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Gangnam not that expensive to live in
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According to the article, where do you land in terms of household income?
In the 10% (10 million)
31%
 31%  [ 5 ]
In the 16% (between 5 to 10 million)
37%
 37%  [ 6 ]
In the 12% (3 million to 4 million)
6%
 6%  [ 1 ]
In the 13.5% (1 to 2.99 million) Yes, I changed it a bit.
25%
 25%  [ 4 ]
Total Votes : 16

Author Message
cubanlord



Joined: 08 Jul 2005
Location: In Japan!

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 4:37 am    Post subject: Gangnam not that expensive to live in Reply with quote

http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2009/09/113_51818.html

Quote:
The average monthly household income for the wealthiest part of Gangnam is estimated at 4.8 million won, the district office said Monday.

This compares with the city average of 3.6 million won.

The statistics were included in an annual district white paper published Monday.

Even in Gangnam, income levels differ from one area to another.

Apgujeong, the "hip" town inside the district that is home to expensive boutiques and restaurants, and its neighbor Nonhyeon, top the list at 5.34 million won in average monthly household income.

Cheongdam and Samseong follow at 5.27 million won. Ilwon and Suseo, areas being newly developed, are low on the scale, with their income estimated at 4.28 million won. Yeoksam and Dogeok are at the bottom.

About 10 percent of the households earn 10 million or more won per month; 16 percent between 5 million and 10 million won; and 12 percent between 3 million and 4 million won. About 13.5 percent make less than 1 million won.


I am VERY surprised! With all of the hoop-da with Gangnam being wealthy, etc., I'd have thought that the average income would be much more than that. Shoot, according to the statistics quoted in the article, my wife and I are in the 16th percent bracket!


Last edited by cubanlord on Mon Sep 14, 2009 6:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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He with Horns on Head



Joined: 19 Aug 2009
Location: Cybergoat farm

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 5:02 am    Post subject: Re: Gangnam not that expensive to live in Reply with quote

cubanlord wrote:
http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2009/09/113_51818.html

Quote:
The average monthly household income for the wealthiest part of Gangnam is estimated at 4.8 million won, the district office said Monday.

This compares with the city average of 3.6 million won.

The statistics were included in an annual district white paper published Monday.

Even in Gangnam, income levels differ from one area to another.

Apgujeong, the "hip" town inside the district that is home to expensive boutiques and restaurants, and its neighbor Nonhyeon, top the list at 5.34 million won in average monthly household income.

Cheongdam and Samseong follow at 5.27 million won. Ilwon and Suseo, areas being newly developed, are low on the scale, with their income estimated at 4.28 million won. Yeoksam and Dogeok are at the bottom.

About 10 percent of the households earn 10 million or more won per month; 16 percent between 5 million and 10 million won; and 12 percent between 3 million and 4 million won. About 13.5 percent make less than 1 million won.


I am VERY surprised! With all of the hoop-da with Gangnam being wealthy, etc., I'd have thought that the average income would be much more than that. Shoot, according to the statistics quoted in the article, my wife and I are in the 16th percent bracket!


Today I ate eggs.
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halfmanhalfbiscuit



Joined: 13 Oct 2007
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 5:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had shin ramyun and half a bottle of soju from the back of the fridge
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cdninkorea



Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 5:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Then again, how much of the Korean economy is underground? I think I read it was 27%. I wonder if they're counting things like cash bonuses, etc.
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He with Horns on Head



Joined: 19 Aug 2009
Location: Cybergoat farm

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I sense too much double digit IQ in this thread, one poster only.

Today I swam to Florida.
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beercanman



Joined: 16 May 2009

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 5:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

He with Horns on Head wrote:
I sense too much double digit IQ in this thread, one poster only.

.


Eh, don't be so hard on yerself.
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shinramyun



Joined: 31 Jul 2009

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

All esl teachers kiss up to koreans.
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Goku



Joined: 10 Dec 2008

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 6:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't really agree with the the perspective of the author.

1.2 million won more a month is nothing to scoff at.

That adds up to a lot in disposable income when you compare it to the rest of the city.

Think about comparing the yearly amounts of earning 45.6mil to 57.6.

In terms of absolute values, it seems small. But it's extra 12 million every year. That's half a year's salary to some of us.

12 million more a year is enough to distinguish from somewhat wealthy to wealthy. Percentage and absolute value wise it seems little. But that's because we aren't looking at the marginal additions.

Every little more income you make is wealth added to luxury items. Having 12 million extra a year to spend means I can dish out for a channel bag instead of a LV one. Or that I can go on spend 1.2 million more a month, which is almost 300,000 won a week. on a fancy dinner.
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marlow



Joined: 06 Feb 2005

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think we swallowed the hype as well. Owning a box in a desired part of the city doesn't equal a good life. The extra income is probably being used for two things--servicing a huge mortgage and making payments on a luxury car.
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bassexpander



Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Someplace you'd rather be.

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 6:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Gangnam not that expensive to live in Reply with quote

cubanlord wrote:
http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2009/09/113_51818.html

Quote:
The average monthly household income for the wealthiest part of Gangnam is estimated at 4.8 million won, the district office said Monday.

