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linton
Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Location: Seoul
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 Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 8:41 pm Post subject: A real public school story |
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Okay, guys; here is the real public school story.
A few things that have happened: One, I was asked to do an extra school camp at the school where I teach on the same days as the big multi-school camp... So, 9 to 12, I go to one school and then take a taxi and teach at my school from 1:30 to 3. I was told I would be paid for this camp. I did not really want to do it, but I said sure.
Two days later, I was told it would be with no pay... even though that would take me into overtime (which they are not paying).
Then, a few days later, I was told that even though I was told that on the 24th (my last contract day), I would not need to come to work... but it would not count as a vacation since I have to leave the country.
So that had also changed and, since I had no vacation time left, it would count as an unpaid day.
The topping to all this is this: When I was told that after the multi-school summer camp (which is at a different school), I would need to come back to my school to sit at my desk for 3.5 hours.. so I fulfill the 8 hour day requirement. I said no way in hell. After making a fuss, they said I would not need to come back to my school on days that I have nothing to do there.
Public school life (imo) depends on the school where you teach and things can always change. South Korea has no real idea how to use native teachers... but some schools do. |
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PamPhi
Joined: 28 Jun 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:01 pm Post subject: Re: A real public school story |
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| linton wrote: |
Okay, guys; here is the real public school story.
A few things that have happened: One, I was asked to do an extra school camp at the school where I teach on the same days as the big multi-school camp... So, 9 to 12, I go to one school and then take a taxi and teach at my school from 1:30 to 3. I was told I would be paid for this camp. I did not really want to do it, but I said sure.
Two days later, I was told it would be with no pay... even though that would take me into overtime (which they are not paying).
Then, a few days later, I was told that even though I was told that on the 24th (my last contract day), I would not need to come to work... but it would not count as a vacation since I have to leave the country.
So that had also changed and, since I had no vacation time left, it would count as an unpaid day.
The topping to all this is this: When I was told that after the multi-school summer camp (which is at a different school), I would need to come back to my school to sit at my desk for 3.5 hours.. so I fulfill the 8 hour day requirement. I said no way in hell. After making a fuss, they said I would not need to come back to my school on days that I have nothing to do there.
Public school life (imo) depends on the school where you teach and things can always change. South Korea has no real idea how to use native teachers... but some schools do. |
Yeah it sucks that you have bosses like that, but they are right and they are not asking you to do anything not in the contract.
you said working until 3 would bring you into overtime, only by 30 minutes a week. The contract says nothing about what your hours are during a summer camp. If they had the kids there they could make you teach 22 hours without any extra pay as long as they give you yor 21 vacation days in the contract.
You ARE working 30 minutes of overtime a week for the duration of the camp, you could make the case for that, but you will look petty. (not saying that is fair for you, but you willl look petty)
That and you are likely not even going to be working overtime, you may teach for the 40 minute hour and then have ten minutes of breaks. If you get 3 of thise then you are not working overtime at all.
as for the departure date, again that sucks they are bieng such sticklers, but since you have 7 (maybe 14, I forget) days to leave the country from the time you finish your country, its not like you MUST leave on that day.
Now they ARE being over the top, but they are within their rights, as stupid as that sounds |
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linton
Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:14 pm Post subject: |
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This week, the only camp I have is at my school; so this week, my teaching hours go about 6 extra hours. And in the past, immigration has told me that you must leave before yur E2 card expires.
When teachers plan vacation times with a school, that is the time for the school to decide things. They should not say one thing, then change it later. Plus, I did break my vacation into different times so I would have enough time to do the summer camp... and, yes, your vacation times should be together, one in winter and one in summer.
I took one in winter and 2 in summer so I would get the right number of days. Some stuff, not in the contract, is somewhat understood... like the number of schools we work at in one day.
