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Zackback
Joined: 05 Nov 2010
Location: Kyungbuk
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 Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 4:49 pm Post subject: Qualification standards raised - what would happen?? |
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Perhaps never going to happen but.......
What if the qualifications for teaching ESL in Korea were raised? That is instead of what it currently is what IF the new requirements were something like at least either a teaching certificate or an MA degree required? What would happen to the ESL industry in Korea? Would wages go up? Would costs for English lesons go up? Would respect for NET's go up? Any other changes? |
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northway
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
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| Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 5:04 pm Post subject: |
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| The system would collapse. |
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Modernist
Joined: 23 Mar 2011
Location: The 90s
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| Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 7:34 pm Post subject: |
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| What would happen to the ESL industry in Korea? Would wages go up? Would costs for English lesons go up? Would respect for NET's go up? Any other changes? |
1) There would be a massive breakdown. Specifically there would be a 'flight to money' syndrome similar to what is seen in China currently. The number of teachers in public schools would plummet and only a tiny fraction of PS outside Seoul and its closest most affluent suburbs would have NETs. The hagwon 'industry' would also shrivel and most of the survivors would either be outposts of huge chains or 'one-stop shopping' with English instruction offered as a package with math, science, Mandarin, etc. The mom & pop places so beloved of this board would be history.
2) Wages would obviously rise for the surviving positions, because scarcity would once more be a serious issue. Most people do not go to the trouble of obtaining a Master's degree so they can teach Korean fourth graders. Most people with teaching certification would prefer to teach in their native countries. During economic collapses like now, things would temporarily slacken, but over the medium-term wages would rise. But there would be a massive offset in terms of reduced total employees in the sector.
3) Doubtful. As it stands there are not a small number of NETs with MAs in one thing or another and it doesn't seem to matter much in their day-to-day lives. It takes a long time for something as amorphous as 'respect' to shift in terms of a culture, regardless of economics or social/political policy. Unless the Korean system changes not the qualification levels, or the pay, but HOW NETs ARE USED in their curriculum, we will rarely receive nor deserve a higher level of respect within the educational framework. |
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Swampfox10mm
Joined: 24 Mar 2011
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| Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 7:44 pm Post subject: |
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| What is the flight to money thing in China all about? |
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Ramen
Joined: 15 Apr 2008
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:53 am Post subject: |
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i'd be swimming in ￦.  |
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fungrel
Joined: 26 Dec 2010
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 1:59 am Post subject: |
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| I have a MS degree, doesn't mean i would be any more qualified than the next Joe Bloe. TESOL qualifications really do count in most countries, but not here. Does that say something? |
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ZIFA
Joined: 23 Feb 2011
Location: Dici che il fiume..Trova la via al mare
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 3:25 am Post subject: |
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| fungrel wrote: |
| TESOL qualifications really do count in most countries, but not here. Does that say something? |
Exactly.
I've been suggesting for years that they should make a TESOL/ TEFL/ CELTA an E2 requirement.
Korea likes to complain a lot about substandard teachers yet it never selects candidates based on qualifications or experience. |
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smee18
Joined: 24 Mar 2009
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 3:27 am Post subject: |
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| Aren't qualified teachers and MA's in TESOL about 5% of the NSET population? I'm pulling these numbers out of my a$$, but surely it would be something like that, yes? Can't see the system functioning at all with those sorts of numbers. |
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wylies99
Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: I'm one cool cat!
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 5:17 am Post subject: |
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| ZIFA wrote: |
| fungrel wrote: |
| TESOL qualifications really do count in most countries, but not here. Does that say something? |
Exactly.
I've been suggesting for years that they should make a TESOL/ TEFL/ CELTA an E2 requirement.
Korea likes to complain a lot about substandard teachers yet it never selects candidates based on qualifications or experience. |
It's all about money. Lower qualifications = larger supply of applicants = lower salaries |
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sojusucks
Joined: 31 May 2008
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 6:30 am Post subject: Re: Qualification standards raised - what would happen?? |
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| Zackback wrote: |
Perhaps never going to happen but.......
What if the qualifications for teaching ESL in Korea were raised? Would respect for NET's go up? Any other changes? |
If qualificaitons went up, then S. Korea would still be short teachers. Honestly, most (but not all) teachers with an MA go to other countries, such as Europe and select South American countries, the US and Canada. Why would they want to work in a system that makes life so unhappy for so many? We all have read the posts about that here and those of us who have worked in S. Korea have our own stories. This would practically end the supply of foreign English teachers in S. Korea.
Requiring everyone to have a TESOL certificate is plausible. There are many organizations that offer these certificates. Some are easier to earn than others. This would probably reduce the number of teachers a bit. I am not certain by how much.
I doubt that NETs would earn more respect, because, after all, we are still foreigners. There is much racism in S. Korea. I saw one black South African guy get run out of an apartment complex in a week. This type of thinking can't be ended with more education on our part. It would require an unbiased global education on the part of South Koreans, which we all know is not going to happen. In this culture, the blame game is important for egos and does not result in a resolution -- I have seen this so many times here. So I highly doubt they are going to admit there is a problem and fix it.
