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I'm no Picasso
Joined: 28 Oct 2008
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 Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 5:48 pm Post subject: Gyopo friend; army service -- advice. |
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| So it's the same old story -- gyopo friend of mine's father has a Korean id number, and now he's facing military service or having to leave the ROK for good. I don't really know anything about this -- he probably knows a lot more than I do -- but I'm meeting him today and would like to be somewhat helpful if possible. Anybody have any experience, advice or resources he can check out? Thanks. |
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nosmallplans
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: noksapyeong
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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Gyopo born in Korea or Gyopo born in America?
If it's the former, then your friend is SOL. If it's the latter then he should find himself a lawyer - though I find it highly unlikely that that is the case. |
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dc'79
Joined: 01 Jun 2008
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I'm no Picasso
Joined: 28 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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He was born in the US, actually. I have no idea whether or not his name is in the national registry. I would assume it is, if this is coming up as an issue.
Thanks dc'79. I'll give that a good read-through.
The other thing is that, our other friend (Korean) who mentioned this said, specifically, "His father is Korean," with no mention about his mother's nationality. I don't know if he's just confused and thinks that the father being Korean is the deciding factor, or if this means his mother was already a US citizen, or what.
I don't have many details at this point, but I'll come back with more later. |
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nosmallplans
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: noksapyeong
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:19 pm Post subject: |
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| If you're born in the States you don't have to do the service. It's that simple. If they are demanding that of him, then he either needs to get a lawyer or find his birth certificate. |
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dc'79
Joined: 01 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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| nosmallplans wrote: |
| If you're born in the States you don't have to do the service. It's that simple. If they are demanding that of him, then he either needs to get a lawyer or find his birth certificate. |
Unless things have changed recently...to my knowledge this is not true.
Even if Korean citizenship had never been applied for...the name on the registry automatically places you on the list for military service. |
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nosmallplans
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: noksapyeong
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:51 pm Post subject: |
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| dc'79 wrote: |
| nosmallplans wrote: |
| If you're born in the States you don't have to do the service. It's that simple. If they are demanding that of him, then he either needs to get a lawyer or find his birth certificate. |
Unless things have changed recently...to my knowledge this is not true.
Even if Korean citizenship had never been applied for...the name on the registry automatically places you on the list for military service. |
It has not changed. I'm 23 years old, Korean by blood, American by birth. I have not, nor ever will complete military service in Korea for the nation of Korea. It's a common myth in America amongst the Korean community that getting an F4 visa forces men into military service but its simply not true.
You are only compelled to do service if you were born in Korea and did not properly reject your Korean citizenship. For example, my father was born in Korea, gained American citizenship, but never renounced his Korean citizenship. If he at any time stepped foot in Korea he would have to serve - except that the first time he came back to Korea after emmigrating was at the age of 40 - way past the maximum age.
I'm not even sure it's possible to get on the family registry without being born in Korea. It's part of the birth certification process here in Korea. You cannot get onto the registry if you're born in America - believe me, I tried. |
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andrewchon
Joined: 16 Nov 2008
Location: Back in Oz. Living in ISIS Aust.
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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If his name is in the Hojeuk-familiy registry, then he has to do service.
Place of birth is non-issue, ROKA looks at Hojeuk, not birth certificates.
If he is older than 35, no service.
If he is already in US army, no service.
If he looks non-Korean, he may be rejected.
Doesn't speak Korean: ROKA don't care.
American gyopo: have to renounce ROK citizenship before 18 years old
other countries: can renounce anytime
Mother/Father-Korean? doesn't matter
E2/F4? doesn't matter
Last edited by andrewchon on Sat Nov 14, 2009 7:24 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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dc'79
Joined: 01 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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| nosmallplans wrote: |
| dc'79 wrote: |
| nosmallplans wrote: |
| If you're born in the States you don't have to do the service. It's that simple. If they are demanding that of him, then he either needs to get a lawyer or find his birth certificate. |
Unless things have changed recently...to my knowledge this is not true.
Even if Korean citizenship had never been applied for...the name on the registry automatically places you on the list for military service. |
It has not changed. I'm 23 years old, Korean by blood, American by birth. I have not, nor ever will complete military service in Korea for the nation of Korea. It's a common myth in America amongst the Korean community that getting an F4 visa forces men into military service but its simply not true.
You are only compelled to do service if you were born in Korea and did not properly reject your Korean citizenship. For example, my father was born in Korea, gained American citizenship, but never renounced his Korean citizenship. If he at any time stepped foot in Korea he would have to serve - except that the first time he came back to Korea after emmigrating was at the age of 40 - way past the maximum age.
I'm not even sure it's possible to get on the family registry without being born in Korea. It's part of the birth certification process here in Korea. You cannot get onto the registry if you're born in America - believe me, I tried. |
I guess you didn't read the thread I linked to...
http://www.seattlepi.com/local/168210_korean08.html
And about the family registry....I hope what you say its true. It used to be incredibly easy to get placed on the family registry. I've known plenty of gyopos who got placed on the registry by family members living in Korea (including myself). |
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winterfall
Joined: 21 May 2009
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm no Picasso wrote: |
He was born in the US, actually. I have no idea whether or not his name is in the national registry. I would assume it is, if this is coming up as an issue.
Thanks dc'79. I'll give that a good read-through.
