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Is it really so bad in Korea?
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Leper Messiah
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 7:00 am    Post subject: Is it really so bad in Korea? Reply with quote

I have a friend who worked in Korea about two years ago and he tells me that the only reason he stayed there for as long as he did was because his girlfriend was Korean. He said that he'd rather live on the street than go back. I'm considering going there myself to pay off those damned loans more quickly, but between what he says and what I've read here, it seems you're more likely to wind up screwed-over unless you become a complete brown-noser. Is it really this bad, or are the persepectives on this board skewed?
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canuckistan
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Joined: 17 Jun 2003
Location: Training future GS competitors.....

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 7:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It does take some getting used to at first, but no, it isn't as bad as some people make it out to be.
If you learn as much as you can about immigration/labour law/procedures here you can really minimize the silly stuff that unawares get hosed with at work. The rest is good friends and fun times!
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Ilsanman



Joined: 15 Aug 2003
Location: Bucheon, Korea

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 7:59 am    Post subject: yes Reply with quote

It's not all shit and roses, but it is good. Like Canuckistan said, you have to learn a lot so you don't get completely hosed.

Come here if you want. Be prepared for bad things (only smart) and you might really like it.
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Austin



Joined: 23 May 2003
Location: In the kitchen

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 8:14 am    Post subject: Reasons... Reply with quote

If your only reason for entertaining the idea of coming to Korea is money, you may well regret stepping foot in this great nation. However, if you are able to gradually attain your single-minded goal, you may be able to overlook the nuances that make Korea a unique and amazing place. Unfortunately, many people that find themselves living here did not come for reasons that would have made their stay a more rewarding one, so the picture that you are left to decipher is unclear.

If anything, it is a journey inward, for no matter where you go, there you are! As such, you are the only one that will be able to answer your question.

Have you ever lived and traveled to other countries before? What did you learn from those experiences?

Austin
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Butterfly



Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Location: Kuwait

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Is it really so bad in Korea? Reply with quote

Leper Messiah wrote:
I have a friend who worked in Korea about two years ago and he tells me that the only reason he stayed there for as long as he did was because his girlfriend was Korean. He said that he'd rather live on the street than go back. I'm considering going there myself to pay off those damned loans more quickly, but between what he says and what I've read here, it seems you're more likely to wind up screwed-over unless you become a complete brown-noser. Is it really this bad, or are the persepectives on this board skewed?


If you call working hard and doing your best, trying to adapt to cultural difference, networking and making lots of friends and generally making the most of your time 'brown-nosing' then yes, 'brown-nosing' is a good way to make yourself lots of money and friends in Korea. Life is what you make it.

Make yourself valuable to your employer.

Incidentally, I was screwed over in my first year here, I learned from the experience, had made enough contacts to pull myself out of the situation, and have not be messed around since.
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Jsspiff



Joined: 17 Nov 2003
Location: New York

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:21 pm    Post subject: Don't want to get screwed Reply with quote

Hi, me and my friend Jen want to go to Pusan in Jan 2005 (she still has a year of college before we can go, hence why so far away) but we don't want to get, as Canuckistan said, hosed. So if any of you have advice, links to reputable sites, all of that, send it our way! Thanks!

John and Jen
Twisted Evil Razz
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Leper Messiah
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Reasons... Reply with quote

Quote:
If your only reason for entertaining the idea of coming to Korea is money, you may well regret stepping foot in this great nation. However, if you are able to gradually attain your single-minded goal, you may be able to overlook the nuances that make Korea a unique and amazing place. Unfortunately, many people that find themselves living here did not come for reasons that would have made their stay a more rewarding one, so the picture that you are left to decipher is unclear.

Since we're on the topic of unclear, could you be a bit more simple? How does earning money become the problem? Are you suggesting working for peanuts?

quote]Incidentally, I was screwed over in my first year here, I learned from the experience, had made enough contacts to pull myself out of the situation, and have not be messed around since.[/quote]
Based on your experience you give me some details about what to avoid?
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Butterfly



Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Location: Kuwait

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Reasons... Reply with quote

Quote:
Based on your experience you give me some details about what to avoid?


Well, I can't list everything, but my first boss was fine, paid me on time, liked me, invited me to his house etc.

But then I told him I wouldn't be renewing my contract but was staying in Korea, and he got very hurt, and accordingly vindictive. Gave me a bad reference, and never paid my final severance allowance. It was a few years ago and I didn't have the redress that we have today.

I would avoid, when starting out, small privately owned hakwons. For a first year I'd recommend the market leader schools like YBM or Pagoda that pay less but pay.

That'll be a better start for you.



John and Jan.

