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Korea to build facilities on Dokdo
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flakfizer

Joined: 12 Nov 2004
Location: scaling the Cliffs of Insanity with a frayed rope.

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2011 10:28 pm Post subject: Korea to build facilities on Dokdo

http://www.koreaherald.com/business/Detail.jsp?newsMLId=20111125000647
From the Korea Herald

Quote:

South Korea will establish a new sea wall and tourist facilities in waters off Dokdo by as early as 2016, aiming to bolster its control over the long-disputed rocky islets, officials said.

The plan is the latest in a series of the government�s measures to guard against Japan�s repeated territorial claim over the islets, which it calls Takeshima. Seoul officials said the 400 billion won ($344.4 million) package aimed to galvanize tourism and facilitate access there.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a279/rtflakfizer/newdokdo2x.jpg (artist's conception)

Julius

Joined: 27 Jul 2006

Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2011 11:13 pm Post subject:

That is so typical... Basically they will destroy the picturesque and natural qualities of the islets in order for someone to make lots of money. Don't they have something called "planning permission" in this country?

Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2011 2:46 am Post subject:

Julius wrote:

That is so typical... Rolling Eyes

Basically they will destroy the picturesque and natural qualities of the islets in order for someone to make lots of money.

Don't they have something called "planning permission" in this country?

I wonder how people living off the Gulf of Mexico feel about American's lecturing other people's on their business first approach to the environment.

everything-is-everything

Joined: 06 Jun 2011

Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2011 6:25 am Post subject:

Steelrails wrote:

Julius wrote:

That is so typical... Rolling Eyes

Basically they will destroy the picturesque and natural qualities of the islets in order for someone to make lots of money.

Don't they have something called "planning permission" in this country?

I wonder how people living off the Gulf of Mexico feel about American's lecturing other people's on their business first approach to the environment.

So if a German spoke out about the genocide in Rwanda, his opinion wouldn't be credible?

Or how about a Japanese warning about the building of nuclear facilities on fault lines?

Seriously Steel, I understand that there is a lot of stupidy said against Korea and Koreans on this board.

But dude, just stop defending every little thing. It makes you look unreasonable.

Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2011 9:38 am Post subject:

everything-is-everything wrote:

Steelrails wrote:

Julius wrote:

That is so typical... Rolling Eyes

Basically they will destroy the picturesque and natural qualities of the islets in order for someone to make lots of money.

Don't they have something called "planning permission" in this country?

I wonder how people living off the Gulf of Mexico feel about American's lecturing other people's on their business first approach to the environment.

If Germany was presently engaged in genocide, then yes, it wouldn't be quite so credible.

It's a matter of tone. You get posters who say these things who don't set off the apologist tripwires, but then others say things in a certain way that clearly has some sort of bigoted motive behind it.

I mean, don't we do the same thing when some ajosshi or Korean Sentry or Korea Times person says something about westerners that Koreans engage in themselves? Isn't it fair game to call them on that? Or is it a double standard?

Julius

Joined: 27 Jul 2006

Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2011 10:02 am Post subject:

Steelrails wrote:

You get posters who say these things who don't set off the apologist tripwires, but then others say things in a certain way

Cmon rails you have to admit that the developers invariably get carte blanche in this country... to lay as much tacky concrete wherever they want.
Korea simply doesn't have the same institutions that the west does when it comes to planning and safeguarding sites of scenic or scientific interest.
The whole country resembles a construction site at times and everything is up for grabs.

Forget the seals or "valuable marine life" that appears on the "dokdo stamps". Dokdo will be a litter-strewn parking lot with loudspeakers and a soju tent within a couple of years. Some businessman has noticed its potential for profits and wants to ship boatloads of rabidly nationalistic day-trippers in for group anti-japan chants with headbands.

everything-is-everything

Joined: 06 Jun 2011

Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2011 11:31 am Post subject:

Steelrails wrote:

I mean, don't we do the same thing when some ajosshi or Korean Sentry or Korea Times person says something about westerners that Koreans engage in themselves? Isn't it fair game to call them on that? Or is it a double standard?

If you spend your time interacting with the crazies then you become one yourself. Laughing

Dude, seriously, it'd be better for your mental health if you just ignored the people who continuously post one sided messages.

I used to feel that way about you but i see a glimmer of hope in some of your posts which is why I still respond. Cool

Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2011 4:33 pm Post subject:

Quote:

Well that may be so, but I think development is the norm in any industrialized nation. Oh sure you may get some hippies protesting and a bunch of regulations that far from ensuring the place is preserved, instead limit access only to those with top notch legal teams and campaign contributions, but seriously...

