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100 applied positions, 0 interviews… advice please!
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parker82



Joined: 13 Sep 2011

PostPosted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:34 pm    Post subject: 100 applied positions, 0 interviews… advice please! Reply with quote

Times have changed.

I am a young-looking, physically fit, non-Gyopo, 30-year-old Asian American male. When I first applied to jobs in Korea in spring 2012, I had 3 interviews right away, a job offer the next day, and I was in Korea a few weeks following. However, these days I am finding it hard to even get a reply from a school or recruiter.

Almost every day for the last two weeks I’ve looked for jobs, sending several emails a day for different positions. I may get one reply a day (if any) but never an interview.

I will admit that I have limited my job locations to Gyeonggi-do and Incheon (I don’t even bother applying to Seoul jobs). However, I’m open to working in almost any city (as far as say Paju), any age group, any hours, and any pay. Almost all the jobs I apply for are entry-level jobs.

Still, I get no response.

To illustrate the difficulty I have been having, I will share three job application stories below. Feel free to skip them and jump to the bottom if you want to get to the point of this posting.

Quote:
Story #1 EPIK

In late 2011, I applied to EPIK and passed the interview despite having no teaching experience. I ended up going with a hagwon job instead. This time around, I applied to EPIK again but with job experience and the intention to complete a TESOL course before the semester began. I didn’t even get passed the application stage; I was given no interview at all.

Story #2 Recruiter Call

For a few positions that I actually think I have a good shot at, I actually call the recruiter long-distance to ask about it. Anyways, I called a recruiter about an ASAP Suwon elementary and middle school position. First, she told me she was having a very hard time filling the position. Second, the hagwon only wanted a woman because the position before was filled by a man who had drinking problems.

Rather than give me a shot at an interview (even though I had experience and a transferable D-10 visa and provided them with two letters of recommendation and two reference phone numbers from my last hagwon), the school would rather just hold out and keep on struggling to find a female teacher.

Story #3 ASAP Job

A recruiter called me long distance about a position. It was asap (fly to Korea next week), adult split shift hours, and a bit far from Seoul. I wasn’t really crazy about the conditions except that it started soon and was in Gyeonggi-do. I agreed to an interview instantly. I was excited. I studied the area it was in and prepared myself for the interview.

A few hours later, the recruiter contacted me back and apologized; they actually wanted a female teacher. I received no interview.

I have many more stories like these which I won’t share. Job hunting again in Korea has been quite disheartening at times, but I won’t give up!

Anyways, I was wondering if anyone on these forums had any advice. I could use as much help as I could get right now.

* Has anyone had the same difficulty that I have been having?

* Are there any other Asian males that can share their job hunting experiences with me? How about non-Asian males or females with similar qualifications (1-2 years of experience and just a BA) applying out of the country?

* A recruiter told me that usually in Dec-Jan there are less jobs. Should I expect better results towards February?

* Is it wise for me to save up money, fly to Korea, and look for jobs (I have a D-10 visa)?

I am in the process of taking new pictures and making a new introductory video with the hopes that it will even land me one interview.

If you have any suggestions or ideas at all, please share!
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Coltronator



Joined: 04 Dec 2013

PostPosted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You might have better luck with a big Chain like Avalon or CDI, while others rag on them for many things, racism and hiring practices that worry about skin colour isn't one of them.
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Hokie21



Joined: 01 Mar 2011

PostPosted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Coltronator wrote:
You might have better luck with a big Chain like Avalon or CDI, while others rag on them for many things, racism and hiring practices that worry about skin colour isn't one of them.


This. People can rag on Avalon all they want but I've had nothing but a good experience with them. Good co-workers, foreign and Korean, friendly management, pay always on time, never had to work weekends etc. etc.
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World Traveler



Joined: 29 May 2009

PostPosted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem is Avalon has many unregulated branch franchises. Plenty of people have been cheated lately. You were not one of them. Who's to say the OP will even be hired by Avalon, too. He could try to apply but I would put my money on him not getting the job. Avalon prefers people with no prior experience working in Korea. (Pretty sad, right?) (And maybe not every single Avalon branch in all of Korea thinks this way, but most do. I've heard it from many sources.)
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Coltronator



Joined: 04 Dec 2013

PostPosted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

True, plus with Avlon central management being decapitated (They eliminted their Training, R&D, Branch Quality Control, and HR Departments) all they are, are dozens of hagwons with the same name that pay the same groups of original investors licensing fees each month/year. So each Branch will vary greatly for better or worse. Though CDI is still fully corporate so their central HR should still have the same lack of racial hiring criteria as in the past.

This said the big places still offer the best chance(not guarantee) even if not guaranteed. In fact, I think the vast majority (say 90%+) of people I have met in Korea that are stereotypically considered racially "undesirable" by the places that do have racist hiring policies, worked for one of 3 places: CDI, Avalon, SLP, a Public School or began their careers at one of the 4 options and then branched out from there.
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jlee83



Joined: 20 Sep 2010
Location: Gangnam

PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 1:12 am    Post subject: Re: 100 applied positions, 0 interviews… advice please! Reply with quote

parker82 wrote:
Times have changed.