Heaven knows what Korea will be like a year from now. Check back in a year will you?
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bjonothan



Joined: 29 Apr 2003
Location: All over the place

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What the others said pretty much has it in a nut shell. Before you come be prepared. Find out what can make your stay here an easier one. There are some things that I cannot get here that I miss from home such as spray on deodorant, so I packed heaps this time. I am the same as your friend. I have a woman here so I had to come back. Reading this forum and getting links to some other good sites is a good start. The money here isn't all that bad. For Kiwis, Canadians and Aussies we have taken a bit of a pay drop if you work out the exchange rates now. The money you can earn here will be easily enough to live on and save a good portion if you don't spend money like me. And remember, how many times do people say positive things as opposed to negative things about a place??? Good luck! It will probably only be for a year.....
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Austin



Joined: 23 May 2003
Location: In the kitchen

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 6:23 pm    Post subject: Money... Reply with quote

Leper Messiah,

Quote:
Since we're on the topic of unclear, could you be a bit more simple? How does earning money become the problem? Are you suggesting working for peanuts?


To answer your follow-up questions...

I never stated that earning money becomes the problem. I stated that if money was your only reason then you might regret your experience here. I apologize for not explaining in more detail, as I thought the logic was quite straightforward.

Believe it or not, some people have actually traveled quite a bit before coming to Korea, and they enjoy experiencing new cultures, languages, and customs. As such, some come here to experience Korea first and earn money second. Those people tend to have a more suitable disposition and adjust to Korea much faster than those that have never stepped outside of their own city, let alone their country.

My original comments were aimed at the above. Money can be made anywhere by anyone. If you are not fascinated by Korea and are only concerned with money, the situation here may grind on you.

As for your second question, I made no mention of peanuts or working for less in my post, so I am unsure as to how to address that one.

Austin
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Tiger Beer



Joined: 07 Feb 2003

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 7:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Is it really so bad in Korea? Reply with quote

Leper Messiah wrote:
I'm considering going there myself to pay off those damned loans more quickly

If thats your reason for going to Korea.. you might have problems. Korea in itself isn't bad if you have the proper motives for coming here - like anywhere.

When people make decisions totally on the money factor - particularly going to a completely different culture than there own to live. At that point there can be a problem - regardless of the culture.

Most people who adjust here or tend to stick around, come for a variety of reasons. But I think many come for the experience of living in another culture, experiencing things different, some interest in Korean culture even if its TaeKwanDo or an interest in Asia in general. You need some kind of motivation or another.

Maybe you have some other interest like that as well.. and if so, then you'd be fine. If its exclusively just to pay off debt and not much else. Then you'll find the challenge of living in a different culture/country and all that it entails to be burdensome, most likely. Particularly one as different as Korea.
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Austin



Joined: 23 May 2003
Location: In the kitchen

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 7:25 pm    Post subject: Echo... Reply with quote

Is there an echo in here?

Austin...

lol...the highest form of flattery, but the lowest form of intelligence!
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Tiger Beer



Joined: 07 Feb 2003

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 7:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Echo... Reply with quote

Austin wrote:
Is there an echo in here?

Austin...

lol...the highest form of flattery, but the lowest form of intelligence!

Sorry I didn't read the other posts yet.. just responding directly to the main OP.. for now Wink I'll read the others later..

As I read them now.. yeah, same thing I guess.

Regarding $$ being the main motivation. Even that has to be combined with something else. Maybe you like the idea of being an expat. There has to be something. I mean lawyers make a lot of $$.. but unless they are infatuated with some aspect of it.. even just the title of calling themselves a lawyer or something another. There has to be something. If its purely out of $$ and zero other interests.. I'd say living in Korea (or being a lawyer) or whatever else would be hell on earth. Particularly living in Korea as its a foreign culture very different and unique to itself. If that is interesting in itself, then you'd be prime to come on over and you'd like it quite a bit.
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Mr. Pink



Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Location: China

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If money is a motivation, I know lots of people that sock cash away here. IF you have a hard time adjusting to change, or a closed mind, stay home and flip burgers.

I've seen lots of people come over here ONLY for the money and the other aspects of Korea just grew on them.

How to not get screwed? Go with a bigname chain (not Wonderland) I haven't heard of many people getting screwed going with a well known school. Sure the money is usually less, but the security is there. Also do what most dumbasses don't do...RESEARCH RESEARCH and more RESEARCH. Don't be hasty to sign anything. There are craploads of jobs out there and recruiters/directors love to PUSH crap on ya. Think of it like buying a car, you wouldn't go out and buy the first thing you saw right? Wel the jobs are like that.
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rapier



Joined: 16 Feb 2003

PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

re: "becoming a brown nose".
If making an effort to get along with everyone you work with, including your boss, rather than automatically seeing him as the enemy from day one is being a brown nose, then yes, it helps.
The western notion of workers vs. bosses will not help you here. I f you walk in on day one, seeing your boss as the spawn of Satan, make a lot of demands etc, of course he'll want to sc**ew you over.
Think positive. think "work with/for your boss, not against/under him" and you will often avoid the whole adversarial no-win scenario.
Of course, plenty of bosses are scumbags. But i've virtually always found that if you try to form some degree of friendly relationship with him, he will not sc**w you. Its the workers that piss him off that he'll do that to.
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