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cwflaneur
Joined: 04 Aug 2009
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 Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 7:03 pm Post subject: Koreans' birthing tourism for US citizenship: repellent? |
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Here's a funny phenomenon that you may not be aware of. I'm familiar with it due to my working with adults in Korea. With extraordinary frequency, Korean couples expecting babies are travelling to the United States to take advantage of the American constitution which, as we all know, grants citizenship to all individuals born within the borders regardless of parents' status.
Now, of course many of them just happen to be pregnant at that time... but in very, very many cases, the trip is carefully timed for this purpose. In most cases, they do not settle in the States. They take their child with them back to Korea after its birth. It amounts to nothing more than a simple hit-and-run scam.
Korea seems to me to be a culture which is rather committed to the notion of 'ethnic nationalism', the belief that citizenship and ethnicity are intimately linked. It may not be engraven in South Korea's constitution as it is in North Korea's, but the mentality is basically the same. You can imagine the response you would get if you suggested that the children of low-paid immigrant laborers from Southeast Asia should get citizenship if born in Korea, as they would get American citizenship if born in the US. "How unnatural that would be!! They aren't Korean!!!"
This is the polar opposite of the notion found in pluralistic societies like the United States. There, civic nationhood prevails. Citizenship there is based on humanism and equality, which allow for a pluralist vision of multi-ethnic citizenship - hence, that clause in the American constitution benefitting immigrant children.
Did the writers of America's constitution predict this ridiculous situation? I think it's not what they had in mind. That clause was intended to protect people who may have needed the protection, and to bolster America's sense of civic nationality. It was not intended to provide a loophole to selfish opportunists armed with a research grant and a return ticket to Incheon airport. |
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Kennyftw
Joined: 08 Aug 2011
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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| This isn't anything new--ask the Mexicans. This phenomenon is called having an "anchor" baby; your baby is anchored in America. Oh well, by the time the baby grows up, America will be a third world country anyhow. I'm American, too btw. |
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cwflaneur
Joined: 04 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Kennyftw wrote: |
| This isn't anything new--ask the Mexicans. This phenomenon is called having an "anchor" baby; your baby is anchored in America. Oh well, by the time the baby grows up, America will be a third world country anyhow. I'm American, too btw. |
Of course anchor babies aren't new. The Korean version of the practice is different from the Mexicans' in that their purpose of travel is disguised by legitimate, legal pursuits, and the fact that it's done in the absence of any pressing economic need. I was just amused by the extent to which it's going on, and the way it contrasts with Korean notions of national identity. |
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World Traveler
Joined: 29 May 2009
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Kennyftw wrote: |
| Oh well, by the time the baby grows up, America will be a third world country anyhow. I'm American, too btw. |
Are you kidding me?!
The United States is and will continue to be the richest country in the world. This will not change in our lifetime.
(China's per capita GDP is 4K a year, btw. Cuba's is 5K. The U.S.: 47K...S.K.: 20K) |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 7:52 pm Post subject: Re: Koreans' birthing tourism for US citizenship: repellent? |
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| cwflaneur wrote: |
| Here's a funny phenomenon that you may not be aware of. . |
This has been discussed on these boards many times actually. |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 9:25 pm Post subject: Re: Koreans' birthing tourism for US citizenship: repellent? |
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| cwflaneur wrote: |
Did the writers of America's constitution predict this ridiculous situation? I think it's not what they had in mind. That clause was intended to protect people who may have needed the protection, and to bolster America's sense of civic nationality. It was not intended to provide a loophole to selfish opportunists armed with a research grant and a return ticket to Incheon airport. |
Isn't the birthright citizenship you're discussing a part of the 14th Amendment, meaning the original writers of the Constitution had nothing to do with it? Perhaps more importantly, how does America suffer from a small number of Korean youth becoming citizens due to having been born here? It's not as if they're arriving as spies to sabotage our nation from within, and it's also not as if America has a vast array of excessively generous social programs which would cause them to come here and simply leech. What about this bothers you so much? |
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Kennyftw
Joined: 08 Aug 2011
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 9:26 pm Post subject: |
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| World Traveler wrote: |
| Kennyftw wrote: |
| Oh well, by the time the baby grows up, America will be a third world country anyhow. I'm American, too btw. |
Are you kidding me?!
The United States is and will continue to be the richest country in the world. This will not change in our lifetime.