I am a young-looking, physically fit, non-Gyopo, 30-year-old Asian American male.



1) Being a gyopo is a definite minus in this job market, but it does beat being an Asian-American.

2) Being 30 years old and male. Those are two (pretty big) minuses. Sad but true.

ESL in Korea is a young person's game.
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parker82



Joined: 13 Sep 2011

PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 1:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the feedback guys!

I've heard both good and bad things about Avalon and CDI. I actually applied to CDI and got a response for a March position. If nothing comes up, I will try to apply for that March position (but an earlier position would be better because my D-10 will expire before then).

I will try applying to Avalon and SLP. I assume this is the website for SLP:
http://www.slp.co.kr/

jlee83 wrote:
1) Being a gyopo is a definite minus in this job market, but it does beat being an Asian-American.

2) Being 30 years old and male. Those are two (pretty big) minuses. Sad but true.

ESL in Korea is a young person's game.

I wish I had a gyopo's status. I would have Korean fluency and an F-visa which I've seen as requirements in many job postings.

Does anyone have any feedback to my questions:
Quote:
* Has anyone had the same difficulty that I have been having?

* Are there any other Asian males that can share their job hunting experiences with me? How about non-Asian males or females with similar qualifications (1-2 years of experience and just a BA) applying out of the country?

* A recruiter told me that usually in Dec-Jan there are less jobs. Should I expect better results towards February?

* Is it wise for me to save up money, fly to Korea, and look for jobs (I have a D-10 visa)?
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Coltronator



Joined: 04 Dec 2013

PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 1:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Young has its advantages, but once you are here the real opportunities are for those with a combination of connections, savvy, perseverance and luck.
Get your foot in the door any which way, get settled, observe, learn and apply what you have learned. 30 is by no means too old to start. It has its disadvantages but it is not insurmountable, just as his ethnicity will not completely kill his chances.
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TheMeerkatLover



Joined: 26 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 1:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll post some advice that should help.

* NEVER impose limitations on yourself. If I never had considered working in the countryside, I would have never had met my wife (and that is a VERY scary thought to me). Think about positions first. If you enter any interview with a series of limitations or conditions, I would personally thank you for your time and move on to the next person straight away. Same goes with people. If you give the impression you are waiting for something better, they'll just give you a pass.

** You are 30. You better have enough credentials to back yourself up. If you're trying to enter the field at 30 with no real work experience, then Korean society may look down upon you.

*** Being a Gyopo is both a blessing and a curse. In a way, you are viewed as being able to more integrate into the work culture due to the expectation you will submit to harsher working conditions than those who are not "White". I have met many Gyopo's working here, they have had little to no problems finding jobs, so I'm suspecting YOU are the one creating these limits.

**** Desperation is not an appealing trait. If you look desperate, it is more likely that people will try to avoid you.

***** There are always jobs. Again, it depends on what you are willing to accept. Keep in mind this job is a stepping stone to possibilities that can benefit you for a lifetime.

Videos and other nonsense are not needed. The videos are used to screen out those who are perceived as non-attractive or some other superficial reason. I have never had to provide a video, nor would any professional organization that understood what they were hiring.

Hope this helps, but from what I have seen for the past decade and those around me suggests your story does not match up with my observations. In this case, I would consider my first comment.
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DaeguNL



Joined: 08 Sep 2009

PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 2:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hokie21 wrote:
Coltronator wrote:
You might have better luck with a big Chain like Avalon or CDI, while others rag on them for many things, racism and hiring practices that worry about skin colour isn't one of them.


This. People can rag on Avalon all they want but I've had nothing but a good experience with them. Good co-workers, foreign and Korean, friendly management, pay always on time, never had to work weekends etc. etc.


Agreed that Avalon pays on time, however it is pretty rare to have a friendly management team there (I previously worked there and know people that have worked at several different branches) Also, its extremely rare that they wont try to force you to do some weekend work (teaching, greeting parents, level tests, passing out flyers etc)
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DaeguNL



Joined: 08 Sep 2009

PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 2:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

World Traveler wrote:
The problem is Avalon has many unregulated branch franchises. Plenty of people have been cheated lately. You were not one of them. Who's to say the OP will even be hired by Avalon, too. He could try to apply but I would put my money on him not getting the job. Avalon prefers people with no prior experience working in Korea. (Pretty sad, right?) (And maybe not every single Avalon branch in all of Korea thinks this way, but most do. I've heard it from many sources.)


Dead on. the only chance you have at an Avalon, with experience, is if you accept a newbie salary
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parker82



Joined: 13 Sep 2011

PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 3:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Coltronator wrote:
Young has its advantages, but once you are here the real opportunities are for those with a combination of connections, savvy, perseverance and luck.
Get your foot in the door any which way, get settled, observe, learn and apply what you have learned. 30 is by no means too old to start. It has its disadvantages but it is not insurmountable, just as his ethnicity will not completely kill his chances.

Your words have given me more encouragement. Thank you!

While I was still in Korea with a D-10 visa, it seemed like I had more opportunities. Does anyone think it's a wise idea for me to save up money and come to Korea looking for a job?

