Korean Job Discussion Forums

[busan_boy2000]

I want to know what kind of hours everyone puts in for prep - mainly those doing the standard hagwon job.

Contracts generally, mine inc. are usaually around 30 hrs wk/120 month. Plus we have the classes that are just 40-50 min. long to consider along with the vague language in the contracts that leave this open again to interpretation (that of the school dictator in 99% of cases).

But once I add this all up I am doing about 40 hrs a week (160month) when I include prep. Now class wise - I only have about 20-25 - 40min classes a week. Thus ample time to prepare by coming in an 1 hour before school starts in the afternoon - not to mention that majority of classes have a cirriculum (if you can call it that - but thats for another thread) that I follow and the rest are free talking (another thread too).

But my boss insists that I come in at 1:15 and stay til' 9 each night. One night I go til 10 (whatever) and have no dinner break (although the boss says every other day that he will fix this in shedule. But so far the bi-weekly shedule changes have yet to include a dinner break...anyway. And the kicker I hate is that on Sunday (my weekend is Fri/Sat) I have to go to work (ok fair...my job is 5 days a week after all) but sit thier for 8hrs. and only teach 2 privates to his 2 children. So over 6hrs. with nothing to do (after planning my lessons for the upcoming week).

So others - tell about your experience with your hours - as I consider prep time (past a point - as I described) to be work. I think I should be paid if I'm just sitting thier beyond the call and duty of the job - especially since I have more than enough prep time in the 30hrs on the contract due to my current teaching load.

[J.B. Clamence]

Technically speaking, you are already being paid for your preparations. For every lesson you teach, you are expected to be prepared for it (however long that takes), and you are paid for the whole package. That's why teachers all over the world teach less hours than most people work: Because we have our own extra work (prep) to do in addition to teaching.

I've been teaching for years, so I usually don't do much prep (if any). At the beginning of the book, I take a look and get a general idea of what I want to do with it, and then once I've gotten the hang of the structure of the book and what can be done with it, I don't really need to prep anymore. However, as a university teacher, I have to do tons of paperwork (marking papers, grading, dealing with student issues, holding office hours, etc.), so I spend a lot of extra busy-time in my office, but luckily, not much prep. I don't expect to be paid for it because it's part of my job.

As far as sitting around at the school doing nothing, you should clarify those things with your employer before you agree to work for him. You should ask the school not only how many hours you are required to teach, but also how many hours a day you are expected to be on-site, whether you're teaching the whole time or not. If you like the offer, take it, but if you think it's unreasonable, then don't take it.

[busan_boy2000]

I've already taken it. That is how it is so far. I agree with prep for a class - but what about after you've finsihed all the lesson plans and you just have to hang out? That seems a bit much.

[Mr. Pink]

When I worked at a hawgwon I would leave right after my last class. Depending on the day, I would show up 30-60mins early and do what preparing I had to do.

I changed to another hawgwon and had a sort of split shift, with 3-4hrs break in the afternoon. I would usually goto a "long" lunch...do whatever i wanted in that time.

I think your boss is asking too much. As for the Sunday thing, 6hrs doing nothing huh...I guess I would be wondering why I work so many hours 4 days of the week and have my time wasted on Sunday. Chances are I wouldn't sit around for 6hrs, I would say my teaching is done, so I am going home.

[crazylemongirl]

I do my prep between lessons. But I have lots of breaks between lessons and am on site for 9 hours a day.

Clg

[OiGirl]

Prep time should be what is necessary to prepare your lessons and complete the necessary paperwork -- no more and no less. It is not necessarily paid, it is included in your salary for your hours scheduled.

You should not be sitting around for hours you don't need for prep, but at the same time if you are sitting around for those hours you should not demand to be paid for it. I would guess that management wants to see your pretty face around the joint to show how much time the foreign hired help puts in and how diligent they are.

If you don't want to do it, you should take a stand and refuse to sit there for extra hours. But I wouldn't do this unless you can consistently prove how you have planned your lessons and completed your paperwork in the time you think is sufficient.

[lush72]

In my hogwon days I once had a day where I taught for a total of 2 hours, yet the owner expected me to be there for a full day. I compromised and did prep for all my classes on that day (prior to this I was coming in religiously 45 minutes early) and then left when I was finished.

Now I come in 45 minutes early and usually leave 20-30 minutes late daily. The early mornings are part me time, part expected. The late going home times are actually �early� when you take into consideration the time the rest of the staff leave. Business culture here is such that there is intangible value placed on merely being present at your workplace. Weather or not you are doing anything remotely productive at that time seems a secondary consideration at best. Is this a useful way to spend time? No. Does this seem logical? No. Is it expected? You bet it is! Look at the poor Korean employees at your job. Look at their schedules. The full time people probably are there for 45+ hours a week and work 6 days a week.

