Korean Job Discussion Forums

[suki]

I'm a Korean adoptee who will be teaching as an excuse to check out my country of birth. I have never been to Korea. I am in my 40's.

I feel particularly challenged because I have all the disadvantages of foreigners because I AM a foreigner (the U.S. and English is all I've known) while having all the expectations of being Korean since I AM Korean (though in looks only.)

I have met a couple of Kyopos or gypos here in the states and I can see why everyone is irritated with them. But unlike most of them, I was not spoiled, I have no Korean culture to capitolize on, and I can't communicate to show off my western superiority even if I wanted to (which I don't)

As annoying as they are, I have been reading the board here and am shocked at how virulent the extent of feelings towards them are. omg, I really don't want to take on that kind of hostility! I see gyopos as more like second generation Koreans, or wild geese. But us adoptees have only known our white parents and many of us have been raised as the only asian in their entire white towns. That was rough, let me tell you. We are asian only in looks. So I understand I will be labeled as gyopo, but do adoptees (especially older ones) really fit the stereotypes I am reading on this board?

Since I have not gotten to Korea yet, I would welcome some preemptive advice. How do you distinguish a gyopo on site? How can I NOT be seen negatively as your classic gyopo and yet still learn about my culture? How can I have the comfort of being around fellow foreigners if they're going to instantly hate me because I look Korean? How can I minimize being automatically dismissed as a gyopo by my peers? I already have to brace myself for the scolding I hear I will constantly get from Koreans for not knowing Korean. (I will take classes) I feel like I will be in America all over again, in reverse. Being transracial can suck. I know it will not be easy, but what can I do so it is not as hard as it has to be?

Any advice welcome. Practical advice especially helpful. Things to say to Koreans to explain. Things to say to fellow foreigners to distance myself from the gyopo stereotype. Thanks and please be kind!

[OnTheOtherSide]

Just don't worry about it, you'll be fine. You obviously have a good attitude and are a cool person. Also if you are in your 40's, you should be above all that petty stereotyping. That's mostly a young persons game.

I really don't think anyone will care about your background if you are a good person. Personally, I don't even have an opinion about gyopos, i've met a couple of them but I don't have any sort of negative view towards them.

And I don't even know what a Kyopo is. Just relax and don't overthink it. It'll be no problem.

[suki]

I think kyopo is another way to spell gyopo. There were 91,500 google hits for kyopo vs. under 20,000 hits for gyopo.

the word is new to me this week! i guess another reason I am so freaked out about being labeled as one!

[mee]

it's just another form of prejudice

[Ya-ta Boy]

mee is right. No doubt there are some spoiled gyopos in about the same proportion as there are spoiled other people.

I think all you can do is insist on being treated as an individual and avoid the bigots as much as possible.

You might want to make a thread asking gyopos and other adoptees for advice in handling Koreans who are rude because of your background.

There is a social group for people your age. You can make another thread asking where they are and get hooked up with them.

Good luck.

[EuroFunk]

I'm also a gyopo too, and in somewhat of the same position as you're in. Born in Korea, but raised up in the U.S., it is sometimes hard to relate to a group. On one hand, you got the "roots" and the look (so people expect you to behave like an Korean) vs. an understanding of American culture/English that usually beats a regular Korean.

I remember when I went to Korea, I definitely felt like a foreigner, but I guess I can learn to adapt and slowly embrace it. As for the automatic stereotyping of "hate", I suggest just be yourself, or even try to promote the positive aspects of Korean people are people as well (even though they have some strange ways...). Hell, I think having a regular fluent English conversation to a foreigner surely beats "Hi. Hi. Hamburger?"

I'm learning the language as well, that is probably one big factor in minimizing your gyopo appearance, but I guess I'm proud to experience both east and west cultures. Don't stress yourself out too much by losing your self-image to fit in, and have fun while you're in Korea!

[soviet_man]

Firstly you need to keep a positive frame of mind about your heritage. Don't put yourself down. Yes being "Korean" but not knowing "Korean" will be somewhat of an issue for some Koreans in Korea, although it is not worth stressing about. It will be a minor issue and mainly be from the older generation. Young Koreans would not be bothered with it.

In practice most waygook teachers have fairly limited contact with non-English speaking Koreans in Korea anyway (eg. shop keepers and the like) and so it rarely comes up.

You have to also remember there are several hundred thousand people just like you. There are huge numbers of so called ethnic "Koreans" from places like Uzbekistan, Sakhalin Russia, Yanbian province China and elsewhere, that are also mistakenly lumped in as being "Korean" whether they are or not. Just because they have Korean heritage does not imply they are big "K" Korean in a cultural or political identity sense (infact many have never set foot in Korea and will never be given Korean passports or citizenship).

I have not experienced any situation where your immediate foreign co-workers would dismiss/exclude you from the group because of your situation. They will see you as waygook just like them, unless you give some overt signal otherwise.

As foreigners we can 'read people' better than Koreans (eg. everyone would pick up the signs of gay foreign co-worker, whilst most Koreans would be clueless on the issue).

Just be yourself. You will be fine.

[wylies99]

I've had some Kyopo friends and co-workers. I've met two great ones and dozens of rotten ones. This may raise some hackles here, but it's the truth. (Someone will quote this and call me racist- whatever- if the shoe fits...).

