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Pronunciation difference between /a/ and /backwards c vowel/

 
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Enigma



Joined: 20 Mar 2008

PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 6:55 am    Post subject: Pronunciation difference between /a/ and /backwards c vowel/ Reply with quote

I was teaching an adult class the other night with American English File 2 and we did a section on pronunciation of /backwards c/ (doesn't display properly, but the vowel sound in e.g. fall, law, talk) and /a/ (e.g. got, opposite, stop). However I can't hear any difference at all between those 2 sounds. I did a little research on the net, and it seems that in British English, they're 2 distinct sounds, but in North American English, they're essentially the same (I'm Canadian). But if that's the case, I can't understand why the text (which I'm generally quite happy with and is supposed to teach American English) is teaching them as completely different sounds. If I can't hear a difference, how do they expect a student to be able to hear one?
So I'm curious, do any of you (North Americans) teach them as separate sounds, or do you treat them the same?

Thanks
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Adventurer



Joined: 28 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 7:12 am    Post subject: Re: Pronunciation difference between /a/ and /backwards c vo Reply with quote

Enigma wrote:
I was teaching an adult class the other night with American English File 2 and we did a section on pronunciation of /backwards c/ (doesn't display properly, but the vowel sound in e.g. fall, law, talk) and /a/ (e.g. got, opposite, stop). However I can't hear any difference at all between those 2 sounds. I did a little research on the net, and it seems that in British English, they're 2 distinct sounds, but in North American English, they're essentially the same (I'm Canadian). But if that's the case, I can't understand why the text (which I'm generally quite happy with and is supposed to teach American English) is teaching them as completely different sounds. If I can't hear a difference, how do they expect a student to be able to hear one?
So I'm curious, do any of you (North Americans) teach them as separate sounds, or do you treat them the same?

Thanks


That's a difficult one to answer, but it depens on your North American accent. They can sound somewhat different. The a in fall is a longer a for many people than the a sound in stop, there's no stretch in it.
Do you know what I mean?
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Charlie Bourque



Joined: 27 Jun 2010

PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Google.

"Interactive IPA"
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nathanrutledge



Joined: 01 May 2008
Location: Marakesh

PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

^^^ what he said.

I have the General American accent, midwestern united states.

Fall, law, talk, all have a low sound to them, almost an "o" sound.

got, opposite, stop all have a higher, more nasally sound to them. If you look at the IPA stuff (wikipedia has some great sound files for all of these sounds) you'll be able to hear the difference.

Really though, I wouldn't worry about it too much. Just explain to the students that some accents differentiate the sound and others don't. Korean has different accents and sounds (ever notice how in Seoul, 오,우,어,아 can all sound the same depending on the person and the word?). They'll understand it.
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Confused Canadian



Joined: 21 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 9:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Pronunciation difference between /a/ and /backwards c vo Reply with quote

Enigma wrote:
I was teaching an adult class the other night with American English File 2 and we did a section on pronunciation of /backwards c/ (doesn't display properly, but the vowel sound in e.g. fall, law, talk) and /a/ (e.g. got, opposite, stop). However I can't hear any difference at all between those 2 sounds. I did a little research on the net, and it seems that in British English, they're 2 distinct sounds, but in North American English, they're essentially the same (I'm Canadian). But if that's the case, I can't understand why the text (which I'm generally quite happy with and is supposed to teach American English) is teaching them as completely different sounds. If I can't hear a difference, how do they expect a student to be able to hear one?
So I'm curious, do any of you (North Americans) teach them as separate sounds, or do you treat them the same?

Thanks


As said before, it depends on where you're from.

For me, the two sounds are identical.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cot%E2%80%93caught_merger#Cot.E2.80.93caught_merger
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