dude's obviously on crack. The banks have had no problems whatsoever with, as an article in one newspaper put it, making up laws to restrict services for their foreign customers.
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| If you work with a relatively cohesive group of teachers, diplomats, corporate staff, and you all share similar views on the humiliating attitude of bank staff toward non-Koreans, you are in a good position to lead change by staging a group walk-out. |
It's a nice suggestion, I suppose. But the catch is that the banks know we must use them to transfer our money out of the country. We are at their mercy. It's not like there are non-Korean banks here. And don't be fooled for a minute by a local bank having a foreign name. It's still a bank in Korea and the teller staff and local management are all Korean.
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| It's not reasonable to say that everyone in the team must be eligible for a house loan, |
Evidently, though, in Korea it's perfectly acceptable for the banks to say that everyone in "the team" is ineligible for services just because "the team" is foreigners.
| Quote: |
| but it is fairly acceptable to encourage your colleagues to switch to a bank where you received good treatment, and let both banks know of your intentions; let your ``bad'' bank know you and your friends are moving to a new bank with better treatment and let the new bank know ``We're all here because you treat this person well and we expect similar treatment.'' |
The "bad bank" staff will laugh because they don't care about the foreigner. And they already know that, more likely than not, the "good bank" doesn't exist yet.
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| You'll be amazed at what banks are willing to do when they see birds of the same feather flocking away together. |
I'll be amazed when I see the government punishing service-providers, including banks, for blatant discrimination. |
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RACETRAITOR
Joined: 24 Oct 2005
Location: Seoul, South Korea
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:32 pm Post subject: |
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I was once not allowed to pay a bill, I think for the Internet, at my old bank. I had everything ready--bill, ARC card, passport, the money, and my bank card. After ten minutes of trying to give the teller money, the security guard (apparently the only one who knew any English) came over and told me "We can't let you pay this, because we don't think this bill yours." I showed them where my name was on the bill, and on my ID. Identical.
So I gave the bill to my wife (then girlfriend). She brought the bill to a different bank, where they took her money and processed the payment as received. It wasn't even her bill, so why were they being picky about letting me pay my bill? |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Underwaterbob wrote: |
| I'm sick of people complaining about not having the same rights as a Korean here. YOU ARE NOT A KOREAN! Do temporary residents in your home country have the same rights as you do there? NO! Get over it already. |
Actually, yes, they do. They have a right to not suffer illegal discrimination. |
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Bibbitybop
Joined: 22 Feb 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:35 pm Post subject: |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
| Underwaterbob wrote: |
| I'm sick of people complaining about not having the same rights as a Korean here. YOU ARE NOT A KOREAN! Do temporary residents in your home country have the same rights as you do there? NO! Get over it already. |
Actually, yes, they do. They have a right to not suffer illegal discrimination. |
Exactly. Should we, or immigrants of any country, not fight for equal rights, especially when it comes to the free use and access of our legally earned money? |
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nebraska1
Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Location: Judge, Some people just need killin!
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Underwaterbob wrote: |
| I'm sick of people complaining about not having the same rights as a Korean here. YOU ARE NOT A KOREAN! Do temporary residents in your home country have the same rights as you do there? NO! Get over it already. |
If they have a job and ssn number they can get a bank account, credit card and international ATM.
I worked in a bank in a Midwestern state what had a lot of immigrants with varying status. Some long term some not. If they had a job and ssn# (not even a green card) we were allowed to open a checking account for them, give them a debit card (with visa logo and could be used in most countries) and ATM card. Not only that but the bank would send them offers for credit cards because they had no bad credit and you have good credit till you screw up.
So in the USA it is pretty easy to get a bank account. And I am not going to get over it. I LIVE HERE. I am not temporary. I am married to KOREAN national. I went to open a bank account recently (I moved and I wanted to bank across the street from where I worked) and was told sorry not only are we not going to give an international ATM card we aren't going to allow you ATM access to your money for 3 months.
I would have to go to the bank and see a teller for them to give access to MY OWN FREAKING MONEY and too bad if I have an emergency on a weekend because for 3 months I can only access MY MONEY if I see a teller.
Global my a$$.
N1 |
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laogaiguk
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:50 pm Post subject: |
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| I was gonna say the same things to underwaterbob, but enough people did it for me. Take that. |
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mrsquirrel
Joined: 13 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Underwaterbob wrote: |
| I'm sick of people complaining about not having the same rights as a Korean here. YOU ARE NOT A KOREAN! Do temporary residents in your home country have the same rights as you do there? NO! Get over it already. |
Not as easy as people make out to open an bank account in the UK.
The missus and I went to open a joint account when we were back.
Since my postal address is my folks place I had to get the old man to write a letter confirming that when in the UK she resides there and show his housing tax bill.
Since september 11th it's got a bit more difficult. |
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articulate_ink
Joined: 23 Mar 2004
Location: Left Korea in 2008. Hong Kong now.
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 9:10 pm Post subject: |
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| taobenli wrote: |
| Reading about this banking stuff is more and more depressing to me. I have a question- I'll be going to Korea for fieldwork in about a year, and my husband will probably teach English there. He has a USAA account (he's not military, but his dad once was). Can we just keep it when we're working in Korea and do all our banking through them, so we don't have to deal with this crap? |
Yes, by all means keep USAA. They make international banking very, very easy... almost the polar opposite of K-banking in every way. It won't hurt to have a local account for sending remittances and avoiding any international transaction charges USAA may have imposed since I last did business with them. Standard Chartered for the international ATM card and KEB for relatively expat-friendly banking services. Set up your accounts in Itaewon or COEX and you ought to be fine (relatively speaking). |
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articulate_ink
Joined: 23 Mar 2004
Location: Left Korea in 2008. Hong Kong now.
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Underwaterbob wrote: |
| I'm sick of people complaining about not having the same rights as a Korean here. YOU ARE NOT A KOREAN! Do temporary residents in your home country have the same rights as you do there? NO! Get over it already. |
What an intensely stupid thing to say. Having access to your own money when and where you need it is not a special right or privilege. As I said in another post and have said before, this isn't just a matter of discrimination, it's a potential safety issue. People are complaining, and I'm one of the loudest, because this is a serious problem. If you don't see that, you probably aren't cut out for being an expat. |
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