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semphoon
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: Where Nowon is
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 Posted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 3:25 pm Post subject: Interesting grammar questions |
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Hello all,
I was asked these questions by a masters student, and was asked to collect as many ideas as possible as to what the answers might be. If you have time please have a look.
1.You must be smart, mustn't you?
(Do you think this sentence is correct or incorrect?. If your answer is NO, could you explain WHY?)
2.You must study hard, mustn't you?
( Do you think this sentence is natural or not? Please explain it.)
3.a. John is so diligent a student that everybody likes him.
(This sentence is correct grammatically.)
*b. They are so diligent students that everybody likes them.
(This sentence is incorrect. Please let me know why sentence (b) is wrong.)
*c. There are so many people in class room.
(If the sentence (b) is incorrect, do you think the sentence(c) is wrong, too?, I think the sentence (c) is absolutely right. What is your opinion?)
4.a.He is such a nice boy that...
b. He is quite a nice boy that...
(Sentence (a) is right, but I am not sure sentence (b) is right or not. What do you think about it?)
Thanks for any input you have. |
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Straphanger
Joined: 09 Oct 2008
Location: Chilgok, Korea
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blackjack
Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Location: anyang
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| Posted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 4:51 pm Post subject: Re: Interesting grammar questions |
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can't give you the grammatical reasons but here is my opinion.
| semphoon wrote: |
Hello all,
I was asked these questions by a masters student, and was asked to collect as many ideas as possible as to what the answers might be. If you have time please have a look.
1.You must be smart, mustn't you?
You must be smart, aren't you?
(Do you think this sentence is correct or incorrect?. If your answer is NO, could you explain WHY?)
2.You must study hard, mustn't you?
You must study hard don't you?
( Do you think this sentence is natural or not? Please explain it.)
3.a. John is so diligent a student that everybody likes him.
(might be correct but sounds wrong) "John is such diligent a student that everybody likes him
(This sentence is correct grammatically.)
*b. They are so diligent students that everybody likes them.
same as a
(This sentence is incorrect. Please let me know why sentence (b) is wrong.)
*c. There are so many people in class room.
There are so many people in the classroom
(If the sentence (b) is incorrect, do you think the sentence(c) is wrong, too?, I think the sentence (c) is absolutely right. What is your opinion?)
4.a.He is such a nice boy that...
b. He is quite a nice boy that...
(Sentence (a) is right, but I am not sure sentence (b) is right or not. What do you think about it?)
Thanks for any input you have. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 4:51 pm Post subject: Re: Interesting grammar questions |
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Let me qualify what I say with the fact that, while I like grammar, I'm by no means a grammarian.
| semphoon wrote: |
1.You must be smart, mustn't you?
(Do you think this sentence is correct or incorrect?. If your answer is NO, could you explain WHY?)
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I think it's technically correct to say it; it follows an acceptable pattern, even if it sounds awkward.
| semphoon wrote: |
2.You must study hard, mustn't you?
( Do you think this sentence is natural or not? Please explain it.)
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I'm not sure in terms of world-wide usage, but at least in the part of the States I come from, we would never say this. We would use this pattern with are, can, should, and do, but not must. "Mustn't you" in general sounds a bit awkward to my ears; even saying something like "Mustn't you go home for dinner now?" isn't very smooth sounding, and I'd only really use mustn't in forms like "Y mustn't do X." This may be regional.
| semphoon wrote: |
3.a. John is so diligent a student that everybody likes him.
(This sentence is correct grammatically.)
*b. They are so diligent students that everybody likes them.
(This sentence is incorrect. Please let me know why sentence (b) is wrong.) |
I think you need to use "such diligent students" here. In most cases, if you want to use so, you need an indefinite article between the adjective and noun. You can say "John is such a diligent student..." or "John is so diligent a student..." and be correct. Because students can't take an indefinite article due to being plural, the adjective and noun touch and you must use such instead of so.
| semphoon wrote: |
*c. There are so many people in class room.
(If the sentence (b) is incorrect, do you think the sentence(c) is wrong, too?, I think the sentence (c) is absolutely right. What is your opinion?) |
This sentence is correct in it's usage of "so" (which I suspect is probably really the point of the question) but still technically incorrect since it should say "the class room." Adjectives referring to quantity (much, many, few, etc) can have so applied to them in situations like this, probably because they only deal with plurals. In fact, the system seems almost inverted towards them; you can say "so many people," but you cannot say "such many people," just like you can say "such diligent students," but not "so diligent students."
| semphoon wrote: |
4.a.He is such a nice boy that...
b. He is quite a nice boy that...
(Sentence (a) is right, but I am not sure sentence (b) is right or not. What do you think about it?) |
I think both can be correct depending on how you are using the word that.
He is such a nice boy that I will give him candy. (That being used as an indicator of reason or cause.)
He is quite a nice boy that smiles a lot. (That being used to provide a more specific description of the boy.) |
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some waygug-in
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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I was agreeing with BlackJack all the way until this one,
3.a. John is so diligent a student that everybody likes him.
(might be correct but sounds wrong) "John is such diligent a student that everybody likes him
The correction sounds even worse than the original. 
"such a diligent student" would sound much better.
John is such a diligent student that everybody likes him.
 Then this;
This sentence is correct grammatically.)
*b. They are so diligent students that everybody likes them.
same as a
I don't think so, it would sound better like this:
They are such diligent students that everybody likes them. |
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blackjack
Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Location: anyang
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| Posted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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| some waygug-in wrote: |
I was agreeing with BlackJack all the way until this one,
3.a. John is so diligent a student that everybody likes him.
(might be correct but sounds wrong) "John is such diligent a student that everybody likes him
The correction sounds even worse than the original.
"such a diligent student" would sound much better.
John is such a diligent student that everybody likes him.
Then this;
This sentence is correct grammatically.)
*b. They are so diligent students that everybody likes them.
same as a
I don't think so, it would sound better like this:
They are such diligent students that everybody likes them. |
John is such a diligent student that everybody likes him.
and for B
I meant such instead of so
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