The other thing is that, our other friend (Korean) who mentioned this said, specifically, "His father is Korean," with no mention about his mother's nationality. I don't know if he's just confused and thinks that the father being Korean is the deciding factor, or if this means his mother was already a US citizen, or what.
I don't have many details at this point, but I'll come back with more later. |
It doesn't matter if he was born in the states or not. The Consulate won't save him. Not to sound harsh. It was his responsibility to check everything before coming to Korea. There's even a disclaimer on the State Dept website. So he can't claim he didn't know.
http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1018.html
"...... A person�s name is not automatically removed from the Korean Family Relations Certificate simply because he or she is a U.S. citizen. It is the obligation of a U.S. citizen to inform the Korean government of his or her U.S. citizenship for the purposes of removing his or her name from the Korean Family Relations Certificate."
"There have been several instances in which young U.S. citizen men of Korean descent -- who were born in and lived all of their lives in the United States -- arrived in Korea as tourists only to be drafted into the Republic of Korea army. At least two of these cases involved individuals whose names had been recorded on the Korean Family Relations Certificate without their knowledge. Special permission to visit Korea should be obtained in this instance; please contact the Korean Embassy or a consulate to receive more information before traveling to Korea."
Service is traced through the dad's side. The Mother's size doesn't matter unless the guy got an F-4 and his dad wasn't korean.
The fact that he has a choice is more lenient than what Koreans get. Do the Service or Leave.
For Koreans with flight risk they're take away your passport. |
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nosmallplans
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: noksapyeong
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 8:04 pm Post subject: |
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| dc'79 wrote: |
| nosmallplans wrote: |
| dc'79 wrote: |
| nosmallplans wrote: |
| If you're born in the States you don't have to do the service. It's that simple. If they are demanding that of him, then he either needs to get a lawyer or find his birth certificate. |
Unless things have changed recently...to my knowledge this is not true.
Even if Korean citizenship had never been applied for...the name on the registry automatically places you on the list for military service. |
It has not changed. I'm 23 years old, Korean by blood, American by birth. I have not, nor ever will complete military service in Korea for the nation of Korea. It's a common myth in America amongst the Korean community that getting an F4 visa forces men into military service but its simply not true.
You are only compelled to do service if you were born in Korea and did not properly reject your Korean citizenship. For example, my father was born in Korea, gained American citizenship, but never renounced his Korean citizenship. If he at any time stepped foot in Korea he would have to serve - except that the first time he came back to Korea after emmigrating was at the age of 40 - way past the maximum age.
I'm not even sure it's possible to get on the family registry without being born in Korea. It's part of the birth certification process here in Korea. You cannot get onto the registry if you're born in America - believe me, I tried. |
I guess you didn't read the thread I linked to...
http://www.seattlepi.com/local/168210_korean08.html
And about the family registry....I hope what you say its true. It used to be incredibly easy to get placed on the family registry. I've known plenty of gyopos who got placed on the registry by family members living in Korea (including myself). |
No, I didn't really read it. My information came from a family friend - a Korean-American immigration lawyer. My parents contacted him about it before I got my F4 and what they were told was simply that if you were born in the 'States as a US citizen you didn't have to serve.
As far as the hojuk goes, you can get written up on the family copy but you cannot be added to the government copy. If you are on the government copy then you are a Korean citizen - you cannot be added to it if you are not. |
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Tjames426
Joined: 06 Aug 2006
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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Wow, finally payback for anchor babies.
I have no sympathy. Your family departs / flees the old country. Suffer and work hard to gain citizenship in another country, thus renouncing ties to the old one.
Now, your children don't have the .... to live in the new country but want to live in the old.
The spoiled brats want to be able to live like Koreans and daily trash their country of citizenship, but love to flash around the new passport whenever they have any sign of trouble.
[ wink wink ] |
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optik404
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 8:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Tjames426 wrote: |
Wow, finally payback for anchor babies.
I have no sympathy. Your family departs / flees the old country. Suffer and work hard to gain citizenship in another country, thus renouncing ties to the old one.
Now, your children don't have the .... to live in the new country but want to live in the old.
The spoiled brats want to be able to live like Koreans and daily trash their country of citizenship, but love to flash around the new passport whenever they have any sign of trouble.
[ wink wink ] |
wow |
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nosmallplans
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: noksapyeong
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 8:26 pm Post subject: |
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| optik404 wrote: |
| Tjames426 wrote: |
Wow, finally payback for anchor babies.
I have no sympathy. Your family departs / flees the old country. Suffer and work hard to gain citizenship in another country, thus renouncing ties to the old one.
Now, your children don't have the .... to live in the new country but want to live in the old.
The spoiled brats want to be able to live like Koreans and daily trash their country of citizenship, but love to flash around the new passport whenever they have any sign of trouble.
[ wink wink ] |
wow |
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pkang0202
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Tjames426 wrote: |
Wow, finally payback for anchor babies.
I have no sympathy. Your family departs / flees the old country. Suffer and work hard to gain citizenship in another country, thus renouncing ties to the old one.
Now, your children don't have the .... to live in the new country but want to live in the old.
The spoiled brats want to be able to live like Koreans and daily trash their country of citizenship, but love to flash around the new passport whenever they have any sign of trouble.
[ wink wink ] |
Epic Fail. |
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