|
Korean Job Discussion Forums "The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
Poker
Joined: 16 Jan 2010
|
Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2013 5:58 pm Post subject: Grammar explanation required |
|
|
Hi, please share your knowledge.
"I saw people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
That is in the text book. Now when do we use the following?
1. "I saw people being dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
2. "I saw that people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
Thank you |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
tob55
Joined: 29 Apr 2007
|
Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:08 pm Post subject: Re: Grammar explanation required |
|
|
Poker wrote: |
Hi, please share your knowledge.
"I saw people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
That is in the text book. Now when do we use the following?
1. "I saw people being dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
2. "I saw that people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
Thank you |
Just from an observation point of view
1. Your first example cites an observation by you about the dress attire of people.
2. The second sentence is about an observation by you of others physically being dressed by someone assisting them.
3. The third observation is similar to the first except for the fact "that" is used as a modifier to point to the action of the sentence "people dressed up as movie characters.
These all have a semantic relationship to the speaker as an observer. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
drcrazy
Joined: 19 Feb 2003 Location: Pusan. Yes, that's right. Pusan NOT Busan. I ain't never been to no place called Busan
|
Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
In any case, #2 is incorrect. "I saw that people had dressed up as popular movie characters.... |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
ontheway
Joined: 24 Aug 2005 Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...
|
Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 4:02 am Post subject: |
|
|
drcrazy wrote: |
In any case, #2 is incorrect. "I saw that people had dressed up as popular movie characters.... |
#2 is perfectly fine. It just depends on the context.
When I was in High School, I was interested in a career as a performer, so I visited the Drama Club. They had a variety of activities every week. I saw that they put on a different play each week. I saw that they performed musical numbers and stand-up comedy. I saw that they dressed up as popular movie characters. It looked like a lot of fun, but I didn't join. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
some waygug-in
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
|
Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 5:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
I saw people being dressed up .... etc.
This one means that you actually watched the action of the people getting
their costumes on.
The other two just relate that the people were already wearing them.
There is no difference between the first and third sentence.
The "that" is implied in the first sentence.
Of course, context could make them different. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
transmogrifier
Joined: 02 Jan 2012 Location: Seoul, South Korea
|
Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 5:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
Actually, the first sentence is a relative clause (well, a reduced form):
I saw people (who were) dressed up.....
And the third one is a noun clause:
I saw that people dressed up.....
Now, the sentence
"I see people dressed up...." is possible as a noun clause, with the "I see" used in a figurative sense (i.e., you use it in a way to emphasize that you have noticed something) , but I don't think that construction works in past tense |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
YTMND
Joined: 16 Jan 2012 Location: You're the man now dog!!
|
Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:11 am Post subject: |
|
|
Quote: |
1. "I saw people being dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman." |
Talks about the event in the past in reference to something commonly understandable. We don't know if the speaker will see people dressed up in the same garb again.
Quote: |
2. "I saw that people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman." |
Talks about an event that happened in the past and can/does happen now. Hence, we can expect to see them in the same garb tomorrow, next week, or sometime in the future. Indicates a regular occurrence grammatically.
In this case, sentence two is not a complete sentence.
2. "I saw that people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman ________________."
2. "I saw that people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman really like (watching) movies."
The first sentence is the closest to "I saw people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman." |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
ontheway
Joined: 24 Aug 2005 Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...
|
Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:29 am Post subject: Re: Grammar explanation required |
|
|
Poker wrote: |
"I saw people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
"I saw people being dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
"I saw that people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
|
All three sentences are fine. Each is a complete sentence as is. If you are making some kind of test, each of these is a grammatically correct sentence. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
YTMND
Joined: 16 Jan 2012 Location: You're the man now dog!!
|
Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:31 am Post subject: Re: Grammar explanation required |
|
|
ontheway wrote: |
Poker wrote: |
"I saw people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
"I saw people being dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
"I saw that people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
|
All three sentences are fine. Each is a complete sentence as is. If you are making some kind of test, each of these is a grammatically correct sentence. |
But one is in the book, so I think we should analyze things based on what the book said. The first sentence reflects the book, not the second. Hence, incomplete. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
some waygug-in
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
|
Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:03 pm Post subject: |
|
|
On second thought;
The sentence in the book is just noting a past event.
The "being" sentence is a past progressive, meaning the speaker is observing the action in progression as it happened in the past.
The last one notes that people dressed up in certain costumes.
(as opposed to other costumes) |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
YTMND
Joined: 16 Jan 2012 Location: You're the man now dog!!
|
Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Quote: |
The last one notes that people dressed up in certain costumes. |
I'll expand on that. If you are reading it as a future event read my earlier reply.
If you are strictly reading it as a past event, then it sounds more like this speaker wasn't at this party and did not actually see it. They are talking about a much earlier time period.
"I went to the museum and saw that people dressed up and wore white wigs during George Washington's time." |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
Privateer
Joined: 31 Aug 2005 Location: Easy Street.
|
Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 7:33 am Post subject: Re: Grammar explanation required |
|
|
Poker wrote: |
Hi, please share your knowledge.
"I saw people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
That is in the text book. Now when do we use the following?
1. "I saw people being dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
2. "I saw that people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman."
Thank you |
1.I saw people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman
2. I saw people being dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman
Both 1 and 2 state what you saw at a past time, and both of them have reduced relative clauses modifying the object of the verb 'saw'. The difference is that '[were] dressed up' is past simple passive, implying a completed action; '[were] being dressed up' is past progressive passive, implying an action in progress.
So in 1 the people you saw already have costumes on, and in 2 someone is still putting the costumes on the people.
3. I saw that people dressed up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman
This suggests use of the word 'saw' in the sense of 'understood'. It parallels...
3b. I see that people dress up as popular movie characters, such as Shrek, Dracula, and Spiderman.
The latter does not imply people dressing up at any particular time and altering 'see' to the past tense, as in 3, changes only the time at which understanding occurred, with no implication of people dressing up at any particular time either.
In 3 and 3b 'dress up/dressed up' is not a reduced relative clause, but the main verb of an embedded clause. It changes to past tense form in the same way as happens in indirect reported speech (e.g. 'I am going to the store' becomes 'He said [that] he was going to the store'), without altering the underlying meaning of the embedded clause. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|