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bbb0777
Joined: 24 Aug 2009
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 Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 7:58 pm Post subject: Teaching after classes as part of your 22? |
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I'm part of GEPIK.Basically our entire English department has been cycled through this year. As our new setup for my classes, I teach 22 per week, 9:30-5:30, some of which are after-classes (sans extra pay, as they're now part of the 22).
Is that common at all? Very inferior to my previous year's setup (work 8:00-4:00 with regular classes, then often teach after classes for extra pay) but I'd like to know how common it is before judging it too much. Thanks. |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 8:16 pm Post subject: |
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| My regular classes this semester total 21 per week. The after-school classes should be scheduled as 4 per week. I will not receive any incentives for the 1st hour of the after-school classes. The other 3 hours, though, are "gravy." |
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OculisOrbis
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 8:40 pm Post subject: |
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As long as the extra (after-school) classes fall within your regular working hours AND do not make your total classes exceed 22 hours per week - you are not entitled to any extra pay for them.
If your extra classes fall outside regular working hours AND/OR put you over 22 hours per week, you should be paid extra for them.
It looks like they just shifted your working hours so they dont have to pay you for the extra classes. Wise move on their part. Sucks for you. |
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bbb0777
Joined: 24 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 8:48 pm Post subject: |
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Got it, thank you both. Since my proposed hours would be 9:30-5:30, yes, the after classes would be during my regular teaching hours.
Much inferior situation compared to the previous 2 years here, but one the new staff have a right to request. Good to know. |
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bbb0777
Joined: 24 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 10:19 pm Post subject: |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
| My regular classes this semester total 21 per week. The after-school classes should be scheduled as 4 per week. I will not receive any incentives for the 1st hour of the after-school classes. The other 3 hours, though, are "gravy." |
Wait - that seems off actually. In the contract it states 8 hour days inclusive of lunch hour, so if your regular hours are 8:00-4:00, anything taught after 4 should be separate & thus paid I believe. |
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bbb0777
Joined: 24 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 10:20 pm Post subject: |
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| OculisOrbis wrote: |
It looks like they just shifted your working hours so they dont have to pay you for the extra classes. Wise move on their part. Sucks for you. |
Yes, exactly what occurred. Unfortunately almost our entire English department left recently, so no-one here really knows me enough to care/automatically be nice, as was the prior situation. Darn. |
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jonpurdy
Joined: 08 Jan 2009
Location: Ulsan
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| Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 10:43 pm Post subject: |
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| bbb0777 wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| My regular classes this semester total 21 per week. The after-school classes should be scheduled as 4 per week. I will not receive any incentives for the 1st hour of the after-school classes. The other 3 hours, though, are "gravy." |
Wait - that seems off actually. In the contract it states 8 hour days inclusive of lunch hour, so if your regular hours are 8:00-4:00, anything taught after 4 should be separate & thus paid I believe. |
The school can technically change his working hours from 9:30 to 5:30. So if he doesn't have to come in until 9:30 then he has to stay until 5:30. Though I'm not sure if they can make his working hours different than the rest of the school. |
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Ramen
Joined: 15 Apr 2008
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| Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 10:51 pm Post subject: |
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| jonpurdy wrote: |
| bbb0777 wrote: |
| CentralCali wrote: |
| My regular classes this semester total 21 per week. The after-school classes should be scheduled as 4 per week. I will not receive any incentives for the 1st hour of the after-school classes. The other 3 hours, though, are "gravy." |
Wait - that seems off actually. In the contract it states 8 hour days inclusive of lunch hour, so if your regular hours are 8:00-4:00, anything taught after 4 should be separate & thus paid I believe. |
The school can technically change his working hours from 9:30 to 5:30. So if he doesn't have to come in until 9:30 then he has to stay until 5:30. Though I'm not sure if they can make his working hours different than the rest of the school. |
in accordance with the contract, the school boss can do what ever he/she wants with the net's schedule as long as it's 8 hours at work and XX(22) number of classes per week. |
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winterfall
Joined: 21 May 2009
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| Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 10:56 pm Post subject: |
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| OculisOrbis wrote: |
It looks like they just shifted your working hours so they dont have to pay you for the extra classes. Wise move on their part. Sucks for you. |
I thought schools can't do that unless the whole school schedule changes to start at 9:30 Am. It shouldn't matter if the english dept is on the same schedule as the OP when the rest of the school isn't. After all this is PS not hagwon, even public school's don't get this much leeway for changes.