(China's per capita GDP is 4K a year, btw. Cuba's is 5K. The U.S.: 47K...S.K.: 20K) |
we're in DEBT up to our eyeballs. The government is reckless and will ruin the country financially (its already begun) soon. We aren't rich. |
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CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 9:42 pm Post subject: Re: Koreans' birthing tourism for US citizenship: repellent? |
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| Fox wrote: |
| cwflaneur wrote: |
Did the writers of America's constitution predict this ridiculous situation? I think it's not what they had in mind. That clause was intended to protect people who may have needed the protection, and to bolster America's sense of civic nationality. It was not intended to provide a loophole to selfish opportunists armed with a research grant and a return ticket to Incheon airport. |
Isn't the birthright citizenship you're discussing a part of the 14th Amendment, meaning the original writers of the Constitution had nothing to do with it? Perhaps more importantly, how does America suffer from a small number of Korean youth becoming citizens due to having been born here? It's not as if they're arriving as spies to sabotage our nation from within, and it's also not as if America has a vast array of excessively generous social programs which would cause them to come here and simply leech. What about this bothers you so much? |
Probably something he read that's not current; to wit: the idea that the parents can immediately use their American citizen children to sponsor them for immigration. It's been quite some time since that's been the case. The other thing is probably simply that it's a more recent immigration generation than that of his or her own family. |
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cwflaneur
Joined: 04 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:56 pm Post subject: Re: Koreans' birthing tourism for US citizenship: repellent? |
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| CentralCali wrote: |
| Fox wrote: |
| cwflaneur wrote: |
Did the writers of America's constitution predict this ridiculous situation? I think it's not what they had in mind. That clause was intended to protect people who may have needed the protection, and to bolster America's sense of civic nationality. It was not intended to provide a loophole to selfish opportunists armed with a research grant and a return ticket to Incheon airport. |
Isn't the birthright citizenship you're discussing a part of the 14th Amendment, meaning the original writers of the Constitution had nothing to do with it? Perhaps more importantly, how does America suffer from a small number of Korean youth becoming citizens due to having been born here? It's not as if they're arriving as spies to sabotage our nation from within, and it's also not as if America has a vast array of excessively generous social programs which would cause them to come here and simply leech. What about this bothers you so much? |
Probably something he read that's not current; to wit: the idea that the parents can immediately use their American citizen children to sponsor them for immigration. It's been quite some time since that's been the case. The other thing is probably simply that it's a more recent immigration generation than that of his or her own family. |
Actually, neither of those things. You're thinking of the anti-immigration crowd, and transposing their attitudes onto mine. I have nothing to do with that neolithic mentality. My original post isn't that hard to read, and it has absolutely nothing to do with immigration.
Also, it doesn't "bother me so much", and it definitely doesn't bother me on a simple dollars-and-cents basis as suggested above. It just amuses me (and yes, that amusement inevitably brings with it a certain mild contempt) that an insular society committed to the spirit of ethnic nationhood would spawn so many people who are eager and willing to exploit the one clause in the US constitution that most expresses the multi-ethnic spirit of civic nationhood, for their private benefit (whether that benefit is their own or their children's). |
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World Traveler
Joined: 29 May 2009
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 5:35 am Post subject: |
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| Kennyftw wrote: |
| we're in DEBT up to our eyeballs. The government is reckless and will ruin the country financially (its already begun) soon. We aren't rich. |
If the U.S. is not rich, then why is it the #1 place people want to come to? Did you know the United States accepts more legal immigrants each year than any other country? And that there is a long waiting list. That's not even counting the more than 10 million illegal immigrants currently living in the U.S. There are opportunities there and there will continue to be opportunities there for a long time to come.
Hope over fear.
You should feel blessed to have U.S. citizenship.
Turn off Fox News. Sensationalist/biased/alarmist reports aren't going to benefit your life. |
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World Traveler
Joined: 29 May 2009
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| Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 5:59 am Post subject: |
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Not as much 'Made in China' as you might think
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/money_co/2011/08/made-in-china.html?track=icymi
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| Goods and services from China accounted for only 2.7% of U.S. personal consumption spending in 2010, according to the report, The U.S. Content of "Made in China." About 88.5% of U.S. spending last year was on goods made here. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 1:16 am Post subject: |
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| World Traveler wrote: |
[ There are opportunities there and there will continue to be opportunities there for a long time to come.
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Right then. Why not go back and get one of these "opportunities"? |
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nukeday
Joined: 13 May 2010
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| World Traveler wrote: |
[ There are opportunities there and there will continue to be opportunities there for a long time to come.
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Right then. Why not go back and get one of these "opportunities"? |
Yeah! you can just love it or leave it, Tommy. |
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Koreadays
Joined: 20 May 2008
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 6:43 pm Post subject: |
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| nukeday wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| World Traveler wrote: |
[ There are opportunities there and there will continue to be opportunities there for a long time to come.
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Right then. Why not go back and get one of these "opportunities"? |
Yeah! you can just love it or leave it, Tommy. |
true words.. and frankly most daves posters have left it. |
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UknowsI
Joined: 16 Apr 2009
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| Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Some of the friends I grew up with in Europe were also born in America. They had to chose which citizenship to keep before they turned 21. I don't think any of them chose American citizenship, but their parents wanted to give them the best opportunities and the option to chose. Seems like a sound decision from their parents point of view as it gives more options but hardly any disadvantages. |
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