Good luck to all. |
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sojusucks
Joined: 31 May 2008
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 6:32 am Post subject: |
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| wylies99 wrote: |
| ZIFA wrote: |
| fungrel wrote: |
| TESOL qualifications really do count in most countries, but not here. Does that say something? |
Exactly.
I've been suggesting for years that they should make a TESOL/ TEFL/ CELTA an E2 requirement.
Korea likes to complain a lot about substandard teachers yet it never selects candidates based on qualifications or experience. |
It's all about money. Lower qualifications = larger supply of applicants = lower salaries |
I agree. |
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ZIFA
Joined: 23 Feb 2011
Location: Dici che il fiume..Trova la via al mare
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| Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 7:18 am Post subject: Re: Qualification standards raised - what would happen?? |
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| sojusucks wrote: |
| I saw one black South African guy get run out of an apartment complex in a week. This type of thinking can't be ended with more education on our part. |
Did Korean anti-black attitudes begin with the LA riots? |
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silkhighway
Joined: 24 Oct 2010
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 7:41 am Post subject: Re: Qualification standards raised - what would happen?? |
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| Zackback wrote: |
Perhaps never going to happen but.......
What if the qualifications for teaching ESL in Korea were raised? That is instead of what it currently is what IF the new requirements were something like at least either a teaching certificate or an MA degree required? What would happen to the ESL industry in Korea? Would wages go up? Would costs for English lesons go up? Would respect for NET's go up? Any other changes? |
I actually don't think it would accomplish much more other than implementing artificial market barriers. I'm going to be blunt here..teacher's college is 90% a load of #@$#$@#. At best, I think it acts as a first-level screening tool. I suppose, say in Canada, teacher's college does serve a purpose because the programs are centred around the provincial public schools, are outcome-focused, and the expectation is student teachers have never taught before. But transplanting that to Korea wouldn't work so well, other than as I said, acting as a screening tool to help separate who is really serious about this business and who isn't.
And just another point on this..in Korea, it seems a certain kind of person makes it known to everyone that they went to teachers college and are therefore a "qualified teacher" and not a backpacker like you are, but in Canada at least, where attending teacher's college is mandatory if you want to teach and therefore there's nothing ...ahem..prestigious about it in the teaching world, most pre-service teachers are just going through the motions to get their licenses. |
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silkhighway
Joined: 24 Oct 2010
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 8:10 am Post subject: |
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I should also add I *do* think one's education is important when it comes to teaching. If I was hiring a high school science teacher, for instance, I would definitely want to hire someone who has demonstrated they know the subject matter inside out. I'm not sure what subjects would do this for ESL besides the obvious M.TESOL (which frankly, I know nothing about). A background in foreign languages? Linguistics? You'd be whittling down to an awfully small labour pool and not necessarily increasing lesson productivity that much.
As well, it's gotten better in Canada over the last twenty years but teachers are still teaching subjects they know practically nothing about. At one junior-high I observed, the math department was also responsible for teaching Health Ed. There takes a certain level of curiousity, initiative, and intelligence to be a good teacher and learn the subject matter you're teaching, and that can't be learned in teacher's college. There are teachers the world over, regardless of their qualifications, who both live up and fail to do that. |
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ontheway
Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...
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| Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 2:29 pm Post subject: Re: Qualification standards raised - what would happen?? |
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| silkhighway wrote: |
| Zackback wrote: |
Perhaps never going to happen but.......
What if the qualifications for teaching ESL in Korea were raised? That is instead of what it currently is what IF the new requirements were something like at least either a teaching certificate or an MA degree required? What would happen to the ESL industry in Korea? Would wages go up? Would costs for English lesons go up? Would respect for NET's go up? Any other changes? |
I actually don't think it would accomplish much more other than implementing artificial market barriers. I'm going to be blunt here..teacher's college is 90% a load of #@$#$@#.
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Such limitations would reduce the supply of good teachers, cause the price to go up and quality of education to decline.
Some of the worst ESL teachers I've seen in Korea are those with teaching certificates and teaching degrees who think they know what to do, have no practical experience, and fail miserably. TESOL/ TEFL/ CELTA certificates are often a warning sign of a person who is completely unable to teach. A newbie with one of these certificates will usually need a couple of years experience to get over himself and begin to learn what teaching really means.
All of the paper qualifications are worthless. Years of successful experience in the classroom teaching EFL/ESL is the only qualification that indicates ability. Zero to two years is still a green newbie, but after five years, the experience begins to show and have value. Experience is the best indicator and experienced EFL/ESL teachers are worth more money. However, there are not enough of them to fill all the positions. Korea is wise to allow all comers, as individuals with other degrees are often the best. It should be up to the schools to weed them out. |
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