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is so delicious
Joined: 28 Apr 2009
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 Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 3:26 am Post subject: How bad is the visa process in other countries? |
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I'm thinking Thailand, China, Japan... which of these places can I go to and begin work quickly, either with or without the proper visa?
Thanks in advance. |
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tzechuk
Joined: 20 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 4:06 am Post subject: |
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I think both Thailand and Japan allow to to switch your visa without needing to leave the country?
Actually I am not sure about Thailand, but I am sure about Japan. |
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is so delicious
Joined: 28 Apr 2009
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 4:22 am Post subject: |
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| So I can go to Japan and begin work easily? Or without having to leave the country? Do you know what documents I'll need? Are 6 month contracts easy to come by?? |
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tzechuk
Joined: 20 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 4:28 am Post subject: |
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Yes, from what I understand, you can go to Japan and start work while you wait for your visa to process - that is if you can find a job!
No idea about documents cos I don't live in Japan... the best person I know to ask about this is a user named Tiger Beer. He lives in Japan. |
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b-class rambler
Joined: 25 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 5:27 am Post subject: |
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| tzechuk wrote: |
Yes, from what I understand, you can go to Japan and start work while you wait for your visa to process - that is if you can find a job!
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No, not true. Do NOT go and work in Japan before you've got a proper work visa.
You need to get something called a certificate of eligibilty, which the employer sponsoring you applies for, gets about 2-3 weeks later (or sometimes longer), sends to you and you take to your local Japanese embassy/consulate. It's not common at all, but I have heard of people who arrived in Japan on a tourist visa, who worked while their employer was applying for the CoE and then went on a visa run to get it sorted. But that is very, very dodgy. During that initial period the employer cannot legally pay you, because you can't legally work. Employers who do this often pull tricks like saying you have 3 weeks training/observation or saying that you'll get 2 months salary a month late. If, for any reason, they refuse to pay you for that pre-visa period, you're screwed because the authorities will see you as equally in the wrong and the employer will just deny you were working. So I repeat, get you visa sorted BEFORE you start work in Japan, if you decide to go there.
The category of visa that's roughly equivalent to the Korean E2 and which most EFL teachers in Japan have is called "Specialist in Humanties & International Services". Is it easier to get than the Korean visa? Well, processing time is similar, perhaps longer sometimes. You don't need the medical or criminal checks though.
The main advantage over the Korean E2 is that, once you've got it, you can change jobs mid-visa and the visa still remains valid until the end of the period of validity you were initially given. You do, however, need documentation from your former employer IF/WHEN your visa next has to be renewed, even if you're then with a different employer. They're not supposed to refuse you this documentation and immigration will hassle THEM if they do. But a former employer holding a grudge can give you a bit of a runaround - I was in Japan for over 10 years and I saw that happen a few times.
Be warned that there's a lot of wrong information about Japanese visas on this board. You sometimes see people who seem to think you can just go to Japan and sponsor your own visa. In all but a tiny number of cases, that's completely untrue. You DO need an employer sponsoring you, both when you initially go to Japan, and whenever you subsequently renew the visa.
Switching jobs is easier in Japan than in Korea, no doubt about that. The downside is that you hardly ever get free accommodation or flights paid and your start up costs are likely to be a hell of a lot more.
If you were coming to Korea on an F-2 visa (which the OP asked about on another thread), however, then that'd be a whole different ball game. Easier to get than the E2, not tied to one employer and the above advantages of the Japanese visa wouldn't apply so much. |
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hang10
Joined: 11 Nov 2007
Location: Asia, Twice the sex half the foreplay
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 7:13 am Post subject: Re: How bad is the visa process in other countries? |
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| is so delicious wrote: |
I'm thinking Thailand, China, Japan... which of these places can I go to and begin work quickly, either with or without the proper visa?
Thanks in advance. |
Hi, well thailand isnt as good as it once was but beats Korea on just about every angle but money.
If you have money saved up then good. Your standard of living will be reduced if you intend to live off a thai salary. Your expected income will vary depending on your eventual location. Bangkok is hot as hell heaps of people but the money is there. There are much nicer places to go but the opps for jobs decrease also. Chiang mai is another op for u, but the money is less. The kicks are much better. Great place good environment etc and lots of fun. Visa status has changed here in thailand. Its best to get yourself into a gov school that will give you a year visa and a steady income of 25k thai baht in Chiang mai. If your on your own that should be ok, but dont expect to save anything. Korea is by far the best choice if you need to save. But as you probably aware as i am it sucks for evrything but the cash. Thailand is a drug, its great and very relaxed, may be too much. Try to stay away from the language schools they do offer more money if you work it all out by the month but its seasonal and some months youll have no money at all coming in. Plus the majority of lang schools are in some cases worse than the dam hagwons in KR.
There is of course plenty of ops for private jobs. After a month or so youll be well placed to cash in on the black market of teaching. It isnt as tight arsed as korea, still illegal but most couldnt care. Youll still need an up to date police check thanks to the canadian pedos, and if you have a teaching cert then all the better.
