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Payback/back pay

 
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lookingforworkinasia



Joined: 14 Dec 2007

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 10:34 pm    Post subject: Payback/back pay Reply with quote

Hey, sorry if this has been discussed but I couldn't find anything useful.

Anyway, an old employer of mine has contacted me claiming that he over paid me during my time as an employee with him, and he claims I am required to return the money. Now, he's right. He paid me some extra money to do some extra work outside of the terms of my contract. I did it, and he paid me more than he said he would. Normally, I would have done the honest thing and brought his attention to this right away. He was a huge jerk though. I hated the guy. He treated everyone like crap. Pretty simple situation.

Now, he's claiming he wants the amount he over-paid me back. I'm wondering if I should give it to him? Am I legally obligated to return this money? It wasn't in the contract, therefore I never agreed to receive or return any of this money. I can't think of any legal reason to return the money, but obviously I will if he can use it to create problems with the police or another employer.

Although I realize it makes me kind of a jerk, I can live with that knowing I have relieved another jerk of money he probably didn't deserve anyway.

Thoughts?


Last edited by lookingforworkinasia on Wed Jun 09, 2010 1:47 am; edited 1 time in total
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Morticae



Joined: 06 May 2010

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How much was it? Just a petty amount or a fairly substantial sum?
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lookingforworkinasia



Joined: 14 Dec 2007

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I wouldn't say the amount is petty, but it isn't enough for either one of us to do anything drastic over. Not for me anyway, and presumably not for him.
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pikachun1



Joined: 09 May 2010

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you should return the money. Granted he's a jerk, I don't think you should seek retribution by keeping what isn't yours. There are plenty of jerk bosses. If what he did to you was illegal, then that's a different story.
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kprrok



Joined: 06 Apr 2004
Location: KC

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does he have it in writing where the amount was agreed upon? If not, legally I wouldn't think you'd have to return it. If he does, then yes, you should.

However, ethically, you should return it either way because it is, in a sense, stealing from him to keep money you shouldn't have gotten.
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WTP Trust



Joined: 13 May 2010
Location: Hittin' the books at Yonsei

PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 1:03 am    Post subject: Re: Payback/back pay Reply with quote

lookingforworkinasia wrote:
Hey, sorry if this has been discussed but I couldn't find anything useful.

Anyway, an old employer of mine has contacted me claiming that he over paid me during my time as an employee with him, and he claims I am required to return the money. Now, he's right. He paid me some extra money to do some extra work outside of the terms of my contract. I did it, and he paid me more than he said he would. Normally, I would have done the honest thing and brought his attention to this right away. He was a huge jerk though. I hated the guy. He treated everyone like crap. Pretty simple situation.

Now, he's claiming he wants the amount he over-paid me back. I'm wondering if I should give it to him? Am I legally obligated to return this money? It wasn't in the contract, therefore I never agreed to receive or return any of this money. I can't think of any legal reason to return the money, but obviously I will if he can use it to create problems with the police or another employer.

Although I realize it makes me kind of a jerk, I can live with that knowing I have relived another jerk of money he probably didn't deserve anyway.

Thoughts?


How long has it been since the contract was finished? He made the mistake, not you. Let him learn from it.
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ttompatz



Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea

PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moral issue = return the money.

Legal issue = non issue (given your brief explanation of events).

.
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lookingforworkinasia



Joined: 14 Dec 2007

PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 1:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is it really that unethical if I keep the money? I wouldn't waste it, I'd do something good and decent for the benefit of mankind if I kept it. For example, buy a round of drinks for strangers, treat the ladies in Itaewon to a classy meal, buy ice cream for my current students, etc.

But lots of good input here.
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WTP Trust



Joined: 13 May 2010
Location: Hittin' the books at Yonsei

PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

lookingforworkinasia wrote:
Is it really that unethical if I keep the money? I wouldn't waste it, I'd do something good and decent for the benefit of mankind if I kept it. For example, buy a round of drinks for strangers, treat the ladies in Itaewon to a classy meal, buy ice cream for my current students, etc.

But lots of good input here.


No it's not. Keep it. He can't do anything...just curious, how much was it?
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balzor



Joined: 14 Feb 2009

PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 5:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

lookingforworkinasia wrote:
Well, I wouldn't say the amount is petty, but it isn't enough for either one of us to do anything drastic over. Not for me anyway, and presumably not for him.
without a number value, this conversation is pointless. If he gave you more than expected with the intent to reward you extra then its your money. If it was an oversight on his part or a bonus with contingencies, then give it back. you don't need us to tell you want to do and not saying how much makes me think it's a considerable amount and you don't have it to give back to him
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ChilgokBlackHole



Joined: 21 Nov 2009

PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 5:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kprrok wrote:
Does he have it in writing where the amount was agreed upon? If not, legally I wouldn't think you'd have to return it. If he does, then yes, you should.

However, ethically, you should return it either way because it is, in a sense, stealing from him to keep money you shouldn't have gotten.

This isn't a legal vs ethical issue. Legally, OP was overpaid and needs to return the money. Just because the employer can't prove he's owed the cash doesn't mean he isn't owed the cash.
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ontheway



Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...

PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 7:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChilgokBlackHole wrote:
kprrok wrote:
Does he have it in writing where the amount was agreed upon? If not, legally I wouldn't think you'd have to return it. If he does, then yes, you should.

However, ethically, you should return it either way because it is, in a sense, stealing from him to keep money you shouldn't have gotten.

This isn't a legal vs ethical issue. Legally, OP was overpaid and needs to return the money. Just because the employer can't prove he's owed the cash doesn't mean he isn't owed the cash.



Correct.

If you are overpaid you have a legal obligation to return the money. Of course, you have to actually be aware that you have been overpaid, and the amount must be significant (not just a few thousand won).

Of course, it could be difficult to prove that you were overpaid, and you could get off - but you'd still be a thief, and a member of the OJ club.
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Steve_Rogers2008



Joined: 22 Mar 2010

PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

and does the ex-boss know if you're still in-country.

Just keep telling him you'd need to see proof of this oversight, becanse by your calculations, things seemed to add up correctly. He may have even UNDERpaid you! Shocked

Ask to see the paperwork, and you'd have no problem paying it back. In person, of course. Trying to get him to waste so much time may be a good ploy to get him to forget about it.

Ethically is it OK to do? In this crazy digital economy, whose to say?

Wink
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