And there are preservationist movements here as well. Some work. Some fail.

The problem is that this is also a territorial dispute. Throughout history "improving" a piece of land or whatever is often used when settling claim disputes.

Quote:

If you spend your time interacting with the crazies then you become one yourself.

Dude, seriously, it'd be better for your mental health if you just ignored the people who continuously post one sided messages.

I used to feel that way about you but i see a glimmer of hope in some of your posts which is why I still respond.

Probably true, but I enjoy firing off a post or three and it getting the neurons a firin'.

Otherwise all I'd be typing is "Hi Jinho, this is Nami." I might as well just jam a pencil into my eye, through to my brain and swirl it.

schwa

Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Yap

Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2011 4:58 pm Post subject:

Seems to me Korea has a reasonable historic claim to Dokdo. De facto possession as well. The islets are hardly a unique natural wonder, what harm in their development?

Swampfox10mm

Joined: 24 Mar 2011

Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2011 5:17 pm Post subject:

Steelrails wrote:

Julius wrote:

That is so typical... Rolling Eyes

Basically they will destroy the picturesque and natural qualities of the islets in order for someone to make lots of money.

Don't they have something called "planning permission" in this country?

I wonder how people living off the Gulf of Mexico feel about American's lecturing other people's on their business first approach to the environment.

Can you EVER let arguments about Korea stand on their own, or do you have to constantly revert to pointing out some unrelated incident in the USA?

You do Korea a real disservice by this, and simply bolster the belief of many people that Korea is nothing but the USA's pet dog.

northway

Joined: 05 Jul 2010

Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2011 5:32 pm Post subject:

Steelrails wrote:

Quote:

It's a little different when the country's president was the CEO of one of the country's largest companies.

meangradin

Joined: 10 Mar 2006

Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2011 6:40 pm Post subject:

dokdo needs a hagwon!

Julius

Joined: 27 Jul 2006

Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2011 9:52 pm Post subject:

schwa wrote:

The islets are hardly a unique natural wonder, what harm in their development?

What harm in just leaving them as they are, natural and unspoilt? Seals live there, birds nest on them, fish utilise them.

Why the urge to crassly destroy all of this for the sake of making a few bucks? Sorry but the sort of ugly development that characterizes a lot of korea would simply not be allowed in advanced countries. Its called a sense of taste and pride in your countrys natural heritage. If you think that is worthless, then go and try to build apartment complexes all over yellowstone and see how far you get.

Steelrails wrote:

I think development is the norm in any industrialized nation. Oh sure you may get some hippies protesting and a bunch of regulations that far from ensuring the place is preserved, instead limit access only to those with top notch legal teams and campaign contributions, but seriously...

Surely national pride seeks to preserve the national heritage rather than selling their souls to make more money constantly?

The mentality you describe is not a first world one. More construction does not necessarily equal advancement, and it is not necessary to trash your environment in order to develop. There comes a point where sacrificing the charm, beauty, and environmental health of your country is just not worth the consequences to your quality of life. Maybe thats why so many Koreans want to emigrate to other countries that have actually preserved their areas of scenic beauty.

Yes, western nations did make some mistakes in their development also, but Korea is in a position to learn from them rather repeating them.

Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2011 3:43 am Post subject:

Swampfox10mm wrote:

Steelrails wrote:

Julius wrote:

That is so typical... Rolling Eyes

Basically they will destroy the picturesque and natural qualities of the islets in order for someone to make lots of money.

Don't they have something called "planning permission" in this country?

I wonder how people living off the Gulf of Mexico feel about American's lecturing other people's on their business first approach to the environment.

Well when people frame arguments in such a manner as implying that the behavior in question is unique to Korea, then yes I think it's incredibly valid to bring up situations where it happens elsewhere.

"This is a Korean problem"
Saying it happens elsewhere disproves the statement above.

Frankly it sounds like Koreans who pontificate on something being great about Korea or something bad not happening in Korea and then getting defensive and touchy when that's disproven.

Can people here who actually make those claims not whine and cry when their central premise is looked into? If you're going to dish it out...

Or maybe take the time before letting off a blast to stop and look if such behavior takes place back home, rather than letting anger's heat to drive you.

ThingsComeAround

Joined: 07 Nov 2008

Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2011 4:04 am Post subject:

When Korea hosted a beauty pageant on Dokdo, I lost respect. When Japanese flew to Incheon (that in and of itsself making a statement) and people protested, I lost interest. In this latest move, I smell graft. Two years after they have it built it will hemorrhage money. You can bet man-won on that.

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