BTW, I do agree that some teachers complain way too much. At the same time, some schools are really not good and I do think many people get sick of being told one thing only to have it be changed a week later. |
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Lou Giconi
Joined: 19 Feb 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:23 pm Post subject: Re: A real public school story |
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[quote="PamPhi"]
| linton wrote: |
Okay, guys; here is the real public school story.
A few things that have happened: One, I was asked to do an extra school camp at the school where I teach on the same days as the big multi-school camp... So, 9 to 12, I go to one school and then take a taxi and teach at my school from 1:30 to 3. I was told I would be paid for this camp. I did not really want to do it, but I said sure.
Two days later, I was told it would be with no pay... even though that would take me into overtime (which they are not paying).
Then, a few days later, I was told that even though I was told that on the 24th (my last contract day), I would not need to come to work... but it would not count as a vacation since I have to leave the country.
So that had also changed and, since I had no vacation time left, it would count as an unpaid day.
The topping to all this is this: When I was told that after the multi-school summer camp (which is at a different school), I would need to come back to my school to sit at my desk for 3.5 hours.. so I fulfill the 8 hour day requirement. I said no way in hell. After making a fuss, they said I would not need to come back to my school on days that I have nothing to do there.
Public school life (imo) depends on the school where you teach and things can always change. South Korea has no real idea how to use native teachers... but some schools do. |
I'm a bit confused on what going on here. Are you working at two different locations? Are you working at one location in the morning and another location in the afternoon? You mentioned taking a taxi from one location to the other.
Are you 'legally' entitled to work at two different locations?
I'm hearing a great deal of chatter on this topic about legality and abiding to the stipulations put forth in the contract... |
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PamPhi
Joined: 28 Jun 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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double post
Last edited by PamPhi on Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:26 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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PamPhi
Joined: 28 Jun 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:26 pm Post subject: |
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| linton wrote: |
This week, the only camp I have is at my school; so this week, my teaching hours go about 6 extra hours. And in the past, immigration has told me that you must leave before yur E2 card expires.
When teachers plan vacation times with a school, that is the time for the school to decide things. They should not say one thing, then change it later. Plus, I did break my vacation into different times so I would have enough time to do the summer camp... and, yes, your vacation times should be together, one in winter and one in summer.
I took one in winter and 2 in summer so I would get the right number of days. Some stuff, not in the contract, is somewhat understood... like the number of schools we work at in one day.
BTW, I do agree that some teachers complain way too much. At the same time, some schools are really not good and I do think many people get sick of being told one thing only to have it be changed a week later. |
The hours you gave before do not total 6, they total 4.5 ( times 5 is 22.5 hours)
You do not have to leave before your visa expires. MOst people need to wait to get pension, final their bills, etc. You have a grace period.
School can always change things later, they are not overly concerned with your personal plans, it sucks but thats the way it is.
Read your contract again, it states quite clearly that you may teach at another school and that you must get there at your own expense.
I have had my school change their minds on a few thing that affected me too, its a pain in the rear, but they also need to manage a school, the teachers, the parents. Its ludicrous to thnk that every decision needs to be prefaced by " how will this effect my foreign teacher."
We still have a fairy cushy deal though right?
I like that you stood up on the desk warming for the 3 hours, but they could make you do them ( as sad as it would be for them to do so) |
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Lou Giconi
Joined: 19 Feb 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:27 pm Post subject: Re: A real public school story |
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| linton wrote: |
Okay, guys; here is the real public school story.
A few things that have happened: One, I was asked to do an extra school camp at the school where I teach on the same days as the big multi-school camp... So, 9 to 12, I go to one school and then take a taxi and teach at my school from 1:30 to 3. I was told I would be paid for this camp. I did not really want to do it, but I said sure.
Two days later, I was told it would be with no pay... even though that would take me into overtime (which they are not paying).
Then, a few days later, I was told that even though I was told that on the 24th (my last contract day), I would not need to come to work... but it would not count as a vacation since I have to leave the country.
So that had also changed and, since I had no vacation time left, it would count as an unpaid day.
