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Fat_Elvis
Joined: 17 Aug 2006
Location: In the ghetto
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 Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 12:15 am Post subject: Why is there a teacher shortage? |
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That might seem like a stupid question to some, but as someone who's having a very difficult time recruiting right now, I'd like to know what others think.
Also, what do you think the solution is? Just higher salaries, changing visa regulations or something else? |
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IncognitoHFX
Joined: 06 May 2007
Location: Yeongtong, Suwon
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 12:34 am Post subject: |
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A lot of key Dave's members made a big stink and left a few months ago when the regulations started hitting.
They said it was because of the new Visa regulations. But once they were put in place, they didn't seem to be that bad, yet a lot of people still left.
Which makes logical people jump to the conclusion that a whole whack of people (including here on Dave's) had fake degrees and criminal records. A lot of those people had to go home as there was a bigger chance they would get caught.
I think the percentage of illegal teachers has always been underestimated, and when you clench down on teachers as a whole, a lot of them are going to leave in fear of getting caught. |
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PRagic
Joined: 24 Feb 2006
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 12:40 am Post subject: |
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For what it's worth, I recall reading some things about the new generation of college grads. Even the American corporate machine is having a tough time recruiting and keeping them happy. Why?
Seemingly, they're more interested in personal 'quality of life' issues than the pursuit of the almighty buck. They've grown up playing on teams where nobody keeps score, and where emotional qualities rank equal with the traditional value of the I.Q. Work overtime? But I have a squash game at 5:00 and my book club meets on weekends! I quit!
So whereas Korea was extremely attractive only 5 or 10 years ago, and still is to a minimally older, more money oriented set, it may be less so these days to newer grads. Salaries here are on par with those in Japan, but you can save more here. Korea is not an easy place to live, though, nor does it hold any mystery for those seeking life-fulfilling adventure. With jobs now available in China and Vietnam, and, yes, even Thailand, places that hold more cultural allure, new grads might be chosing other options than Korea and the higher salaries to be had here.
Who knows, really. Plus, it seems that there are three recruiters for every recruit, and very few of them hold any sway in the market. Using recruiters is a necessity for most looking for their first job in Korea, but recruiter services generally stop the minute they get payed, despite the lip service provided to the contrary. And the fact remains that Korean educational institutions and managers, either because they are unprepared to handle the necessities of employing a foreigner, or because they are simply immoral, have a remarkably bad track record in the employee satisfaction category. |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 12:53 am Post subject: |
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Even those of us who are legal have given up on the crap from immigration. I am another one who will be leaving at the end of this contract (and I went through the crud to renew this spring).
Having had to verify then certify my degree, present my transcripts then go to the trouble of getting "official, sealed transcripts", the march down to immigration 2 years ago to verify everything and now the crap again this spring...
I have danced through all their hoops for years and they still don't know their butt from a hole in the ground.
Add to that the falling wages due to economic problems.... (I was earning 2500 CAD back in 2002) and now, with a 30% increase in my gross salary since then I now take home about 2400.
Add in the problems fighting for wages, overtime, pension, severance and medical.... then problems with plane tickets and crap housing....
Korea is just NOT worth the trouble....
ESL is a massive growth industry and there are lots of greener pastures with less BS to step in on the way through.
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jackdaniels
Joined: 13 Feb 2008
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 1:09 am Post subject: shortage |
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| The new rules are crap! |
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xtchr
Joined: 23 Nov 2004
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 1:50 am Post subject: |
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As per Ttompatz, plus;
7 days vacation a semester is really crap (I know some public school teachers get more, but my V.Ps/Supervisors have always been strict 'by the contract' people).
It is really annoying to get all sorts of bollocks 'keep-the-foreigner-busy-work', like 3 hours of camp in the morning for 3 weeks. Yes, it's easy, but I can't actually go anywhere or do anything during that time. Just get it over and done with within the one week or 10 days and give me the remainder as completely free time. |
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Mr. BlackCat
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Location: Insert witty remark HERE
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 2:03 am Post subject: |
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IncognitoHFX wrote:
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| A lot of key Dave's members made a big stink and left a few months ago when the regulations started hitting |
Well, the shortage existed well before the new regs came into place. I don't know the numbers, but maybe there are even less candidates now.
PRagic wrote:
For what it's worth, I recall reading some things about the new generation of college grads. Even the American corporate machine is having a tough time recruiting and keeping them happy. Why?
