Korean Job Discussion Forums

[guerillera]

What would you do if you were offered a job that payed better than many other jobs out there but were not given the hours that you would be working in the contract?

Let say you were offered 3 million-4 million per month but the school's director refused to include your hours per week. When you requested a limit to the number of hours you would work per week, the boss told you that you could work hourly but that you would lose your housing/airfare assistance. The boss then went on to say that at the hourly rate you requested you'd only work 70-80 hours per month which would have you allegedly making less than the proposed salary and leave you without housing.

Sorry if this is confusing. I am trying to figure out if I am being given the run around. It seems that I am being told either work without end for a high sum or live with the uncertainty that I might not make rent and save as much as I am planning.

What do you think?

[okayden223]

For that kind of money you will most likely be getting driven into the ground with hours. The only similar thing I can think of is an ad I saw on dave's for a school that would pay 3.5 but it meant working Mon-Sat from 2-11 each day. If money is the issue then go for it, but quality of life in Korea should be a big factor in your decision. You're not necessarily going to have fun co-workers to diffuse tense situations and there will be plenty of things that don't make sense on a day-to-day basis. At the end of the year you probably could have some nice change in the bank, but that's a year of your life.

[Carla]

[Theo]

If the perspective employer is repeatedly dodging the answers to very fair and reasonable questions, FORGET him! There's bound to only be more trouble down the road. It seems he's looking to enslave someone, by requiring them (without actually telling them) to be "on call" any day, at any time.

He's not stupid, but rather very cunning by not stating clear, understanding terms. And I'd also go as far to say that if he can't trusted about the number of hours/shifts, etc., then how can he possibly be trusted to pay the "high salary"???

Don't be blinded by the money.

Good luck, and hope you keep on walking...

[guerillera]

During our first conversation, the director offered me 40K KRW/hr. This is for SAT-ish/AP stuff so that sounded on the low end to me since other teachers have told me that I can make 40K-50K KRW/hr with a top ranked degree and teaching experience. I have requested that she raise my proposed hourly rate but she has resisted at every turn and pushed this monthly salary proposal.

I told her in my most recent email that even at her previously-proposed 40K KRW/hr I should be working no more than 25 hours/week. She is strongly resisting any mention of how many hours I will work and wants me to be content with working for an undefined number of hours five days a week including Saturday and Sunday. I think she is worried that I'll try to get overtime but I am fine working just for this salary as long as I am not forced to work 30+ hrs/wk.

I guess the problem is that since this is the off season for them (starting in Sep.) that she won't be making as much money from students and as such doesn't want to pay me hourly for developing their curriculum or whatever other office tasks she has planned for me.

Advice?

[okayden223]

So housing is or isn't included? Because your average PS teacher is going to pull maybe $12-15 hr. That doesn't include the perks like free housing, etc. But it's almost counterproductive for a school to offer an uncapped schedule at $32/hr (give or take depending on the day) you could really put it away. I'm thinking that there's a huge catch and you'd be better off working for a school where things are a little more structured.

[guerillera]

Yeah, the director is offering me something that is very nebulous/"unstructured." She proposed a salary and a housing allowance. When I said I wanted a cap on my hours per month, she said that she would pay me by the hour but no longer offer a housing allowance.

I have sent her a third email requesting a cap. If she refuses, I will probably be turning down the job.

Thanks for your advice everyone!

[Kikomom]

It seems there are more loony contracts out there than Carter's little pills. This one sounds like she wants to cater to students who tell HER when they want to schedule class--and you oblige. Reminds me of the guy who was teaching babies in his boss's living room.

Are there other FT's there that you can speak to about how they are getting along?

[cruisemonkey]

Turn it down!

[Carla]

[gartonator]

I had a similar contract with my first year teaching in 06/07... i was teaching SAT/AP stuff at an 'elite hagwon'... I think I know why they won't say the exact hours....

here's how my old hagwon did it :

they said that a teacher's average hours teaching per week would never exceed 30 hours, but that was after balancing out the entire year, they said I'd work more than 30 in the winter/summer, less in the spring/fall... so basically they were saying no overtime... and that seemed fine. I'd work 12 hours some weeks when I first arrived in the fall, it was easy at first...

THEN during winter intensives the foreign teachers had to make their own textbooks in a week (none of us had more than a few months teaching experience) I would teach from 8am to 10pm some days... I would have a contest with my students at the beginning of every class to see who slept the least the night before (I got less than 4 hours sleep 90% of the time)... so my guess is that including class prep and the 750 essays I was trying to grade each week, I was easily working some +100 hour weeks during winter intensives... it was hell (every year a student ended up in the hospital on IV fluids from exhaustion, it was a joke "we're going to send you to the hospital!") it was like a cult and somehow we were all on-board, only 3 foreign teachers including myself, korean teachers would often sleep at their desk in the school all night, I slept in the copy room during lunch, students would come in on saturdays just to study at the school and feel the ridiculous delirious buzz of it all, the owner/teacher specialized in extreme vocabulary and would have kids memorize 1000 words a night, some words were out of the national spelling bee...I'd never seen or heard these words before (this is mostly for 8th graders, and they'd get hit up to 100 times a day for not memorizing the words)

how the hell did I last a year in such ridiculousness?
- I was green and didn't know better
- I was happy with my good monthly wage and just accepted that 'overtime' didn't exist in Korea
- Our hagwon owner was an insane, but likeable guy who sometimes took the entire school out on weekend trips and mini-vacations sometimes, so it was hard not to feel indebted and part of the team
- Horrible as it was, it was an experience that I'll never forget, I don't think I've ever worked so hard in my life... being sleep deprived made me so wired that I actually became the most engaging teacher during these times... it was inspired madness... students cried at the end of winter intensives because they were going to miss it...

ps - in retrospect I wonder if I could have just found 2 easy back-to-back elementary-"this is a dog" type jobs and made more money, never given a shit about anybody at either school... I'm happy I did the first year, I know I can function in any classroom now, but I am NOT looking for a repeat experience for 09/10

I'm working on a video series about the experience actually... it may not make much sense, but :

http://www.youtube.com/oneyearinkorea