The topping to all this is this: When I was told that after the multi-school summer camp (which is at a different school), I would need to come back to my school to sit at my desk for 3.5 hours.. so I fulfill the 8 hour day requirement. I said no way in hell. After making a fuss, they said I would not need to come back to my school on days that I have nothing to do there.
Public school life (imo) depends on the school where you teach and things can always change. South Korea has no real idea how to use native teachers... but some schools do. |
You want to explain if you are legally entitled to work at a different location or not?
I'm hearing a great deal of chatter on abiding to the stipulations in the contract and legal obligations etc.
So, I'd like to know if you are 'legally' entitled to work at two different locations or not... |
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PamPhi
Joined: 28 Jun 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:27 pm Post subject: Re: A real public school story |
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[quote="Lou Giconi"]
| PamPhi wrote: |
| linton wrote: |
Okay, guys; here is the real public school story.
A few things that have happened: One, I was asked to do an extra school camp at the school where I teach on the same days as the big multi-school camp... So, 9 to 12, I go to one school and then take a taxi and teach at my school from 1:30 to 3. I was told I would be paid for this camp. I did not really want to do it, but I said sure.
Two days later, I was told it would be with no pay... even though that would take me into overtime (which they are not paying).
Then, a few days later, I was told that even though I was told that on the 24th (my last contract day), I would not need to come to work... but it would not count as a vacation since I have to leave the country.
So that had also changed and, since I had no vacation time left, it would count as an unpaid day.
The topping to all this is this: When I was told that after the multi-school summer camp (which is at a different school), I would need to come back to my school to sit at my desk for 3.5 hours.. so I fulfill the 8 hour day requirement. I said no way in hell. After making a fuss, they said I would not need to come back to my school on days that I have nothing to do there.
Public school life (imo) depends on the school where you teach and things can always change. South Korea has no real idea how to use native teachers... but some schools do. |
I'm a bit confused on what going on here. Are you working at two different locations? Are you working at one location in the morning and another location in the afternoon? You mentioned taking a taxi from one location to the other.
Are you 'legally' entitled to work at two different locations?
I'm hearing a great deal of chatter on this topic about legality and abiding to the stipulations put forth in the contract... |
Yes you can work at 2 different locations.
We do not work for our location, we work for SMOE. As a member of SMOE we are asked to go to a certain school, but we can teach at any one of them without VISA issues. |
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Burndog
Joined: 17 Feb 2008
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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PamPhi
| Quote: |
| The hours you gave before do not total 6, they total 4.5 ( times 5 is 22.5 hours) |
In a PS (elementary) one teaching hour is forty minutes...NOT sixty minutes...so he is teaching a LOT more than you stated. Also...during Summer and Winter vacation the contract states that we are required to teach camp for 20 hours per week (excluding when we are on vacation).
As far as desksitting...it's a school by school thing...we can't choose it...BUT you are teaching overtime...your school MUST pay you for it. Be firm. |
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Lou Giconi
Joined: 19 Feb 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:36 pm Post subject: Re: A real public school story |
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[quote="PamPhi"]
| Lou Giconi wrote: |
| PamPhi wrote: |
| linton wrote: |
Okay, guys; here is the real public school story.
A few things that have happened: One, I was asked to do an extra school camp at the school where I teach on the same days as the big multi-school camp... So, 9 to 12, I go to one school and then take a taxi and teach at my school from 1:30 to 3. I was told I would be paid for this camp. I did not really want to do it, but I said sure.
Two days later, I was told it would be with no pay... even though that would take me into overtime (which they are not paying).
Then, a few days later, I was told that even though I was told that on the 24th (my last contract day), I would not need to come to work... but it would not count as a vacation since I have to leave the country.
So that had also changed and, since I had no vacation time left, it would count as an unpaid day.
