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mayorgc
Joined: 19 Oct 2008
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itaewonguy
Joined: 25 Mar 2003
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 Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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NA YOUNG didnt die.. so he got 13 years! the public were outraged never the less and he should have done a least 20 years..
but for this guy.. NA, he can blame booze all he wants. in the past that use to work under koreans law! but this wont happen this time..
they will make an example out of him! its unfortunate that someone always has to die before the law makers listen!
he will get LIFE! without parole! |
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ashland
Joined: 05 Dec 2008
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| Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 7:57 pm Post subject: |
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| itaewonguy wrote: |
NA YOUNG didnt die.. so he got 13 years! the public were outraged never the less and he should have done a least 20 years..
but for this guy.. NA, he can blame booze all he wants. in the past that use to work under koreans law! but this wont happen this time..
they will make an example out of him! its unfortunate that someone always has to die before the law makers listen!
he will get LIFE! without parole! |
no way... korean people should not let this psycho (and jo doo-soon) eat up their tax money for the rest of his life. just hang him to death while jo doo-soon is wathing... then hang jo as well.. |
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egrog1717
Joined: 12 Mar 2008
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| Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 8:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Could always take him to a North Korea shooting range... I hear they know how to take care of people... |
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exercise_in_futility
Joined: 11 May 2009
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| Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 8:21 pm Post subject: |
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| egrog1717 wrote: |
| Could always take him to a North Korea shooting range... I hear they know how to take care of people... |
they should sexually torture this guy like they did with Robert Park |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:17 pm Post subject: |
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| exercise_in_futility wrote: |
| egrog1717 wrote: |
| Could always take him to a North Korea shooting range... I hear they know how to take care of people... |
they should sexually torture this guy like they did with Robert Park |
Yeah, let's show how civilized we are by advocating barbarism. 
What he should get is life in prison. He's proven that he has not reformed and is a danger to society. |
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djsmnc
Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Dave's ESL Cafe
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| Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
| exercise_in_futility wrote: |
| egrog1717 wrote: |
| Could always take him to a North Korea shooting range... I hear they know how to take care of people... |
they should sexually torture this guy like they did with Robert Park |
Yeah, let's show how civilized we are by advocating barbarism.
What he should get is life in prison. He's proven that he has not reformed and is a danger to society. |
And therefore of no use. Quick shot to the head, no barbarism necessary! |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 11:02 pm Post subject: |
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| No barbarism? What do you call the death penalty? Anyway, capital cases are not a "quick shot." The appeals drag on for years and cost the taxpayers a fortune. |
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geldedgoat
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 11:31 pm Post subject: |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
| No barbarism? What do you call the death penalty? |
Barbaric is a loaded term that has no business being used in any intelligent discussion (unless, of course, that discussion pertains specifically to the Germanic tribes of yore). If we could be 100% confident in the legitimacy of murder convictions (which we can't), there would be no reason not to use the death penalty as a form of punishment; appropriately-placed vengeance doesn't lower society to the level of people like 김길태. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 11:54 pm Post subject: |
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| geldedgoat wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| No barbarism? What do you call the death penalty? |
Barbaric is a loaded term that has no business being used in any intelligent discussion (unless, of course, that discussion pertains specifically to the Germanic tribes of yore). If we could be 100% confident in the legitimacy of murder convictions (which we can't), there would be no reason not to use the death penalty as a form of punishment; appropriately-placed vengeance doesn't lower society to the level of people like 김길태. |
I disagree with this. While the possibility of mistakenly executing someone is one of the strongest arguments against the death penalty, I personally feel it is by no means the only one. I can't think of any possible crime wherein the potential for the criminal to reform doesn't exist. So long as the potential for reform exists, we aren't justified in executing criminals. |
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bacasper
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 12:47 am Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
| geldedgoat wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| No barbarism? What do you call the death penalty? |
Barbaric is a loaded term that has no business being used in any intelligent discussion (unless, of course, that discussion pertains specifically to the Germanic tribes of yore). If we could be 100% confident in the legitimacy of murder convictions (which we can't), there would be no reason not to use the death penalty as a form of punishment; appropriately-placed vengeance doesn't lower society to the level of people like 김길태. |
I disagree with this. While the possibility of mistakenly executing someone is one of the strongest arguments against the death penalty, I personally feel it is by no means the only one. I can't think of any possible crime wherein the potential for the criminal to reform doesn't exist. So long as the potential for reform exists, we aren't justified in executing criminals. |
Not only that, but it is like saying, "We are going to show you that killing is wrong by...killing you!" WTF? |
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geldedgoat
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
| I can't think of any possible crime wherein the potential for the criminal to reform doesn't exist. So long as the potential for reform exists, we aren't justified in executing criminals. |
Why would someone like 김길태 (assuming he actually is guilty, committed the crime of his own free will without being persuaded, and was not suffering from a severe psychological disease) deserve the chance for reform?