This compares with the city average of 3.6 million won.

The statistics were included in an annual district white paper published Monday.

Even in Gangnam, income levels differ from one area to another.

Apgujeong, the "hip" town inside the district that is home to expensive boutiques and restaurants, and its neighbor Nonhyeon, top the list at 5.34 million won in average monthly household income.

Cheongdam and Samseong follow at 5.27 million won. Ilwon and Suseo, areas being newly developed, are low on the scale, with their income estimated at 4.28 million won. Yeoksam and Dogeok are at the bottom.

About 10 percent of the households earn 10 million or more won per month; 16 percent between 5 million and 10 million won; and 12 percent between 3 million and 4 million won. About 13.5 percent make less than 1 million won.


I am VERY surprised! With all of the hoop-da with Gangnam being wealthy, etc., I'd have thought that the average income would be much more than that. Shoot, according to the statistics quoted in the article, my wife and I are in the 16th percent bracket!


Salary and benefits are often greatly under-reported. My wife works in mid-management at an international company. She's just short of the level where she would be able to see some of that unreported income.

As she's learned over the years, there is a MASSIVE amount of cheating going on by sales and management in various companies in Korea. Just as an example of something that happens at other companies she knows of (and on a constant basis).....

Imagine a sales manager working for an international company. He is in charge of selling and advertising products. This manager has to work closely with an individual from the advertising agency.

They go to the room salon together and make a "special deal" where they both agree to fudge the numbers on actual per-unit product sales and advertising costs. The agency provides the manager from the international company fake billing documentation at a higher amount. The sales manager gets the go-ahead from the head offices in the USA to work the deal at that price (the fake inflated price).

The agency friend gets the large chunk of cash, which is sent directly from the international company (who has learned not to trust Korean managers with the money directly, due to being burned and having to fire Korean managers in the past). That large chunk, which is actually more than the agency demanded, is split into two chunks -- one to pay for the actual costs of products or advertising, while the left-over is siphoned-off into a special bank account for the manager (with a kickback for the agency guy who provided the fake documentation -- or at the very least, a promise to continue business with that agency).

In this way, Korean managers screw the living daylights out of International companies -- making millions of won every month. The International company is none-the-wiser, because fake documentation has been provided for billing purposes by the agency.

This is not just a Korean phenomenon, but let me tell you -- it's as common as breathing in this country. If you guys knew how many billions of won businesspeople make through schemes like this, you'd be sick. Personally, it makes me sick.
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the crusher



Joined: 06 Sep 2009

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

my mother says to stay away from here Sad
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Unposter



Joined: 04 Jun 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bassexpander has a lot of good information there.

There is a lot of reasons why these numbers are skewed. First of all, Koreans usually use averages and not means, which means the numbers are always skewed.

But also:

1. There is a huge underground economy in Korea and a lot of income goes unreported, especially if you are a small business owner.

2. There is actually a large number of people, students even, who live in one-room "apartments" in Gangnam. Such people are going to lower the average income. I would want to know what the average salary of those living in the apartments.

3. There are a number retired people who live in Gangnam on fixed incomes that would bring the averages down.

4. There are probably a lot of people who have made a lot of investment income in the past but made none or lost money in the last year bringing down the income average assuming that investment income is even included in these avearages as it may not.

5. It most likely does not include bonuses, royalties or sales commissions which are not considered "regular" income.

Most of these people are quite well off.
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Unposter



Joined: 04 Jun 2006

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, I read the whole article now and it says that it is a survey of 4,750 people in 2,000 households so I guess this means that it is not everyone living in Gangnam and it is what these people claimed they earned so it is completely unscientific.

I would say that survey is meaningless.
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cubanlord



Joined: 08 Jul 2005
Location: In Japan!

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 7:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unposter wrote:
Okay, I read the whole article now and it says that it is a survey of 4,750 people in 2,000 households so I guess this means that it is not everyone living in Gangnam and it is what these people claimed they earned so it is completely unscientific.

I would say that survey is meaningless.


Very true.
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JongnoGuru



Joined: 25 May 2004
Location: peeing on your doorstep

PostPosted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unposter wrote:
There is a lot of reasons why these numbers are skewed. First of all, Koreans usually use averages and not means, which means the numbers are always skewed.

That's the big one. And it is irritating. Well, it's the median they leave out.

4.8 mil. a month for a household in Gangnam? Those are just numbers on a screen. Wouldn't even cover the booze & hooker bills.

Some years ago, one of the papers ran the annual stats on average monthly household expenses. So I'm reading down the list of items, and I'm not seeing the biggie -- the big-ticket item you'd see right at the top of a household expense breakdown in the West: Housing. Where is it? I'm seeing food, education/hagwon fees, car payments, dining out, this & that... and then way down near the bottom, "Housing" finally stumbles onto the list -- at 45,000 won per month. Question And the Koreans in my office all said "yeah, that's about right". Huh?

Oh, and Cuba Man? Ya screwed up the damn poll options there for 1 & 2. I can't vote. Hmm... 2 & 3 are also wonky. What if a person earns 4.5 million?
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