Seemingly, they're more interested in personal 'quality of life' issues than the pursuit of the almighty buck. They've grown up playing on teams where nobody keeps score, and where emotional qualities rank equal with the traditional value of the I.Q. Work overtime? But I have a squash game at 5:00 and my book club meets on weekends! I quit!
Is this a bad thing? People caring more about their quality of life over making lots of money? Besides, generations have been calling their younger counterparts lazy and unmotivated for centuries. You think our parents think we're hard workers compared to them? I played sports where no official score was kept and my school gave us 'opinions' rather than grades. I'm still a hard worker, mostly because I have to be financially. If I had a choice, and could choose to work for a survival wage in SE Asia or Eastern Europe, I would be on the next flight.
Besides, I doubt anyone has ever come to Korea looking to enhance their quality of life, so I don't think that's a new thing.
I see the shortage as a result of many things. Other markets are becoming more competitive. Korea's reputation as...ummm...not the most honest employers (trying really hard to be diplomatic) is getting around with more ex-teachers going home or to another country. Korea seems to be getting more restrictive and xenophobic, not less. Like someone else mentioned, the currency markets are hurting those of us who have to send a good chunk home routinely.
Personally, I've been here for over 2 years now because of; 1) the people I met here, who are all leaving in droves it seems now. 2) The opportunity to travel around Asia, but with fuel and airfare prices skyrocketting, this is becoming more and more limited. 3) The money was alright for the amount of work expected. I was making somewhere around the same back home, but I hated my job. But now that I seem to be losing 5% everytime I go to wire money home, this is becoming less of a positive.
Add to this the ridiculous xenophobia and constant bending of truths here by everyone I meet and you get yet another teacher looking for greener pastures in the near future.[/i][/quote] |
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PRagic
Joined: 24 Feb 2006
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 3:19 am Post subject: |
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| Never said it was a bad thing to want more out of life. I agree with you! |
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creesschaef
Joined: 18 Jun 2007
Location: Gyeonggi-do
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 3:43 am Post subject: |
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| xtchr wrote: |
As per Ttompatz, plus;
7 days vacation a semester is really crap (I know some public school teachers get more, but my V.Ps/Supervisors have always been strict 'by the contract' people).
It is really annoying to get all sorts of bollocks 'keep-the-foreigner-busy-work', like 3 hours of camp in the morning for 3 weeks. Yes, it's easy, but I can't actually go anywhere or do anything during that time. Just get it over and done with within the one week or 10 days and give me the remainder as completely free time. |
I agree 100%. My school works me to the maximum allowed by the contract. If there is anything that they can think of for me to do, they make sure they squeeze it in, if humanly possible. There are other teachers, in the same city, who seem to get a better throw. When everything is left to the principal's discretion, nothing is straight up and honest. I'm sick of teaching camps for most of the vacation, for half days, then using the rest of the days as seat warmers.
There is no way anyone can tell me that the system in place right now is close to acceptable. I have had to verify my degree, in triplicate, over the last year. It isn't going to get better in the future, I fear. I have no problem providing my sealed transcripts, a health check, and a criminal background check, but I do have a problem with submitting them more than once a year, if remaining at the same school. There is no reason why we should have to submit our transcripts and criminal background check more than once in a lifetime.
The above is all in relation to the working conditions, but there are several other factors that play a part as well. The troubles one has to go through at the bank and cell phone companies could drive a person insane. I have been told, by too many company reps bank employess, that foreigners aren't allowed access to plan cell phones, debit cards, credit cards, and extended services at the bank.
The bottom line is, I am made to feel like a crook for setting foot in this country. They don't believe my transcripts the first, second, or third time the receive them. They think of me as an extra thing (seat warmer), not as person. They make up rules and regulations, at their convenience, to make simple, everyday tasks far from easy (banks and cell phone companies). |
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Join Me
Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 4:19 am Post subject: |
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Since the new regulations came into effect several people (both current and new instructors) have told me it is too much of a hassle to endure. Call your embassy and you get one answer...call anyone in any Korean ministry and you get the opposite answer. It is typical Korea times 10. I renewed just before the deadline and I am glad I did. It has been 3 or 4 months now since the new regulations went into effect and it is as bad as the first day. Why would anyone go through this unless they really wanted to be here?