| bacasper wrote: |
| Not only that, but it is like saying, "We are going to show you that killing is wrong by...killing you!" WTF? |
...except killing is wrong is not the message being sent. |
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Street Magic
Joined: 23 Sep 2009
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| Posted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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| geldedgoat wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| I can't think of any possible crime wherein the potential for the criminal to reform doesn't exist. So long as the potential for reform exists, we aren't justified in executing criminals. |
Why would someone like 김길태 (assuming he actually is guilty, committed the crime of his own free will without being persuaded, and was not suffering from a severe psychological disease) deserve the chance for reform?
| bacasper wrote: |
| Not only that, but it is like saying, "We are going to show you that killing is wrong by...killing you!" :roll: WTF? |
...except killing is wrong is not the message being sent. |
While I don't necessarily agree with Fox's argument specific to reform (I happen to believe deterrence is the best we can do for the most part), I really don't agree with the notion that crimes ought to be treated as matters of "deserving." Crimes are a problem and incarceration is an attempt to limit the problem. Any desire to move beyond what's necessary to best limit the problem is subjective morality at best and vengeance at worst. If the death penalty weren't more expensive than a life sentence and we could know for certain somehow that every conviction was infallibly accurate and we had documented cases of life sentence prisoners escaping, then I'd say you'd have a perfectly reasonable case for the death penalty. Barring all those things though, what you have is a desire to get back at someone rather than an objective plan for limiting crime. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 7:49 pm Post subject: |
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| geldedgoat wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| I can't think of any possible crime wherein the potential for the criminal to reform doesn't exist. So long as the potential for reform exists, we aren't justified in executing criminals. |
Why would someone like 김길태 (assuming he actually is guilty, committed the crime of his own free will without being persuaded, and was not suffering from a severe psychological disease) deserve the chance for reform? |
Rather than either making emotional or ethical appeals, I'll frame my case purely in terms of utility. In my estimation, societies marked by compassion produce overall better results. That includes compassion towards criminals. A society willing to give men like Mr. 김 the chance to reform -- whether he deserves it or not -- is a better society overall, and one I for one would be happier to live in. We can see this borne out, at least in terms of correlation, by examining states in the United States which do and do not have the death penalty. According to data I posted some time ago on these forums, the states without the death penalty have a substantially lower overall average murder rate than the states which do have the death penalty. |
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flakfizer
Joined: 12 Nov 2004
Location: scaling the Cliffs of Insanity with a frayed rope.
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| Posted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 9:00 pm Post subject: |
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| bacasper wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| geldedgoat wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| No barbarism? What do you call the death penalty? |
Barbaric is a loaded term that has no business being used in any intelligent discussion (unless, of course, that discussion pertains specifically to the Germanic tribes of yore). If we could be 100% confident in the legitimacy of murder convictions (which we can't), there would be no reason not to use the death penalty as a form of punishment; appropriately-placed vengeance doesn't lower society to the level of people like 김길태. |
I disagree with this. While the possibility of mistakenly executing someone is one of the strongest arguments against the death penalty, I personally feel it is by no means the only one. I can't think of any possible crime wherein the potential for the criminal to reform doesn't exist. So long as the potential for reform exists, we aren't justified in executing criminals. |
Not only that, but it is like saying, "We are going to show you that killing is wrong by...killing you!" WTF? |
I never understood this line of reasoning. Is it legal for a person to speed? Should the police be allowed to speed to catch those who are speeding? Are people allowed to take money from others? Should the government be allowed to levy fines as a punishment? Are people allowed to lock people up and confine them to a small room in their basement? Should the government be allowed to lock people up in cells? |
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