Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Kohio]

They won't listen to anything I say.

I really don't need any advice or searching for remedies here, because frankly I've tried them all and it doesn't make a dent. And the most annoying part is when I go to get the Korean teacher they scurry into their seats and crack their books open like the were studying the whole time.....RIIIIIIIIGHT! I want to smack them for trying to look so innocent. And then, after they've ignored every one of my commands, they react as if GOD Himself told them to stop when the Korean teacher tells them. I've about had it with this class.

Have you ever had a class like this that didn't listen to a word you said and cursed, ran about the room, and could care less at your presence as a teacher? It's always those 1 or 2 kids that ruin the class. I wish they would just quit so that some actual teaching could get accomplished.
I just succumb to their antics (because I have no choice) and try to teach over their noise and distractions.

When the Korean teacher comes in to tell them to stop, they tell her they will, then go back to acting like maniacs a minute later. I want to rip my hair out! I've NEVER seen such disrespect for authority in my entire life. American kids were angels compared to these freaks of nature.

Has anyone has a class similar to mine that you just literally had to give up, shut down and sit down because your teaching was useless anyway?

Please, I dont want to hear about its the teachers fault, because these kids were bad from day 1, and no amount of fear from me can tame these kids. I just realized that some kids are just INCAPABLE of being taught because they simply DON'T WANT TO LEARN and DON'T CARE.
나븐 학생 들!

[earthquakez]

Take a deep breath, calm down and answer the questions!

1) Do you teach in a hagwon, public school or after school program?

2) Were you told before you came here that you'd be teaching with a Korean teacher in class?

3) Does your contract state that you will teach with another teacher?

4) Where is this workplace? I don't mean that you tell us the name or exact location, just roughly and is it a well heeled place or a poorer area, city or rural?

[Kohio]

[sallymonster]

Yes, I have had a class like this, but the students were middle school. 20 out of the 25-30 students in the classes were noisy, disruptive, and disrespectful towards me. I tried everything I could think of to get control of the class, but nothing worked. Finally, I started sending the worst students out of class, but they were sent right back to me (it was an after-school class). I gave up after that and started showing the kids movies with English subtitles. I felt terrible, but I didn't know what else to do.

It turned out the same class was awful for my Korean then-co-teacher, too. When we taught these students together for winter camp, I honestly thought she was going to cry.

You have no idea how glad I am to not have to teach this class anymore. I feel really bad for the Gyopo woman who replaced me, though. Hopefully she's a better disciplinarian than I am.

[ESL Milk "Everyday]

I know exactly where you're coming from. I really hope that you don't end up getting some amazing person coming on here and telling you that it's your fault, because it's really not... not if you've just started, which I get the feeling you have.

I can't really help you, but I can tell you that you're not the only one-- and I'm also having some problems right now.

Some of the KT's at my school have actually ended up in police stations over this whole new 'student's rights' thing that may or may not be sweeping the nation, but is definitely sweeping my school... and not only does it extend to physical discipline, but also verbal and emotional discipline. Sending a kid out in the hall for all the swearing, disruptive behavior, and disrespect that he can muster is now going to end with you getting a call from the police. I'm honestly not even sure if I'm allowed to give detentions. COWABUNGA.

And hey, surprise surprise, the good kids are still good, the average kids are still average, and the horrible kids are worse than ever... and they know that you can't do anything.

It's actually kind of amazing how one student can ruin five, five can ruin a class, a class can ruin a week, and then week after week your life is a mix of anxiety and frustration. It's really hard to know that you're actually more organized than ever, you have new ideas that make sense and that you really want to try... only to watch perfectly capable students lose an entire year of their education because you can't do your job properly.

It's really really hard when you have to keep stopping to give some kid 'the stare', or because someone has switched seats when your back was turned, or thought it was a good idea to get up and go for an adventure. The one good thing about this class is that every single awful kid from the whole school (minus one) is in it, so at least they're not infecting the other classes.

I've actually been running it over in my head-- my current solution is I'm going to create an island of desks at the back of the room, and tell them that anyone who doesn't want to study can sit there and do whatever, and my only request is that they keep it down. You know, sort of like what that retiring police captain did in Season 3 of The Wire? I'm going to have my own Hamsterdam!

[Kohio]

[ESL Milk "Everyday]

[Kohio]

[earthquakez]

Kohio - let me guess, is this your first job in Korea? Don't be offended if it's not, there are a surprisingly high number of teachers who have been here for a while who find some situations to be similar.

I suggest you do these things.

1) Ask your 'Co teacher' as in the Korean who speaks English and is the designated teacher to deal with you if she/he can have a talk with you. Go to your job early at whatever time the K teacher can talk with you.

2) Tell her that you understand it's an afterschool program and the kids are young and don't approach afterschool classes the same as usual classes BUT you need her to help you establish boundaries and order.

