|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Curious George
Joined: 06 Apr 2004
Location: Seoul, Korea
|
 Posted: Mon May 31, 2004 7:27 pm Post subject: Where to buy a great gaming computer? |
 |
|
Hey all you gameheads, where can I buy a desktop for gaming.
I want it to be great but not top of the line.
Looking for a decent motherboard with brand name 1024 RAM
P4 3.0 Pentium or the AMD 3000 64 bit (Which is better?) with the 800 mhz FSB.
ATI Radeon 9600 PRO Video or 9700 PRO if I can get one cheap enough.
7200 rpm hard drive
CD burner
and all the other stuff that usually comes with....
I went to one of those shops at the top of the building next to Yongsan station but they wanted to build it with a Chinese motherboard and RAM. They wanted 1.3 million won which I thought was way too much money, but that did include a Samsung DVD/CD burner and an ATI 9600 PRO but no monitor.
So, can anyone point me to a shop that will build me one with good components at a fair price?
Also, how much should I expect to pay for a system like this?
Finally, where can I buy a good LCD monitor for a fair price?
Thanks for the advice in advance. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
kangnamdragon
Joined: 17 Jan 2003
Location: Kangnam, Seoul, Korea
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Gord
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
|
| Posted: Mon May 31, 2004 8:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
1.3 isn't a bad price, assuming they are sticking with quality parts. If you want the high end toys, you're going to have to pay the price. The 3.0GHz processor alone is nearly 300,000. RAM is another 200,000 if you're lucky. That's 500,000 right there on two parts.
Next up, add in a quality motherboard and drive, and you're up to 700,000. The card will set you back another 200,000 depending on the model. 900,000. Next, CD burner and you're nearly at a million. Then you need a case, power supply and keyboard which pushes you over the million mark.
Then you will still need an O/S. Add nother 100,000. We're past 1.1 without even factoring in the cost of someone putting it together and other components you still might want, and the monitor isn't even on the radar yet.
Just how much are you planning to spend? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Demophobe
Joined: 17 May 2004
|
| Posted: Mon May 31, 2004 8:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Go here and you can find all of the prices and locations.
http://www.danawa.co.kr
menu is at the top.
I strongly recommend buying the parts and either building it yourself, or have someone put it together for you. The "package" computers always short you somehow. Not by ripping you off, but they often use the cheapest parts they can for things that most people don't really know about.
When people shop for a computer, they are only concerned with certain things. Often the mainboard, RAM and hard drives are skimped on to save some cash. Go and buy all the parts you need yourself. Building a computer is very, very easy.
I go to one store all the time. I give him my list and he makes all the calls and all of the parts I want are delivered to his shop. He charges me about 20-30,000 for this convenience.
I wish I could remember his shop's name...he doesn't speak English, but he is a really good guy. He will even handle returns on all items, if necessary.
You can go into any shop with your list and they will probably do a similar service. Scrutinize faces....that's how I found this guy. He just looked like a nice guy...not like some shify sheister. He was a bit older...I trust the older guys there more.
Watch prices. They all have internet access in their shops...show them the danawa site if there is a problem. You can barter as well. Not too low if the guy is doing all of the legwork for you by calling and getting the parts you want, but a little leeway is there. Paying by cash is preferred...many times foreign credit cards don't work anyways
. I can't tell you how cool that is...having them call around for you....walking around there looking for everything makes for a crap day.
If I do find the store's telephone number that I always go to, I will let you know. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
The Lemon
Joined: 11 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Mon May 31, 2004 8:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Further to Gord's post - are you sure you need the P4 3.0? Consider the Athlon XP, and put the money you save towards a good monitor.
Just for fun I priced out what some decent parts would cost if you bought them separately on Omi, and here's what I came up with:
268,000 -cpu
57,000 - mbrd (can go higher or lower -this is midrange)
220,000 - ram (Samsung, 1 GB)
92,000 - ATI 9600 card
77,000 hard drive (80gb, 7200)
70, case, decent power, mouse, kbrd
120,000 DVD burner (4x)
Total - 900,000w
And as Gord points out, you'd need an OS, and to pay a guy to assemble it if you don't feel up to it yourself. 1.3 isn't too crazy-high.