Bottom line, if your good looking, dress smart, act in good manners then the jobs probably yours. Im not racist but as you can imagen the race card is the same as Korea. Its the same across asia.
Hummm, anything else? yea leave korea and never go back it isnt good for your health.
H10 (korean vet) |
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Dude Ranch
Joined: 04 Nov 2008
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 8:16 am Post subject: Re: How bad is the visa process in other countries? |
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| hang10 wrote: |
Its the same across asia.
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Shouldn't it be 'it's' not its? |
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hang10
Joined: 11 Nov 2007
Location: Asia, Twice the sex half the foreplay
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:03 am Post subject: Re: How bad is the visa process in other countries? |
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| Dude Ranch wrote: |
| hang10 wrote: |
Its the same across asia.
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Shouldn't it be 'it's' not its? |
Yea right but guess what im not being paid for this chump! |
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alphakennyone
Joined: 01 Aug 2005
Location: city heights
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:19 am Post subject: |
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I worked before getting my visa in Japan. My moronic employers didn't even BEGIN the process until 3 weeks after I arrived- I suppose my training was probationary. Anyway it took about 4 months before I could get my work visa, which included me taking a visa run to Seoul (the Japanese immigration didn't like that very much).
So yeah, it's a long process in Japan, although there are less hoops to jump through regarding criminal background checks, apostille, visa interviews, medical evaluations, etc.
I've heard it's common to get a 3 year visa starting your 2nd year of work, which would be nice. |
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b-class rambler
Joined: 25 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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| alphakennyone wrote: |
I've heard it's common to get a 3 year visa starting your 2nd year of work, which would be nice. |
Yes, it is, IF you haven't switched jobs during your first year (or the year before your first request for a 3 year extension).
People on this board often go on and on about the freedom to jump from job to job in Japan that you can't do on a Korean E2. And yes, it is indeed possible to change jobs once, twice, even several times in Japan without having to leave and come back on a visa run.
But Japanese immigration do not like people who do this. They won't deport you for it, and as long as you have a sponsor and the correct paperwork at the time of visa renewal, they likely WILL renew it. But foreigners changing jobs often are seen as untrustworthy by Japan immi. They usually won't give these people the 3 year extension and they'll take a lot longer to process the renewal. They also take much longer to process initial CoE applications when the sponsor is a smaller school whom previous foreign employees have run from.
All of this I've seen happen in practice to a number of people and have also heard direct from the horse's mouth. Whilst in Japan I taught several immigration officers, two of whom I remained in touch with after I left. |
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alphakennyone
Joined: 01 Aug 2005
Location: city heights
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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^
Yes, the cases I heard of a 3 year visas were those staying with their school (a far cry from the myth I heard before that EVERYONE got 3 year visas for their first job).
So no it's not like having a green card in America or something, but it's sitll nice not to have to go through the visa process every single year if you're just renewing. |
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beercanman
Joined: 16 May 2009
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farrepatt
Joined: 27 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 5:16 pm Post subject: |
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When I worked in Japan I actually applied for a 1 year visa and was given a 3 year visa. When I asked why my employer told me that immigration thought it would be easier that way and wanted to encourage teachers to stay longer than the year.
Of course I was living up in the north and in a small town. All the people who were getting visas with me that were working in the Osaka or Tokyo area only got 1 year visas. It did come in handy though as I was able to work a few extra months at the end of my year long contract without having to go through any more hoops.
Overall I found the Japanese visa process incredibly easy. Which made all my problems getting my Korean visa processed (even with the approval number) all the more frustrating. And then more aggravation when I had to renew it last year. |
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b-class rambler
Joined: 25 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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| farrepatt wrote: |
Of course I was living up in the north and in a small town. All the people who were getting visas with me that were working in the Osaka or Tokyo area only got 1 year visas. It did come in handy though as I was able to work a few extra months at the end of my year long contract without having to go through any more hoops.
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That's a good point and one that one of the J-immigration guys I know has confirmed. When someone's working away from the major population centres, as long as it's not a school that's got a record of employing too many people who jump ship early, they tend to be more eager to help them out by being readier to give their teachers 3 years on renewal instead of one, knowing that places in the sticks (a) find it harder to retain people and (b) often attract more committed people in the first place.
Incidentally, it's not a complete myth about people getting 3 year visas with their 1st job in Japan. I don't think it happens any more, but there was a period from about 2003-2005ish when some immigration offices were issuing 3 year visas to newbies. But this was stamped out by people higher up in the Ministry of Justice. And one reason I've been told why it was clamped down on was that all of the big chain schools complained they were getting more people quitting early as a result. |
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alphakennyone
Joined: 01 Aug 2005
Location: city heights
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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| b-class rambler wrote: |
| And one reason I've been told why it was clamped down on was that all of the big chain schools complained they were getting more people quitting early as a result. |
Ha! Funny. Back in 2005 when I was looking in Japan, that's exactly what a lot of people were advising - get a crap job at NOVA, milk em for visa sponsorship and to get your feet wet, and then look for a new job! |
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