OP you should send a polite / curious question to your POE. Don't hit the panic button yet, just see what they say |
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bbb0777
Joined: 24 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 11:26 pm Post subject: |
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Based on reading the contract
"either hours per day including lunch hour...shall follow the normal work schedule of civil servants of the Korean Government; however, such Work Hours may be adjusted by the school principal as he/she deems appropriate as necessary.
So it's well within the contract to change the working hours, the hour change itself is fine with me, it's effect of losing any paid after classes.
The overall situation seems reasonable though, just less ideal than before. |
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bbb0777
Joined: 24 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 11:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Oh, to clarify: It sounded kind of like centralcali taught regular classes from 8:00-4:00, then additional after classes (going from 4:30-5:20, etc.). And if so - I'd think *all* of the after classes would be additional pay, and shouldn't be totaled into his or her 22. |
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winterfall
Joined: 21 May 2009
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| Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2011 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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| bbb0777 wrote: |
Based on reading the contract
"either hours per day including lunch hour...shall follow the normal work schedule of civil servants of the Korean Government; however, such Work Hours may be adjusted by the school principal as he/she deems appropriate as necessary.
So it's well within the contract to change the working hours, the hour change itself is fine with me, it's effect of losing any paid after classes.
The overall situation seems reasonable though, just less ideal than before. |
Well see that's the thing though. Principal discretion can't single out 1 person or even a department because it obviously targets you. Korean labor law for Civil Servants is very explicit about equal treatment. You cannot single out a person or groups of people.
http://www.ilo.org/public/english/dialogue/ifpdial/info/national/kor.htm#equ or http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?t=91053
That's why it really matters if the school as a whole is changing to 9:30 or just you and the English teachers. Which by the way would be very odd because most of the English teachers probably have their own classrooms.
The only pay difference would be you getting 7,000 per after school class because its in your weekly 22 (That means your roughly missing out on 100,000 or so a month)
If you taught over your weekly 22, you'd get I think 40,000 per extra class regardless of whether its during school hours or not. |
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bbb0777
Joined: 24 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 12:12 am Post subject: |
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| winterfall wrote: |
The only pay difference would be you getting 7,000 per after school class because its in your weekly 22 (That means your roughly missing out on 100,000 or so a month)
If you taught over your weekly 22, you'd get I think 40,000 per extra class regardless of whether its during school hours or not. |
In the current setup - I believe it would be 0 per after class if within the weekly 22, not the 7,000 (though I know what you're refering to).
If a taught over weekly 22 - definitely, it would be the 30,000 (depends on school) that it is.
The situation above 22 teaching hours is not in question. Above 22 is 30,000 (I think we just upped to 35,000) an hour.
The situation is whether I could teach 22 from 9:30-5:30. I'm not certain of course but I think it's not really a "discrimination" issue, as it's not due to my race per se, but due to my position. I mean - the sole building custodian works far different hours than everyone else.
Not that I wouldn't love an arguing point...so if you have a great rebuttal showing my errors I'd really like to hear it! |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 12:32 am Post subject: |
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| My working hours are 8:30 a.m. to 4:30 p.m. I have never worked any extra classes beyond 4:30 and I'm not going to volunteer for that. Contrary to what some of my acquaintances may tell you, I really do have a life and prefer not to live at the school. The schedules director tried her best to get the regular classes to work out to 22 for me so that I'd get extra for all 4 of the so-called after-school classes but that didn't work out. I'm not thrilled about it but then I'm not upset either. |
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bbb0777
Joined: 24 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 1:07 am Post subject: |
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| Ah OK gotcha, my mistake then. |
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