Korean Job Discussion Forums

Chris2007 · Joined: 20 Mar 2007

I was watching a tv dating show recently and the female host was giving advice to the guys who were about to go on their dates. She was telling them to help the women put on coats, open doors for them, etc. Then she told them to find out what they want to eat at the restaurant and then order for them! WTF? I've never heard of this. Are they dating women or 3 year olds? Are they supposed to wipe her chin if she drools, too?

Of course on a date one should exude terrific manners and all that, but it seems like it is often a thin line between treating her like a "lady" and treating her like a child.

What are your thoughts? Does chivalry still exist? Does it need to be redefined? Is it sexist?

mole · Joined: 06 Feb 2003 Location: Act III

Just do it.

Cheezy gestures like those are simple, easy to perform, yet can make a big impact on the date.
They don't rely on impressing her with your physique, intellect, or wittiness.
They can be used in any situation; at an expensive, fancy restaurant or a bowling alley.

That's my take, but I hope a female answers.
Is it more about the attitude that goes along with just paying attention rather than the acts themselves?

Chivalry ain't dead!

VanIslander · Posted: Fri May 01, 2009 11:14 pm Post subject:

Be considerate and thoughtful. Show you care.

That's the underlying message. Chivalry is beside the point.

There are other ways of doing it (e.g., getting her an appropriate gift to reflect some little thing you remember she had mentioned, have a momento from the first time met, make a mixed music tape, etc)

tzechuk · Joined: 20 Dec 2004

Sleepy in Seoul · Posted: Sat May 02, 2009 12:23 am Post subject:

Rock · Joined: 25 Feb 2005

I think it might be referring to proper etiquette. A man's supposed to know what a woman's ordering, or preferring, so as to not seem over indulgent. It's piggish.

Just think, when the waiter comes to your table, does she ask the man to order first or the woman? Usually the woman. A man could be embarrassed, embarrass his date, and make a pig of himself, if he orders too large a meal.

It's just being polite. Now, if women want to order a pitcher of bear, a few pounds of roast beef, maybe a bowl of gravy, then it wouldn't be sexist.

Or would it?

bundangbabo · Joined: 01 Jun 2008

JongnoGuru · Joined: 25 May 2004 Location: peeing on your doorstep

Adventurer · Joined: 28 Jan 2006

neandergirl · Joined: 23 Jun 2005

Good manners - whether shown by males or females - goes a loooooong way in my book. I was going to say that ordering for me might be a bit much, but as I thought about it, I realized that the better half and I do ask one another what we're having and then one of (usually me) gives the order to the waiter. If one of us were to just pick and place the order, that would be over the top; less 'take charge' (I'm not convinced that's what I'd be looking for in a fella or he in a broad) than domineering. It's been my experience that the 'higher' person is usually asked first and then everyone else can match their order (price-wise, eating style etc). I remember reading somewhere that you shouldn't order anything more expensive than the 'boss' or anything less casual so if the top dog orders something in the 15.00 range that requires a fork and knife, you shouldn't order something in the 20.00 range or finger food.

Chris2007 · Joined: 20 Mar 2007

aboxofchocolates · Joined: 21 Mar 2008 Location: on your mind

Chivalry? Hells yeah!! Just the other day someone questioned whether I was the fairest maid in the land, and my man jousted the crap out of that dude!!

Ok, seriously, I'm not a huge fan of people making decisions for me or pretending they did. I like to do things for myself and for others, too. I figure it's polite to open doors for people, so why not do it. The other day I was walking into a store, and, as is my habit, I opened the door for he person behind me who happened to be a man. Rather than just walk through and say thank you, he akwardly walked around me and took the door to hold for me. I smiled and thanked the guy, but I knew he was making a point of holding the door because I was a woman, so it was weird. I am not an invalid and I like to help people too. I think what I am trying to say is respect is far more important than chivalry. Treat grown ups like grown ups.

Jonoguru, it just so happens that after a month and a half of three hours martial arts training a day (I want to get into a cage match, you see) I am hot as balls and a feminist. Take that, your beliefs!!! But I don't wear make-up. Maybe it's not that attractive women aren't feminists, its that you don't find women attractive when they show assertiveness and who are disinclined to dress up for the boys. You're not alone in this, but that's not everyones cup of tea. believe me, you don't speak for the majority. Strong guys like strong women.

Gimpokid · Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Location: Best Gimpo

I'm American and we don't even have anything like this over there. I had to ask a British guy what the hell a "chav" even was. He painted a far less kind picture than all of you. I guess if they hold open doors for people then they're not all bad.

El Macho · Joined: 07 Nov 2008

I'm American, not from the upper-crust, and I do those sorts of things all the time. I was raised with those manners, and they're what I practice now.

I don't necessarily do them consciously, it's just automatic to open the doors, walk next to the street, etc. I also do those sorts of things when I'm with friends, I see it as a way of showing friendship and respect.

Standing up when a women comes to/leave the table or pulling out her chair is more formal, and some women are put off by it, in which case I don't do it. The same goes for ordering food for a woman. I usually will do it, but if it bothers the lady, I won't. I'm doing it as a sign of respect, not as some sort of passive-aggressive power play. ("THIS is what you're gonna eat!")

I think that what's important about doing "chivalric" (polite) sort of stuff is that it shows you acknowledge the people around you. I don't think that we do that enough, and are seeing less common courtesy as a result.

El Macho · Joined: 07 Nov 2008

I'm American, not from the upper-crust, and I do those sorts of things all the time. I was raised with those manners, and they're what I practice now.

I don't necessarily do them consciously, it's just automatic to open the doors, walk next to the street, etc. I also do those sorts of things when I'm with friends, I see it as a way of showing friendship and respect.

Standing up when a women comes to/leave the table or pulling out her chair is more formal, and some women are put off by it, in which case I don't do it. The same goes for ordering food for a woman. I usually will do it, but if it bothers the lady, I won't. I'm doing it as a sign of respect, not as some sort of passive-aggressive power play. ("THIS is what you're gonna eat!")

I think that what's important about doing "chivalric" (polite) sort of stuff is that it shows you acknowledge the people around you. I don't think that we do that enough, and are seeing less common courtesy as a result.