TheMeerkatLover wrote:
I'll post some advice that should help.

* NEVER impose limitations on yourself. If I never had considered working in the countryside, I would have never had met my wife (and that is a VERY scary thought to me). Think about positions first. If you enter any interview with a series of limitations or conditions, I would personally thank you for your time and move on to the next person straight away. Same goes with people. If you give the impression you are waiting for something better, they'll just give you a pass.

If this was my first job in Korea, I would be willing to work ANYWHERE. However, I lived in the Seoul-Gyeonggi-Incheon region for 1.5 years and made a lot of friends there. It has become my home.

I will keep those points in mind when I have an interview. The thing is, I haven't had any! My only condition is location, and I apply to jobs in those locations but never get an interview.

Quote:
** You are 30. You better have enough credentials to back yourself up. If you're trying to enter the field at 30 with no real work experience, then Korean society may look down upon you.

I have just 1.5 years of experience in Korea. I will work on getting TESOL certification. If I see this as a long-term career, I will get a masters.

Quote:
*** Being a Gyopo is both a blessing and a curse. In a way, you are viewed as being able to more integrate into the work culture due to the expectation you will submit to harsher working conditions than those who are not "White". I have met many Gyopo's working here, they have had little to no problems finding jobs, so I'm suspecting YOU are the one creating these limits.

I don't understand how this is related to me as I'm not a gyopo. Because gyopos have no problem finding a job, why should I have no problem? I actually think being a gyopo is advantageous because they have an F-visa and Korean fluency. I see gyopo positions posted all the time.

Quote:
**** Desperation is not an appealing trait. If you look desperate, it is more likely that people will try to avoid you.

***** There are always jobs. Again, it depends on what you are willing to accept. Keep in mind this job is a stepping stone to possibilities that can benefit you for a lifetime.

Good points.

Quote:
Videos and other nonsense are not needed. The videos are used to screen out those who are perceived as non-attractive or some other superficial reason. I have never had to provide a video, nor would any professional organization that understood what they were hiring.

I am not disagreeing with you. However, I am hoping a video will make at least one hagwon owner take notice. And if it doesn't, do I have anything to lose by making one?

Quote:
Hope this helps, but from what I have seen for the past decade and those around me suggests your story does not match up with my observations. In this case, I would consider my first comment.

It has definitely helped! I really appreciate your feedback. =)

What I have been experiencing now definitely does not match up with what I experienced when I first applied to jobs in spring 2012. Back then, I gave my picture and resume to two recruiters and instantly had three interviews. The day following, I had a job.

Now, I send out my picture and resume and can't even get one interview with anyone.
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parker82



Joined: 13 Sep 2011

PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 3:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaeguNL wrote:
World Traveler wrote:
The problem is Avalon has many unregulated branch franchises. Plenty of people have been cheated lately. You were not one of them. Who's to say the OP will even be hired by Avalon, too. He could try to apply but I would put my money on him not getting the job. Avalon prefers people with no prior experience working in Korea. (Pretty sad, right?) (And maybe not every single Avalon branch in all of Korea thinks this way, but most do. I've heard it from many sources.)


Dead on. the only chance you have at an Avalon, with experience, is if you accept a newbie salary


So they won't discriminate against me for being Asian, but they will discriminate against me for having experience?

Oh, it just gets better and better. lol. I am still going to apply and see what happens.
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Hokie21



Joined: 01 Mar 2011

PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaeguNL wrote:
Hokie21 wrote:
Coltronator wrote:
You might have better luck with a big Chain like Avalon or CDI, while others rag on them for many things, racism and hiring practices that worry about skin colour isn't one of them.


This. People can rag on Avalon all they want but I've had nothing but a good experience with them. Good co-workers, foreign and Korean, friendly management, pay always on time, never had to work weekends etc. etc.


Agreed that Avalon pays on time, however it is pretty rare to have a friendly management team there (I previously worked there and know people that have worked at several different branches) Also, its extremely rare that they wont try to force you to do some weekend work (teaching, greeting parents, level tests, passing out flyers etc)


Yeah it seems I may have gotten lucky. I guess I'm just trying to say people looking for work shouldn't totally pass on Avalon, there is a chance you could end up at a decent branch (I'm sure there isn't only 1.)
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Hokie21



Joined: 01 Mar 2011

PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2013 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaeguNL wrote:
Hokie21 wrote:
Coltronator wrote:
You might have better luck with a big Chain like Avalon or CDI, while others rag on them for many things, racism and hiring practices that worry about skin colour isn't one of them.


This. People can rag on Avalon all they want but I've had nothing but a good experience with them. Good co-workers, foreign and Korean, friendly management, pay always on time, never had to work weekends etc. etc.


Agreed that Avalon pays on time, however it is pretty rare to have a friendly management team there (I previously worked there and know people that have worked at several different branches) Also, its extremely rare that they wont try to force you to do some weekend work (teaching, greeting parents, level tests, passing out flyers etc)


Yeah it seems I may have gotten lucky. I guess I'm just trying to say people looking for work shouldn't totally pass on Avalon, there is a chance you could end up at a decent branch (I'm sure there isn't only 1.)
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