By the way, don't be scared off by "made in China" computer components. Most components are made in China or Taiwan, and I've never noticed any step down in quality or reliability based on that vs those made in Korea or elsewhere.
About LCD monitors - the cheapest 15 inch LCDs are in the 300~350,000w range. They're not cheap. I have one and like it, but a good CRT monitor actually delivers better color, if you're into doing any graphics work. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Demophobe
Joined: 17 May 2004
|
| Posted: Mon May 31, 2004 10:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Good luck NOT buying something made in Taiwan or China. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Curious George
Joined: 06 Apr 2004
Location: Seoul, Korea
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 1:31 am Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks for all the advice guys.
Gord wrote:
"1.3 isn't a bad price, assuming they are sticking with quality parts."
Thats the problem. It looked like a really cheap Chinese mobo and cheap RAM too with names I never heard of. I am a little bit computer literate in regards to hardware, so I know what the good brands are for the most part.
I would love to just buy the parts myself and build the computer but I have never done it before. I have switched out hard drives, sound boards, RAM, video cards etc but have never messed with motherboards or building a whole system. I am afraid I would screw it up. Messing with the processor chips really scares me, hehe.
I dont mind paying 1.3 mil, but I want quality parts not cheap ones for that price. I have my own copy of Windows XP so dont need a OS which will save me a little money. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
The Lemon
Joined: 11 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 2:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| Thats the problem. It looked like a really cheap Chinese mobo and cheap RAM too with names I never heard of. I am a little bit computer literate in regards to hardware, so I know what the good brands are for the most part. |
Well, many of us are computer literate here. Trust me when I say that the origin of the product (China vs Korea, or whatever) is meaningless in determining quality. Also, with computer components, the brand names are often meaningless, too. OEM factories in China routinely make products that have better known brand names stamped on them. I'd shop on price and features, not country, or (unless it's a really good motherboard brand like ABIT, or drive brand like Plextor) brand name.
What's much more important is WHO you're buying the stuff from. If the part fries, brand name or not, they should be willing to replace it without hassles. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Demophobe
Joined: 17 May 2004
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 2:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
Sorry, Lemon, but I beg to differ.
Actually, I am not sure what you mean...generic computer parts? Like what, for example?
Hard drives...name is important. Graphics, mainboards, RAM, CPU, CD-RWs, DVD-rws, mouse, keyboard (yes, keyboard...I bought a keyboard from a Korean company that folded, leaving no drivers and keys that thus didn't work)...everything in a computer is brand-name, and therefore reputation dependant.
I wouldn't buy anything, save a case or 56k modem that wasn't produced by a reputable company. OEM is notorious for being second-rate. I don't know about you, but most people I know shy away from OEM unless they are on a big-time budget. In computers, always look for brand-names. The quality, afterservice, and RMA is tops. In the world of computers, brand names are everything.
Perhaps you have had good luck with OEM. It seems shady to me...no packaging, no documentation...just the item...bare bones.
Korean brands are world-competitive. Suma, Unitech, Samsung, etc...these brands can be researched easily on the net.
Always look for reviews. If there are no reviews on a product, buyer beware. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 3:17 am Post subject: |
|
|
| I think perhaps you misunderstand the concept or meaning of OEM. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Demophobe
Joined: 17 May 2004
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 3:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
Ok...terminology thing....my bad.
Original Equipment Manufacturer. Not rocket science.
The company wholesales their products without a middle man. Not rocket science.
That middle man, in Korea anyways, is sometimes the difference between an easy exchange and a long, drawn out pain. I have experienced this.
I don't usually speak of things I don't know. As far as which is better for the consumer, well, OEM are usually intended for built PCs, not for over-the-counter sales. Yes, it happens all the time, but it was not the original purpose of OEM parts. Consumer boxed parts are more reliable, because the company has more riding on the product. If one buys a PC and the CD-ROM fails, they will more blame the computer as a whole, or the shop. The boxed retail items have the company's logo all over the box, as well as the distributor. A failure of the part then directly reflects back to the CD-ROM company.
