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Korea: the New United States
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jaj



Joined: 01 Oct 2011

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 4:05 am    Post subject: Korea: the New United States Reply with quote

Recently, a few of my students have gone on research missions to the US in behalf of their companies to analyze weird stuff like how we run supermarkets, design colleges and houses. The trips didn't seem consistent with their actual job descriptions as I understood them. On returning, one of them made a comment about our 'unlimited space." It sounded ominous.

Another student remarked the other day that she thinks that Koreans are going to move over to learning British style English because it's a "higher quality." (She sounded like she was buying gloves). When I told her that countries in Asia where the people speak with Britishy accents like India, have historical ties to the UK that Korea doesn't, she changed the subject to computer chips that are being developed to insert into people's brains so the language acquisition process is simplified.

Am I the only one creeped out by how Koreans cherry pick American ideas and culture -- Jim Crow hiring practices, a faux Central Park, and round eye surgery etc. and where this is leading?
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kenglish



Joined: 10 Mar 2011

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 4:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gasp! another country idolizing western culture and adapting to themselves every aspect of it that they can embody?this is shocking indeed!

p.s. have you been to japan lately?
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jaj



Joined: 01 Oct 2011

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 4:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, haven't been to Japan, but hear that it's not as ambitiously "Western". Are you there?
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1927



Joined: 02 Oct 2011

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Am I the only one creeped out by how Koreans cherry pick American ideas and culture -- Jim Crow hiring practices, a faux Central Park, and round eye surgery etc. and where this is leading?


This was straight up just a weird post. Why in heck would you be 'creeped' out???

Also, can you explain how a) having a park in the middle of the city and b) round eye surgery are specific to American culture?

Even further, be careful using this term 'western'. I do get tired of people bandying it around. I'm pretty sure a German would not appreciate being considered the same culture as an American; much like the Koreans do not like being thrown in the same pot as Mongolian, Burmese, Chinese, etc - ie 'Eastern' culture. Same, same but quite different.

It seems that the ocean you're swimming in, young one, may in fact be merely a pond.
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jaj



Joined: 01 Oct 2011

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My students tell me that all Western food looks the same to them, use the terms Eastern and Western all the time as there are actually common histories and linguistic similarities as well as contemporary culture shared between East Asian countries, lots more than you're most likely aware of. Sounds like you're the one in the small pond, but if you lent a single interesting insight, I'd be more motivated to chat further with you...btw, clearly the Central Park reference is over your head and of course Americans don't get round eye surgery -- they have round eyes -- wow, to say you're completely not understanding my post, is an understatement, old one.
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bekinseki



Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Location: Korea

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Central Park is hardly in the middle of the city. Hell, I wouldn't even call Songdo a city.
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Captain Corea



Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Americans don't get double eyelid surgery? You sure on that?
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jvalmer



Joined: 06 Jun 2003

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Captain Corea wrote:
Americans don't get double eyelid surgery? You sure on that?

That's what I was thinking too. But then a lot here may not consider people of non-European descent American... Sad
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1927



Joined: 02 Oct 2011

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Americans don't get round eye surgery -- they have round eyes


Wow! That's not even a pond you're in - it's a fishbowl!
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jaj



Joined: 01 Oct 2011

PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 2:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@1927, I'd rather be in a fish bowl than the white porcelain variety that makes a flushing sound that you're in.

I'll ignore the brown-nosers trying to make the case that the adoption of round eyes, white skin and English names is not part of Korea's western redesign.
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The Floating World



Joined: 01 Oct 2011
Location: Here

PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Both Germany and the USA and all of Europe share clearly so many fundamental aspects of western culture which their societies have been and are built on which developed from the Greek and Roman traditions that I'm not even going to point them out.

Western, they all very much are.
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Steelrails



Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Floating World wrote:
Both Germany and the USA and all of Europe share clearly so many fundamental aspects of western culture which their societies have been and are built on which developed from the Greek and Roman traditions that I'm not even going to point them out.

Western, they all very much are.


Actually the foundation of much of Western culture resides in an Eastern religion: Christianity, in addition to the Greco-Roman tradition. And much of the progress of Europe was possible due to the contributions of a Semitic, Eastern people: The Jews. They contributed much in spite of attempts to exterminate them.

Western civilization became a hybrid, adapting the best parts, after the introduction of Christianity. As in many situations where one can take the best of both worlds, this had great effects, though it took nearly 1000 years sorting things out before the benefits were clear.

This bodes well for Asia and Africa. As they now get to choose the best parts of multiple traditions, it will mean improved conditions for their people.
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1927



Joined: 02 Oct 2011

PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OP, you did not answer my question.

Quote:
Why in heck would you be 'creeped' out???


I'm curious as to why you have such a strong reaction to the way other people choose to live their lives; or at least to way you perceive them to live their lives. Just remember your fishbowl lens may cause you to view things differently to how they actually are. Are you able to concede this?

FYI, the attitude of pale skin = beauty in Asia is not a modern concept and has a lot more to do with class than it does with race. I'm not sure that 'whitening' oneself has anything to do with looking European or 'American'.

A somewhat shallow but succinct article for you:
http://matadornetwork.com/bnt/white-skin-why-racism-in-asia-isnt-quite-what-you-think/#comments

More interesting than the article are the comments written by Asians of varying nationalities. Read through them and you may find some 'insight' yourself.
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The Floating World



Joined: 01 Oct 2011
Location: Here

PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry SR but a lot of the fundamental foundations of What we call western society, it's beliefs, institutions, political insitutions and systems, outlooks, philosophies, evolved from Greece and then Rome.

Without the above there is no concievable way we would live in societies recongisable to the ones we live in today.

That doesn't mean Christianity hasn't shaped them either, but it like comparing the doors and windows of a house to the ground under it and the foundations it was built upon as well as the very stone it is made from.

The Greek ideas on the state and their unique take on the concept of the individual, and also the forms (inlcuing in a large way gemeotry and math) and in no small way at all, the concept of the atom are just so part of what NW European and NA society are and have become it is impossible to overlook it.

Of course they in turn were influened from the Arab world and India and no culture lives in isolation (hi Korea) but the directions in which they took all of the above subjects are essential to what western societies are today and in fact, on a structural and technical level what the rest of the world is becoming.
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Chet Wautlands



Joined: 11 Oct 2008

PostPosted: Sat Oct 29, 2011 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OP, the backlash you are experiencing in a result of your awkward first post. What exactly are you asking?

Will Korea try to become the U.S.? No. However, because the U.S. has been the major influencing culture for at least the past 60 years, Korean people (and as a result Korea) are obviously going to gravitate towards that ideal. So has every other country on the planet.

One of your students believes that British English (British Received Pronunciation) sounds higher class than American. She doesn't represent most Koreans and even in most Koreans DID think British RP was of a higher class than American English (a broad term), it would only be because this notion has been established by native English speakers.

What is happening in Korea, Japan, China, Germany, Canada and even in America is a gradual but increasing move towards a more American culture. While this is happening, elements of other cultures will become a part of the American culture. Because of modern technology, this is the first time in history that a culture has been able to affect so many other cultures. I'm curious to see how it ends up, but I imagine that culture, like race, is a term that will have a fairly different meaning in 50+ years from now.
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