If you feel that your situation is intolerable why not try to work out a reasonable compromise and present it in a cheerful, friendly way? If the director still insists that you must be present even with having absolutely nothing to do, then you should consult your contract and see what exactly is specified. I am aware of 1 teacher who did a year at one of the hogwons that I was also at who did 0% (on site) prep time. Class started at 10 and ended at 6 and you never saw them outside of those times. They prepped (obviously- as they were watched all the time) at home and did really well in class. This is probably the only reason they were not fired.

Good luck!

[Austin]

So much depends on what you think you are being paid for and what he thinks he has purchased by hiring you.

If you do not complain about the time, use it effectively, and the quality of your classes improve dramatically, you should be able to negotiate a more comfortable schedule for yourself with ease. However, if you complain, do not use your time wisely, and your classes continue to "bite," you might want to forget about asking for anything.

Too many fail to see the "Korean" side of things that they end up beating their heads against a wall.

It is your choice, but a bit of consideration will save you a lot of discomfort.

[busan_boy2000]

Good advice - thanks everyone. It is easy to forget that one is not in Kansas anymore and that different workplace norms exist here.

thanks.

[phaedrus]

Of course you should be paid for prep time. You should be on salary with a reasonable amount of teaching time scheduled. If you are being paid by the hour for teaching time you should be paid by the hour for the prep time as well.
At my hagwon I taught 32.5 hours per week and they would have liked 40. I did as little prep as possible because this is an insane amount to teach. Teaching is generally more stressful than other work so I think 32 hours in the classroom is equivalent to 40 hours pushing paper. Of course a lot of paper pushing government jobs in Canada are only 35 hours per week.
My new job is in public school and my teaching time is about 4 hours per day. This leaves loads of time for prep, I'm on salary, and I feel good about it.
My hagwon boss said something to me once. She said "Why are you complaining about doing so much prep work. DO you think public school principals prepare material for their teachers?" I wish I knew then that public school teachers teach no more than 22 hours without overtime and I would have told her where to stick her profit seeking....

[J.B. Clamence]

[anae]

[busan_boy2000]

The logic behind prep time is making me reconsider going into law. OK, maybe I won't do anything that drastic yet. But is that a fair equation to make. All kinds of professions require prep in one form or another that is usaully paid in some regard. Be it in the salary or the hourly wage for consulting in planning. I realize most teachers are salary so it is part of the game.

I guess the hourly teacher is more of a short lived Korean/ESL type of situation that is not applicable beyond.

[some waygug-in]

I don't know of anyone who gets paid for prep time. The last hagwan I worked at wanted me to prepare as much as I thought necessary, no more no less. After that, I was free to go. Unless it is written into your contract that you have to sit around the school for x amount of hours every day, then I would just leave when my prep was finished.

Prep time varies, depending on class size, levels, activities, books used, and all kinds of variables. Sometime I would spend 2 to 3 hours doing extra prep work, like making a game or something, but it was never required. Basic prep usually took me between 45 min - 1 hour per day.

If it is written into your contract, then there's not much you can do, but if it isn't, just say no. Tell them you have a doctor's appointment, or you have to meet a friend, or you have to buy new shoes, or any other thing to get you out of the place.
Cheers

[phaedrus]

No, I shouldn't have taken my hagwon job.

It looked good on paper from Canada but resulted in a headache. As long as I finished each month with paycheck I wasn't too concerned about effort or prep. The contract I read in Canada sounded reasonable for teaching hours but it was mostly fluff disguising the reality of what they expect. Sessions and below hours and overtime and teaching hours and vacation and days off between sessions all got mixed into a hellish load of work (it was a load of something else too). Anyway, the job wasn't so bad overall, and I stayed for convenience. We all know about how easy it is to change work places mid contract, and there is the devil you know.... Long story short there was almost no prep to do. We had lesson plans created by a supervisor and books ready. My director always had some new idea to add to the roster to attract new students or keep up with the hagwons down the street. It was this "extra" work loaded on that usually pissed me off. It is hard to predict a boss's perfectionism before taking a job. I learned from my mistakes and will not take another job like that. However, if I must.... I don't have a problem with thinking I'm entitled to compensation for ALL the work I do, and if hagwons want to justify what they do (generalisation I know but come on---HAGWON) I can easily justify not preparing but still feeling good about taking a paycheck. It's funny that they complain but never seem to fire people unless they want your severance at month eleven.