The topping to all this is this: When I was told that after the multi-school summer camp (which is at a different school), I would need to come back to my school to sit at my desk for 3.5 hours.. so I fulfill the 8 hour day requirement. I said no way in hell. After making a fuss, they said I would not need to come back to my school on days that I have nothing to do there.
Public school life (imo) depends on the school where you teach and things can always change. South Korea has no real idea how to use native teachers... but some schools do. |
I'm a bit confused on what going on here. Are you working at two different locations? Are you working at one location in the morning and another location in the afternoon? You mentioned taking a taxi from one location to the other.
Are you 'legally' entitled to work at two different locations?
I'm hearing a great deal of chatter on this topic about legality and abiding to the stipulations put forth in the contract... |
Yes you can work at 2 different locations.
We do not work for our location, we work for SMOE. As a member of SMOE we are asked to go to a certain school, but we can teach at any one of them without VISA issues. |
Is there a stipulation for travel time in your contracts? What stops them from farming you out to any location in the the metropolitan region that requires a great deal of commuting time? |
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PamPhi
Joined: 28 Jun 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Burndog wrote: |
PamPhi
| Quote: |
| The hours you gave before do not total 6, they total 4.5 ( times 5 is 22.5 hours) |
In a PS (elementary) one teaching hour is forty minutes...NOT sixty minutes...so he is teaching a LOT more than you stated. Also...during Summer and Winter vacation the contract states that we are required to teach camp for 20 hours per week (excluding when we are on vacation).
As far as desksitting...it's a school by school thing...we can't choose it...BUT you are teaching overtime...your school MUST pay you for it. Be firm. |
I suppose you are right, however the contract doesn't make that clear.
Imagine going to the labor board with that
LB - by our math you are not wrking overtime"
Teacher - Yes I am because an hour is 40 minutes not 60
LB - HUH? |
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PamPhi
Joined: 28 Jun 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:56 pm Post subject: Re: A real public school story |
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[quote="Lou Giconi"]
| PamPhi wrote: |
| Lou Giconi wrote: |
| PamPhi wrote: |
| linton wrote: |
Okay, guys; here is the real public school story.
A few things that have happened: One, I was asked to do an extra school camp at the school where I teach on the same days as the big multi-school camp... So, 9 to 12, I go to one school and then take a taxi and teach at my school from 1:30 to 3. I was told I would be paid for this camp. I did not really want to do it, but I said sure.
Two days later, I was told it would be with no pay... even though that would take me into overtime (which they are not paying).
Then, a few days later, I was told that even though I was told that on the 24th (my last contract day), I would not need to come to work... but it would not count as a vacation since I have to leave the country.
So that had also changed and, since I had no vacation time left, it would count as an unpaid day.
The topping to all this is this: When I was told that after the multi-school summer camp (which is at a different school), I would need to come back to my school to sit at my desk for 3.5 hours.. so I fulfill the 8 hour day requirement. I said no way in hell. After making a fuss, they said I would not need to come back to my school on days that I have nothing to do there.
Public school life (imo) depends on the school where you teach and things can always change. South Korea has no real idea how to use native teachers... but some schools do. |
I'm a bit confused on what going on here. Are you working at two different locations? Are you working at one location in the morning and another location in the afternoon? You mentioned taking a taxi from one location to the other.
Are you 'legally' entitled to work at two different locations?
I'm hearing a great deal of chatter on this topic about legality and abiding to the stipulations put forth in the contract... |
Yes you can work at 2 different locations.
We do not work for our location, we work for SMOE. As a member of SMOE we are asked to go to a certain school, but we can teach at any one of them without VISA issues. |
Is there a stipulation for travel time in your contracts? What stops them from farming you out to any location in the the metropolitan region that requires a great deal of commuting time? |
NOTHING!!!!!!
your 8 hours are THEIR time not yours, they pay you for an 8 hour day and can basically make you do anything and send you anywhere during your "off time" as long as yu are not teaching more han 22 hours |
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linton
Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 10:13 pm Post subject: |
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"NOTHING!!!!!!
your 8 hours are THEIR time not yours, they pay you for an 8 hour day and can basically make you do anything and send you anywhere during your "off time" as long as yu are not teaching more han 22 hours"
Wrong |
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Mr. BlackCat
Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Location: Insert witty remark HERE
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 10:20 pm Post subject: |
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PamPhi wrote:
| Quote: |
I suppose you are right, however the contract doesn't make that clear.
