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Smithington
Joined: 14 Dec 2011
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 Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 7:38 pm Post subject: Criminal charges against English teacher in Itaewon. |
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Does anyone know about this incident? Any witnesses here on Daves? I don't know what the truth of the matter is. There are some nutjobs among the waygook community (as there are in any community worldwide), but we also know that there are a lot of lowlife ajoshies who, especially when drunk, think it's their right to harrass any Korean woman seen with Western men. The versions of the story in the Korean media and the dude's 'Go fund me" post are very different. What the truth is, who knows at this point. Either version is plausible.
What is annoying, however,is that although not convicted of anything yet, he has been fired from his job. How did his employer know about this? Did the police inform them? If so, that's just wrong. If it was from the press, that's also just wrong - especially since we all know how the Korean media spins any story about native teachers in any conflict with Koreans. But, of course, if the media says something bad about foreigners the Korean masses gobble it up without a moment's thought.
And why has the guy been charged. If the ajushie was drunk and being a douche in Itaewon maybe he had a second altercation and got his injuries then. Maybe he fell. Two weeks ago I saw an ajoshie at the bottom of the subway steps covered in his own blood. He had clearly been highly intoxicated and fallen down the steps. It happens. And if the Itaewon ajoshie was very drunk, and fallen, he might have (deliberately or otherwise) fused the two events in his mind. Blood money, hatred of foreigners, humiliation at losing a tussle with a younger foreign man, etc. Or the Westerner is a thug, perhaps with a history of violent behavior. Something in between?
Anyway, an interesting case. Anyone know the teacher in question or witness the incident?
http://www.gofundme.com/i416kw
http://news.chosun.com/site/data/html_dir/2014/12/04/2014120403917.html?r_ranking |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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| If you look at his account, in terms of physical assault the adjoshi only grabbed a girl's wrists (I'm assuming the swing he took missed) while the foreigner both 'pushed him away' and 'threw him to the ground.' That's 2 physical assaults to the adjoshi's none and that's his side of the story to boot. |
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yodanole
Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Location: La Florida
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 8:16 pm Post subject: |
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| The police have been known to contact employers in the case of foreign teachers. |
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Scorpion
Joined: 15 Apr 2012
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| yodanole wrote: |
| The police have been known to contact employers in the case of foreign teachers. |
Do they contact the employers of the Korean involved? If a Korean assaults a foreigner will he lose his job - even before any conviction is secured? After a conviction is secured? I sincerely doubt it. What's with this contacting the school nonsense?
The second poster said the foreigner pushed the Korean man away, and pushed him to the ground, and is at least guilty of that. And by his own admission. I don't think that's necessarily 'criminal' behavior. Surely we have the right to protect the woman we're with from assault, and possibly sexual assault. He did grab her wrist. If the teacher is to be believed the drunken Korean man had already assaulted another woman earlier that night. I don't know how I'd react if a drunk ajjoshie grabbed my girlfriend's wrist. Pushing him away, or pushing him to the ground, would be my absolute minimum response.
How would anyone here respond to a drunken ajjoshie grabbing their wife or girlfriend? How would the police officer laying the charges?
The Korean man (if the teacher is to be believed) took a swing at his girlfriend. Granted he missed, but is the teacher obligated to wait for the ajjoshie to straighten up and make a second attempt? Really?
Still, as the OP said, it's not certain what happened. Might just be another case of the media and police blowing a very minor incident involving a foreigner out of all proportion.
Last edited by Scorpion on Fri Dec 05, 2014 9:01 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Chaparrastique
Joined: 01 Jan 2014
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 9:00 pm Post subject: |
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Why is the woman involved his "ex-girlfriend"?
Sounds like either she decided it was all too much trouble to stay involved after he got arrested, or the two guys were basically fighting over her. |
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Scorpion
Joined: 15 Apr 2012
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Chaparrastique wrote: |
| Why is the woman involved his "ex-girlfriend"? |
Interesting. Might have been just a girl he picked up, but still. I saw a Western guy waiting for a taxi in Itaewon with a Korean girl he'd apparently just picked up (conversation made it evident they didn't know each other well) and an ajjoshie just walked up and grabbed her ass. (She must be a *beep* to be with a foreigner, right? So what's a little grab? The foreigner is going to be touching her ass, so surely he should be allowed a feel, too. After all, he's Korean.) The foreigner wanted to thump him hard, but she deterred him. "This is Korea, please understand." He was fuming but just let it go. I can understand his anger, and the girl obviously thought this was commonplace enough in Korea to just brush it off. Still, the ajjoshie definitely deserved a thumping.
Now, in the current story mentioned by the OP, imagine if the "girlfriend" in question was indeed his actual girlfriend at the time. You can imagine just how much more offensive the situation would have been. He grabbed her wrist, then swung at her? Fuggetaboutit. He's going down. |
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Mix1
Joined: 08 May 2007
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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Lying and exaggerating injuries to get blood money payment is basically standard here. Even the doctors will go along with it. The bar owner and any other Korean "witness" around will corroborate almost any story the Korean "victim" makes up.