Thus, they have more packaging, more care in delivering a perfect product, and a better support network should things go wrong. Also, this is Korea, land of the morning knock-off. You sometimes never know what you are buying, going OEM.
Anyways, Curious George, if you are still tuning in to this post...
The 9600 comes in 2 flavors...the regular with TSOP BGA (long, flat ram) and TBGA (smaller "squarish" looking)..the TBGA is higher clocked...called "Extreme Edition". Same price, but faster. The 9600 will also be fully DX9 compliant, unlike the 9700Pro. Good for upcoming titles, and few existing ones. (Far Cry, Painkiller)
9800Pros can be a good deal soon...wait for the X800 to hit the shelves.
Should be a few weeks or so. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
The Lemon
Joined: 11 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 6:04 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Demophobe wrote: |
Ok...terminology thing....my bad.
Original Equipment Manufacturer. Not rocket science.
The company wholesales their products without a middle man. Not rocket science. |
Not quite. I'm talking about the factory in China or Taiwan that stamps out a part that's sold in Korea with the Samsung label, but Samsung had nothing to do with its manufacture or design. It is in fact the product of a different company, and also available as a no-name "knock-off", but is really precisely the same product as the Samsung, built to the same specs. There is no evidence that the "branded" item is any better than the non-branded one, though it may have better support (better A/S network in Korea, etc).
We can see this with most computer components except hard drives, memory, printers and CPUs, which tend to be dominated by brand names. I don't think I've ever seen a non-major brand printer in Yongsan, for example. And there haven't been any cheese-level CPUs since the old Cyrix/VIA chips. It's Intel, AMD, or nothing. For hard drives, it's Samsung, WD, Seagate, Maxtor, Quantum, IBM or nothing.
I've seen mainboards, graphics and sound cards, monitors and other peripherals made and marketed like this. Even digital cameras have this heritage - many Samsung digital cameras are the product of a little known Taiwanese company, "Premier", for example.
You mentioned Unitech. It's a good example of a Korean brand name that makes few if any of the products it sells. They're really Taiwanese Microstar boards, and others, with a Unitech label. Some of their models even retain the MS-*** Microstar designation.
For computer parts, the far more important concern is the brand of chip the item uses, and THOSE are important brands. If it's a mainboard, is it an Nvidia Nforce, or Intel, or VIA, or SiS..? If it's a sound card, is it a CMI8738 cheapie or an upscale VIA Envy 24? Is it an Nvidia graphics card, or ATI, or....? You get the picture. Those brands matter.
I've found that country of origin of the actual piece is of minimal importance with regards to its quality, reliability, or performance. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Demophobe
Joined: 17 May 2004
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 3:43 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| The Lemon wrote: |
| Demophobe wrote: |
Ok...terminology thing....my bad.
Original Equipment Manufacturer. Not rocket science.
The company wholesales their products without a middle man. Not rocket science. |
Not quite. I'm talking about the factory in China or Taiwan that stamps out a part that's sold in Korea with the Samsung label, but Samsung had nothing to do with its manufacture or design. It is in fact the product of a different company, and also available as a no-name "knock-off", but is really precisely the same product as the Samsung, built to the same specs. There is no evidence that the "branded" item is any better than the non-branded one, though it may have better support (better A/S network in Korea, etc).
We can see this with most computer components except hard drives, memory, printers and CPUs, which tend to be dominated by brand names. I don't think I've ever seen a non-major brand printer in Yongsan, for example. And there haven't been any cheese-level CPUs since the old Cyrix/VIA chips. It's Intel, AMD, or nothing. For hard drives, it's Samsung, WD, Seagate, Maxtor, Quantum, IBM or nothing.
I've seen mainboards, graphics and sound cards, monitors and other peripherals made and marketed like this. Even digital cameras have this heritage - many Samsung digital cameras are the product of a little known Taiwanese company, "Premier", for example.
You mentioned Unitech. It's a good example of a Korean brand name that makes few if any of the products it sells. They're really Taiwanese Microstar boards, and others, with a Unitech label. Some of their models even retain the MS-*** Microstar designation.