Imagine going to the labor board with that
LB - by our math you are not wrking overtime"
Teacher - Yes I am because an hour is 40 minutes not 60
LB - HUH? |
Except it explicitly says in the contract that one teaching hour is a 40 minute class (for elementary), and that 22 teaching hours = 22 classes. It works the same way with the Korean teachers, so I don't think there should be any confusion.
The OP hasn't said if his contract is with SMOE or EPIK (or someting else), but I know with SMOE your contract is with the board of education, not the school, so you can indeed be farmed out at will. However, if it really is far I would demand travel costs. Also, from the schedule the OP metioned, he would only really have a 1.5 break and that would be used for travelling. I would have issues with that. For the record, I will be doing a similar thing this summer, but at least I know I'll be getting OT and a travel allowance so I'm willing to take the 1 hour I get to travel/eat.
OP, your school sounds poopy, it really is a crapshoot. Mine has been good so far, but next semester will bring a new Principal, VP and co-teacher, so we'll see how it goes from there. And remember, it could be worse. You could be in a hogwan where they make you work 12 classes a day during the kids' vacation for very little OT, if any, and a one week vacation. If you're lucky, that is. I'm speaking from experience. |
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Lou Giconi
Joined: 19 Feb 2009
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 10:24 pm Post subject: Re: A real public school story |
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[quote="PamPhi"]
| Lou Giconi wrote: |
| PamPhi wrote: |
| Lou Giconi wrote: |
| PamPhi wrote: |
| linton wrote: |
Okay, guys; here is the real public school story.
A few things that have happened: One, I was asked to do an extra school camp at the school where I teach on the same days as the big multi-school camp... So, 9 to 12, I go to one school and then take a taxi and teach at my school from 1:30 to 3. I was told I would be paid for this camp. I did not really want to do it, but I said sure.
Two days later, I was told it would be with no pay... even though that would take me into overtime (which they are not paying).
Then, a few days later, I was told that even though I was told that on the 24th (my last contract day), I would not need to come to work... but it would not count as a vacation since I have to leave the country.
So that had also changed and, since I had no vacation time left, it would count as an unpaid day.
The topping to all this is this: When I was told that after the multi-school summer camp (which is at a different school), I would need to come back to my school to sit at my desk for 3.5 hours.. so I fulfill the 8 hour day requirement. I said no way in hell. After making a fuss, they said I would not need to come back to my school on days that I have nothing to do there.
Public school life (imo) depends on the school where you teach and things can always change. South Korea has no real idea how to use native teachers... but some schools do. |
I'm a bit confused on what going on here. Are you working at two different locations? Are you working at one location in the morning and another location in the afternoon? You mentioned taking a taxi from one location to the other.
Are you 'legally' entitled to work at two different locations?
I'm hearing a great deal of chatter on this topic about legality and abiding to the stipulations put forth in the contract... |
Yes you can work at 2 different locations.
We do not work for our location, we work for SMOE. As a member of SMOE we are asked to go to a certain school, but we can teach at any one of them without VISA issues. |
Is there a stipulation for travel time in your contracts? What stops them from farming you out to any location in the the metropolitan region that requires a great deal of commuting time? |
NOTHING!!!!!!
your 8 hours are THEIR time not yours, they pay you for an 8 hour day and can basically make you do anything and send you anywhere during your "off time" as long as yu are not teaching more han 22 hours |
Shitty... You'd have to be a real tool to accept a contract like that ... Man, these PS jobs certainly sound like crappola! |
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