The foreign guy is most likely getting hosed for blood money. His version of the story doesn't even matter at this point. |
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Smithington
Joined: 14 Dec 2011
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| If you look at his account, in terms of physical assault the adjoshi only grabbed a girl's wrists (I'm assuming the swing he took missed) while the foreigner both 'pushed him away' and 'threw him to the ground.' That's 2 physical assaults to the adjoshi's none and that's his side of the story to boot. |
WTF? That's the lamest defence of ajoshie bad behavior I've ever heard. He "only" grabbed her wrist. The "swing he took missed"?  |
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Smithington
Joined: 14 Dec 2011
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:23 pm Post subject: |
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Your second point is even more incomprehsible. After the ajoshie grabbed her wrist and threw a punch at her the teacher reacted by pushing him away / pushing him to the ground. Therefore...
| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| That's 2 physical assaults to the adjoshi's none. |
Again, WTF?
Last edited by Smithington on Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:24 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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edwardcatflap
Joined: 22 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| WTF? That's the lamest defence of ajoshie bad behavior I've ever heard. He "only" grabbed her wrist. The "swing he took missed"? |
Not defending anyone, just going by the guy's statement. A wrist grab of someone else and a missed punch versus a push and throw to the floor. The Korean guy has had more of a physical attack on his person |
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Smithington
Joined: 14 Dec 2011
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:34 pm Post subject: |
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How would you respond to a drunk man grabbing your girlfriend's wrist, then taking a swing at her? In what universe is pushing him away (or down) considered an unreasonable display of force.
The alternative, I guess, would be: "Excuse me good chap. I know you don't understand a word I'm saying, and you've currently got a grip on my lady friend's wrist, but would you be so kind as to refrain from your present course of action. I do, I must say, find it somewhat discomforting. I would, if I may be so bold as to speculate on her behalf, venture to say that my dear friend would concur with my sentiment. If you wouldn't mind, sir."
The story, at least as told by the teacher, falls well within my definition of 'reasonable force'. I find it incomprehensible that it doesn't fall within the perameters of yours....Unless you simply don't belief the teacher's version of the story. But you haven't said that. You state that, by his own admission, he was the aggressor. That's just crazy.
Last edited by Smithington on Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:39 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Mix1
Joined: 08 May 2007
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| Quote: |
| WTF? That's the lamest defence of ajoshie bad behavior I've ever heard. He "only" grabbed her wrist. The "swing he took missed"? |
Not defending anyone, just going by the guy's statement. A wrist grab of someone else and a missed punch versus a push and throw to the floor. The Korean guy has had more of a physical attack on his person |
Wrist grab is an assault, a punch is assault, even if it missed. The next one might have landed, potentially seriously injuring the girl.
Plus the verbal assault and berating, and then threatening that he was going to "F*ck your girlfriend."
A push was getting off lightly and could be viewed as self defense. Apparently the Korean guy started to grapple with the guy so he had to throw him off him.
But again, the foreigner version of the story won't be believed anyway. This guy is basically screwed.
Last edited by Mix1 on Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:42 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Fox
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:40 pm Post subject: |
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| The Korean article says that he supposedly punched the Korean man in the face several times and knocked him into a coma. Whether that is true or not I do not know, but it is a significant difference from a mere push. Korean law definitely does not allow you to beat someone into a coma for grabbing someone's wrist. Hopefully for him his account is the true one and can be proven in court. |
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young_clinton
Joined: 09 Sep 2009
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:44 pm Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
| If you look at his account, in terms of physical assault the adjoshi only grabbed a girl's wrists (I'm assuming the swing he took missed) while the foreigner both 'pushed him away' and 'threw him to the ground.' That's 2 physical assaults to the adjoshi's none and that's his side of the story to boot. |
A swing is an assault. If the ajoshie contacted it would be assault and battery. |
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Mix1
Joined: 08 May 2007
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Fox wrote: |
| The Korean article says that he supposedly punched the Korean man in the face several times and knocked him into a coma. Whether that is true or not I do not know, but it is a significant difference from a mere push. Korean law definitely does not allow you to beat someone into a coma for grabbing someone's wrist. Hopefully for him his account is the true one and can be proven in court. |
The punching story is the one that will be believed regardless; it fits the Korean victimhood / foreign invader / woman stealer narrative perfectly. Plus, the Korean witnesses will lie unless they have a reason not to. The only thing that might save this guy is CCTV, but only if there is lock-down evidence that completely proves he didn't do this.
(And if he did do it, I'll happily eat my words and admit I was wrong, but I've seen and heard of too much crap like this in this country. Btw; the foreigner's account does seem a little too squeaky clean at times: "I feared for my knees from previous injuries, so I HAD to throw him to save myself" uhhh, right. ) |
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