For computer parts, the far more important concern is the brand of chip the item uses, and THOSE are important brands. If it's a mainboard, is it an Nvidia Nforce, or Intel, or VIA, or SiS..? If it's a sound card, is it a CMI8738 cheapie or an upscale VIA Envy 24? Is it an Nvidia graphics card, or ATI, or....? You get the picture. Those brands matter.
I've found that country of origin of the actual piece is of minimal importance with regards to its quality, reliability, or performance. |
No evidence?!
Well, "generic" RAM is famous for being of poor quality within the community. Samsung DDR RAM (not RDRAM, GDDR3) is also "slow", with high speeds, but very loose timings. Hynix is another one...these parts are all designed by the Korean company (or whatever, Infineon, Mushkin..) but fabbed and assembled in Taiwan. The big 6 fabs are all located in Taiwan. There are plans for other countries such as Germany, the US and Mexico, but right now, designs for probably 80% of silicon is produced by TSMC or the like, and fabbed there. They don't design anything.
The difference lies in the name bringing with it responsibility, accountability and quality.
Your second paragraph strenghtens my point. Those components aside, the basic computer is left with what? Mainboard, RAM and perhaps a LAN card and graphics card, which is ALWAYS a brand name part. Nobody would buy a no-name card, and ATI, nVidia and Matrox all have standards that must be met before their chips are sold to anyone.
Mainboards...generic?!? Never seen one and would never buy one. This is the body of the computer....skimp on this, you are asking for trouble. RAM...I have discussed. LAN cards? Who cares? Very basic piece of silicon. It's all software...the cards is just a feeder of data. A gate.
I don't understand what you are trying to say. I think you are saying the same thing as me. Sub-contracting is a different idea than OEM. Of course when a company designs something, they will sell the design. Some companies have lower standards for who they sell it to. Samsung was famous for letting anyone build their stuff, but that is changing now....they are trying to go more upscale, moving out of Wal-mart, and thus moving away from the lower quality assemblers (licensees).
SUMA is the same as Unitech. They design, Taiwan fabs. They assemble and the parts are sold as "branded". The quality comes from the competition.
Well, you seem to have no clear goal in what you are saying. Now you say it's the chips that are important (and we all know that most companies won't let just anyone who wants to assemble their chipsets), and the assembly process is of no consequence. Well, due to quality controls implemented through the chipset producers, this is partially true. Intel, nVidia, ATI, Sis, Via...they all have places they have chosen as "partners", and thus, we are guaranteed a certain level of quality, regardless of if it's a "Sparkle" GeForce or an Asus, made in China or Taiwan. (this is debateable too....customer loyalty usually comes from reputation, which is always a child of quality.)
Why then did Via have so much trouble in the early days? Because of bad assembly....people cutting corners on other aspects of the mainboard assembly. Via changed assemblers.
Look at the ASUS P4T533 scandal. Mainboards were being made with faulty volatage regulators on the 5V rail...again, due to poor assembly. They changed assemblers.
Anyways....I am rambling. You are right about assembly because of the reasons I have outlined.
I thought we were talking about OEM vs. retail?
There is evidence that "branded" parts are more reliable than "non-branded" parts. It's called sales. Look at retail vs. OEM stats in the public consumer market. Not in the corporate market, but on the streets, as it were. This is clear evidence of the consumer trust for "branded" products...and I contend that this trust was born of reputation, which as I said before, is a child of quality.
You believe that sub-contracting produces similar quality products, which is an entirely different theory. Of course, you are right, but what is the point? These items are "branded". This assures quality. So.....?
Anyways, here in Korea, buying OEM is foolish. Those guys down at Yongsan are notoious for re-furbishing, re-labelling and re-building everything and re-selling it as new OEM. This serves my original point, about why OEM is less desirable than retail, and is only one example of why.
Sorry to be so long-winded. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Crois
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Location: You could be next so watch out.
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Ask the PC bang if they are selling any. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Curious George
Joined: 06 Apr 2004
Location: Seoul, Korea
|
| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 8:28 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Damn, I didnt mean to start a war!!!!
I really just wanted some advice, lol.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
