Korean Job Discussion Forums

[ericminneapolis]

What is the job market like for a teacher, close to an MA in TEFL, for getting Univeristy Jobs?

[ABC KID]

[Ruraljuror]

Here's the deal...I know I am going to get slammed for this. The OP is going to make some snide remark about how he/she was "typing in a hurry" and imply he/she has far too important things to do to worry about how he/she communicates on a message board. Then a bunch of other people are going to post talking about how I'm a big *beep* for picking on him/her.

I know all of this, and yet I still have to point out:

That the funniest post thing I have read all day is someone looking for a job in higher education, who is close to a MA in TEFL, writing "Univeristy" in the subject of his/her post.

[butlerian]

Simple answer:

Get an MA (in something), get some experience teaching in Korea, and make a good CV/resume and cover letter. You will get a lot of interviews, guaranteed.

[ericminneapolis]

Lol! Um, was your comment not a snide remark? Of course I will respond:


All that babble to correct a spelling mistake? Good thing my experience is not connected to my spelling. But thanks for taking the time to point that out.

Hey, it's a good thing Second Language Acquisition and Instruction are minimally connected to spelling competency. In fact, the field is much more connected to Anthropology and Educational Psychology than it is to those who were "good in English" insofar as being decent spellers, or perhaps those who "majored in English."


Insofar as a university job, thank you to butlerian for the last advice. I am near completion of my MA in ESL and will have degree in hand when I finish my contract. By that time, I will have taught adults in Korea for a full year, plus some teaching experience in the US.


What I have found in my few weeks here is that there are some very decent teachers here . . . and many more not so good ones. What I have also found are many teachers without training in education, or TEFL training . . . and few with an advanced degree in any field.


So, when it is time to interview for a job, and I find myself being compared with the person who has a hard time handling a misspelled word . . . well, I like my odds and qualifications more. And seeing that I have actual qualifications to teach in the U.S. in multiple settings . . . well, perhaps I should be more careful when posting things on this website in that someone might "find out" who I am and end my career in education or something. Oh, and what is "post thing?" Is that like "Googling" something?


Thanks again for the feedback.

[rationality]

[iggyb]

I just finished my MA-Teaching (English) program yesterday here in the US.

I'll be certified to teach secondary school in the state, and I'll be certified in TESOL too due to previous course work as an undergraduate.

My BA is in English from a college ranked in the top 120 in the nation for undergraduate liberal arts -- and I have nice links to US News & World Report rankings for the school. I also took double the amount of lit. courses needed to graduate.

Plus, I did 1 year of a 2 year MA program in Eng. lit. where I co-taught freshman writing and tutored in the writing center.

And I taught in hakwons in Korea for over 4 years.

..........and I've applied for about 5 university teaching positions in Korea in the last two months....

and have only been contacted by one of them, and since they asked to set up an interview and I explained I am not in Korea, I haven't heard back from them.

.....When I first started looking for jobs in the Seoul area for adult hakwons or college gigs, I figured I'd have a fairly easy shot...

.....but then when applications didn't get any response ------ I started to think along the lines of the last comment above:

Maybe the managers aren't so keen to hire someone who has years of experience in Korea's ESL industry, because those people will no more about the labor law and job market and release letters and labor boards and other things related to being an expat in Korea in an industry notorious for its poor treatment of workers....???....

[rationality]

[Demophobe]

[Thiuda]

[ericminneapolis]

Oh, this is just getting silly.

Have I left you with the impression that I would be unable to teach students how to structure essays, build thesis statements, have well developed paragraphs, transitional sentences, and conclusions that would prepare them for study in the States in various fields?


I can't tell you how many "good spellers" and "English majors" I've met who are poor writers and who are unable to teach writing skills to students of various backgrounds.


Please put more thought when giving advice about what one should and should not teach, and what one can and can not teach.