Actually I think it is a good thing though. People get much more insight now into the half assed way things are done in Korea before they get off the plane. Pretty hard to fool people these days with the headaches you have to go though before you even arrive in Korea.
Last edited by Join Me on Mon Jun 16, 2008 4:34 am; edited 1 time in total |
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boogiet
Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 4:27 am Post subject: |
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| Offhand I'd say it's the regulations (which are even harder if you are traveling around as many do after a contract comes up) and the fact that wages don't add up to what they did even two years ago when I first went to work in Korea. |
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ytuque
Joined: 29 Jan 2008
Location: I drink therefore I am!
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 4:56 am Post subject: |
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I think China is absorbing a lot of teachers that would have came to Korea. Salaries in China are climbing rapidly, and the Chinese authorities aren't looking to bust foreigner teachers for private lessons. There are many opportunities besides teaching as well.
This might offend some, but I know a number of teachers who went to China versus Korea because of language, culture, and even cuisine. If I were giving advice to a young 20-something, I would say go to China.
The Chinese currency is appreciating against most currencies whereas the Korean currency is depreciating as most of you know. The Chinese economy is also growing much faster than Korea's. These two things will close the pay gap over time. In the meantime, you could supplement a Chinese teaching job with privates while enjoying a lower cost of living. |
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crusher_of_heads
Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Location: kimbop and kimchi for kimberly!!!!
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 5:02 am Post subject: |
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There is a lot of mental retardation in the daily life of Koreans, and it is not culture differences.
Immigration, purposefully keeping the won down, rampant xenophobia-and don't forget the spitting and adjosshi beating his wife. |
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reimund
Joined: 01 Oct 2007
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 5:10 am Post subject: |
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| creesschaef wrote: |
| xtchr wrote: |
As per Ttompatz, plus;
7 days vacation a semester is really crap (I know some public school teachers get more, but my V.Ps/Supervisors have always been strict 'by the contract' people).
It is really annoying to get all sorts of bollocks 'keep-the-foreigner-busy-work', like 3 hours of camp in the morning for 3 weeks. Yes, it's easy, but I can't actually go anywhere or do anything during that time. Just get it over and done with within the one week or 10 days and give me the remainder as completely free time. |
I agree 100%. My school works me to the maximum allowed by the contract. If there is anything that they can think of for me to do, they make sure they squeeze it in, if humanly possible. There are other teachers, in the same city, who seem to get a better throw. When everything is left to the principal's discretion, nothing is straight up and honest. I'm sick of teaching camps for most of the vacation, for half days, then using the rest of the days as seat warmers.
There is no way anyone can tell me that the system in place right now is close to acceptable. I have had to verify my degree, in triplicate, over the last year. It isn't going to get better in the future, I fear. I have no problem providing my sealed transcripts, a health check, and a criminal background check, but I do have a problem with submitting them more than once a year, if remaining at the same school. There is no reason why we should have to submit our transcripts and criminal background check more than once in a lifetime.
The above is all in relation to the working conditions, but there are several other factors that play a part as well. The troubles one has to go through at the bank and cell phone companies could drive a person insane. I have been told, by too many company reps bank employess, that foreigners aren't allowed access to plan cell phones, debit cards, credit cards, and extended services at the bank.
The bottom line is, I am made to feel like a crook for setting foot in this country. They don't believe my transcripts the first, second, or third time the receive them. They think of me as an extra thing (seat warmer), not as person. They make up rules and regulations, at their convenience, to make simple, everyday tasks far from easy (banks and cell phone companies). |
You bring up a lot of interesting points. The impression I'm getting of the ESL industry in Korea is that they only care about the English, and none whatsoever about the people who are supplying it. It's perfectly fitting, given the usual ajjushee/ajumas' blatant sense of entitlement, and the resulting hypocrisy from it. They think they are just owed a good English education without actually needing to care for the teachers at all. And when the teachers complain, the management/authorities use the old "cultural differences" stand by and tell the foreigners to just deal with it. And they conveniently forget that the teachers flew from thousands of miles away to provide them the services they need!
Last edited by reimund on Mon Jun 16, 2008 5:15 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 5:14 am Post subject: |
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| There has been a teacher shortage as long as I've been around. The demand for teachers has continued to increase over the years. It's pretty difficult to say if the shortage is any worse now or not. In addition, the new regulations may be having an effect. It's too soon to know. |
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