This isn't true of all Kyopos, but of far too many it's right on target.
The biggest problem I've seen with many Kyopos is that they act like they're on vacation and not like they have a real job. Instead of taking things seriously, they look at being in Korea as a place to hang for a year or two. It's always party time. They'd rather treat Korea like a "spring break" destination.They treat everyone and everything with a "Yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever" kind of attitude that many immature waygooks share. Yeah, there are plenty of younger waygooks who act this way, too.

But, since this country is part of every Kyopo's heritage, it is VERY disappointing that so many care so little about their lives and how they treat friends and co-workers. I can leave Korea tomorrow and have nothing further to do with it, but Kyopos will always have ties to Korea. It's disheartening when a Kyopo laughs at you for going to museums. Yeah, it's like that.
It's very disappointing.

OP, if you take your job seriously treat people with respect, you'll be fine.

[Alyssa]

I think you wil do fine too, you don't seem like you are looking for an identity like the younger gyopo wanna be cool people are. Just don't
1. wear hip hop clothes and try to act like you came from the hood.
2. speak english REALLY LOUD SO THE KOREANS AND OTHER WHITE TEACHERS KNOW YOU ARE NOT KOREAN
3. Try toooooooooo hard to be liked, like making up stories that people can tell are not true.
4. get angry, feel jealous at white teachers for getting star treatment (and show your resentment).
5. Get drunk all the time and act like a &()*)(_)

[milspecs]

[wylies99]

See, I said someone would flame me for posting the truth.

milspecs- Thank you for proving my point.

[Alyssa]

[milspecs]

[crsandus]

OP: I can't really say what kind of experiences you have but I'll mention some of mine. Generally my life is pretty normal. I know a smattering of Korean and generally it's enough to order food and converse with a Korean for about 3 seconds before I have to tell the person I don't understand Korean very well.

I haven't been exposed to any overt hostility concerning my background but I'm a big boy and I'm not too worried about it. Fortunate for me, whenever I do something that may require lots of Korean communication <going to the doctor's, setting up a bank account> I'm usually flanked by a coteacher or family members. I've also met a handful of other adoptees in Korea.

I met an older woman who was an adoptee a month or so back. She told me she would send me information about the GOAL group or whatever other adoption groups there were in Korea but she never did.

My point is, there are groups that exist for adoptees (even older ones) and it may be a good idea to join them. The woman I mentioned above said that she doesn't tell anyone that she was adopted and mentioned I should do the same but in the end, a woman has it easier than a guy in explaining her western name to Koreans. I generally tell people since they'll wonder why a guy with a Korean appearance has a Polish last name. Banks go crazy when they see my Korean name on my ARC and on my bank information but can't communicate with me without an interpreter.

As for Dave's don't listen to most of the talk about gyopos/kyopos. Everyone has some kind of opinion about gyopos and you're not going to change it. When it's right or wrong, it doesn't matter because in the end, it's the internet. A forum is one of the worst places to convey one's feelings on a delicate matter and I'm sure you'd get along with a lot of the "gyopo haters" if you met them in person and not get along with a lot of the gyopos if you met them in person. Dave's is more of a form of entertainment to me with an occasional nugget of useful information.

I apologize if my post doesn't flow well, I just woke up and my head is a bit groggy. Gotta go eat.

[Ruraljuror]

Allow me to tackle the elephant in the room: you probably will have trouble fitting in. Not due to your race, due to your age.

I have worked with some older people who have taken the plunge and come over here, and to be perfectly honest they are basically pariahs. During work they are chatted with and treated friendly, but after work ends they are not included with the social plans. Keep in mind, most people who come over here are under 25. Most likely, when you were under 25 you wouldn't want to go out drinking, dancing, and looking for love with someone twice your age either.

This is ESPECIALLY true for women. They will NEVER be invited out by a group of young people. And it seems from your name and writing style you may be a woman.

So basically, you will not fit in socially. The Koreans your own age are 99.999% married. The younger foreigners will not need an older person to hang out with. The older foreigners are usually people who have been here for years, and have started their own family, and thus don't have as much time for friends anymore.

Spending time in bars (or clubs) btw, is the only thing foreigners do in Korea socially. Foreign guys get drunk and try to pick up Korean girls, and foreign girls get drunk and try to pick up whatever guy hasn't picked up a Korean girl.

I think it would be a lonely year for you if you came here, but that isn't necessarily a deal breaker I guess. You'd need something else to do with all of your free time. Study Korean, or martial arts...something like that.

If you come you DEFINITELY should go to Seoul. You'd have the best chance of meeting people your age there and making friends. You would be MUCH lonelier and bored in a small town.

Just my 2 cents based on what I've observed from watching older foreigners come over at different jobs. I've worked with one older man, and one older woman who came over on their first contract. They both finished their contract, but both were very lonely here all year. They didn't make any friends. They were not included in anything. Ever.

It's MUCH better to be a gyopo than to be old.



PS: The number one reason that foreigners don't like gyopos is envy, due to the fact that gyopos can get a F-4 Visa which gives them total employment freedom to switch jobs, work multiple jobs, work privates, etc. So they complain about it. The anger is towards Korean Immigration and how terrible the E-2 visa is. I've never heard of a rational foreigner personally disliking gyopos as a group for any reason. I really wouldn't worry about anti-gyopo feelings from foreigners.