3) Ask her to be with you at the beginning of each separate class next time and you will write some rules on the board, she will translate and will tell the kids that Kohio Teacher wants you to enjoy learning English but she/he expects you to follow the rules so that everybody can hear what's going on and everybody understands that this is an English class and we're going to learn English.

Get her to emphasise that you are a teacher and you understand bad Korean words and they will not be accepted. Buy yourself a black exercise book and a red pen. Red pen equals seriousness in Korea. Tell the kids via the K teacher that when you hear bad language or other very bad manners you will write their names in that book and you will give the book to the K teachers so they can tell their parents.

4) The above should have been done the first time you taught but I am not at all blaming you. Too many K teachers don't want to know about assisting the foreign teacher especially if the students are being pigs in their manners or lack thereof.

The Korean way is to ignore student rudeness and pretend it's not happening, a very annoying face saving method among others you will encounter in Korea.

5) You must have student photos and names in front of you. Have a copy done, put them in your room and refer to them when you take notes on unacceptable behaviour.

Get the kids to write their names on an attendance list at the beginning of class, Korean is fine, so you can check the names against your list. If you can't read Hangeul learn it asap - it's not hard.

6) Reorganise the whole room. If the kids are sitting facing each other, get the desks and chairs to face you.

Get the Korean teacher to tell them that you understand they want to enjoy English class with their friends but this is not playtime. It's learning time - I stress 'learning', don't get the K teacher to say 'study'. If they don't try in class then they sit away from their friends.

Where there are groups who are rude and disruptive, then ban them at the beginning of class from sitting with their friends. Tell them they can sit together next class if they behave well this class.

7) You MUST try to prepare a curriculum that works. For that age, I'd get them to try making things in groups for example - English posters and their own magazines. The quality of English will be poor but that doesn't matter. Keep them occupied and trying to do something.

Show videos suitable for their age group if you are in a room with a computer and big screen. If you aren't in such a room, ask the K teacher why and tell them you have to move the class.

The problems you are having are common at all age levels in Korean schools for afterschool classes. These problems reflect the attitude here of Koreans wanting students to study English but not providing the necessary training for Korean students in the ways of respecting foreigners and not providing the organisational backdrop to these afterschool programs which enable the foreign teacher to be able to walk in and just do their job.

If it makes you feel better, I am a very experienced teacher and at all my previous public schools (EPIK) I had problems with student rudeness and arrogance in afterschool classes and with Korean teachers excusing this in all sorts of ridiculous ways that contribute to the relatively poor image of Korean attitudes to foreigners working in their education system.

[Kohio]

[ajuma]

All I can say is "Candy is your friend"! I know a lot of teachers will call it bribery or poor discipline skills, but sometimes ya gotta do what you gotta do.

I had a regular hagwon class like this. It was just before lunch and the last thing these kids wanted to do was study English! I was at my wits end. I finally came up with a plan that (mostly) worked.

I carefully divided the class into groups of 3. I tried to have 1 "good", 1 "average" and 1 "terror" in each group. At the beginning of the class, I put the group's numbers (or you could name each group) on the board. If someone in group 1 was acting up, they got a point. If a team that had a point worked quietly for a bit, I'd erase the point.

The team with the lowest "score" got candy at the end of class. This way, they were policing each other! All I had to do was say "Team 3???" and start to give a point to their team...and the team members made the offender be quiet!

It didn't work perfectly every time, and you REALLY have to think about the composition of the groups, but it sure made for a lot calmer classes! And the few bucks I was out for candy was well worth it since I got to keep my sanity!

[Kohio]

[ESL Milk "Everyday]

[BoholDiver]

Sounds a bit like my current job. I am doing a temp job at a kindie.

There are nice kids and the bad ones here are worse than I have ever seen. The K teachers don't seem to care,

I never claimed to be an A+ teacher but I can't look myself in the mirror if I dog-fornicate all day and get a paycheck. Every job I have ever had, I put an effort into it. Everything here is telling me to not give a hoot and bow out in 6 weeks. It's so not my style, but I may have to resort to it.

Except for the pay, this is the worst job I have ever had. I'd rather work at A&W if the pay was the same. I'd rather do Basic Training all over again.

[grant gerstners]

I have a camera with a video function, including audio.

In my first weeks working with 1st grade students at a small public elementary school, I had a group of 10, on my own with no co-teacher.

They were all over the place, even climbing on tables and ledges. At that point I was concerned for their safety and the possible consequences if one of them slipped and fell.

I took the camera out and got a minute or two of their misbehaving, especially one boy who was acting like a monkey, standing on top of one of the tables.

Eventually, I showed the video to the school nurse (who had spent some years in Australia and spoke pretty good English). I let her take it from there. (I only had to show her a portion of the video and have since erased the footage.)

I think the students got a stern talking to. I don't really know. But the only time after that when they showed signs of beginning to misbehave again, I took my camera out and they stopped.