[ericminneapolis]

Oh, I guess if I am rambling and venting about the subject . . . I met a MA in English 8 years ago who was teaching at a University in Korea. Though I had not been in his class, it was obvious the man knew little about instruction or learning. He simply "was good at English" and made a go at a MA in some type of Lit field. He could not find a job back in the States, so he ended up out here (My guess is that his "writing skills" were not marketable enough for professional work).


I think the point here is that the man, and many other "English majors" I've met, are often quite arrogant in that they believe their major makes them able to teach English, especially in EFL settings. It is laughable in that there is no one-to-one connection behind, say, being a spelling champ and English lit major and having the beginnings of a clue of how to teach that which seems to come easy to them.


During my 12 years teaching in a small high school in the US, I had never met one English major who could "teach writing" to any of the students who did not have an innate ability to spell well, to construct decent sentences, and to build some type of introductions and conclusions into their writing. More importantly, I did not work with one English major (licensed, secondary English teacher!) who would help our lower level students pass basic writing skills tests. I ended up teaching my own class on study skills and writing that built up all of our lower level students to the point of passing standard tests. Our "English teachers" knew how to write and how to spell, but had the hardest time relaying their skills to students who did not have the same dispositions. The "elementary teachers" I knew would have had a better go at teaching writing to teens . . . including to the teens who were already strong writers.


In addition, I have been told from several applied linguistics departments (you know, the people who research and train people how to teach EFL . . . perhaps the two cynical posters to my thread have heard of this field?), that they avoid English Lit majors in that they have too many preconceived notions of what EFL instruction is and how languages are learned.


Now, this is not to say that there are not many, MANY, wonderful teachers who were English majors, great spellers and proofreaders, and the like. I know I have studied under many. The vibe I have always received from such teachers is that of support, investigation rather than assumption, and focus on detail without letting detail detour the larger points of what writing is all about. These are the same individuals who help learners from all backgrounds and skill levels to become better in written communication, and in understanding various types of writing.


Good luck to anyone who reads my thread. Teachers who are serious about their filed(s) should be held in high esteem.

[Mr. Pink]

ericminneapolis:

Just re-read your comment: There are more good English majors out there than bad. It just seems the good ones don't come to Korea. (Excluding me of course!)

In all seriousness though, think of it this way:

Some people get their degree by just having the bare minimum to succeed, and others go all out and get that 3.5-4.0 GPA.

Also, American teachers have a lot easier time getting certified than those in Canada. So, yes you might have had some really bad English teachers in schools where you worked. Don't blame it on the teachers, blame on a system that doesn't weed out those who shouldn't be teaching. Canada pays their teachers pretty good, so tons of people try to go into teaching as it is a safe, secure and guaranteed job for life. Due to this, the system weeds out those who "just got by" for their degree.

[madoka]

[ericminneapolis]

To the two previous posters,

Actually, the teachers I worked with did have near 4.0 GPA's in college. But again, just because you are a good student, and you do well in Lit classes, does not mean you will be a good teacher in any subject area.


English teaching jobs in the states are hard to get in that there are so many people with the degrees chasing the same few jobs. What usually happens is that the really good teachers grow in their abilities and find the good school's and districts to work for. The shit jobs (the ones in the tough schools with the tough kids . . . not really shit, just hard and disheartening) are where the people with little experience or poor skills end up either to stay, or to find out that teaching can really suck. There are a lot of potentially good teachers who simply burn out in their first year or two and never go back.


Ya, the "edumacation" issue or whatever it's being called is a joke. "Hating" is a good phrase used to describe it. I do, however, wish I had stronger proofreading skills than I do. But then again, I wouldn't trade everything else I do well (like think complex, abstract thoughts and writing my first book) just to avoid making a typo here and there.

Oh, Mr. Pink. There are indeed a lot of good English majors out there. But as you know, being a good English major does not mean that one has the skills or desire to teach . . . and again, being an English Major does not make one a language teacher. I guess that is my only point. I've met some people who consume literature, who are grammar experts by nature, and who can write like crazy . . . who also know they want nothing to do with teaching.

Peace