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Discrimination towards accents
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jazzmaster



Joined: 30 Sep 2013

PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2015 2:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sector7G wrote:
jazzmaster wrote:

This reeks of desperation. You know you've been bested, and now all you have are insults.
Lest you forget, you two were the first with the insults, first hap and then you. But you win, I now believe that people do struggle to understand you.


You've almost got it, but you're still a little off. It's Americans that struggle to understand British accents. Two posters here are telling you this, but you're still in denial because it conflicts with what you want to believe.

You'll have to forgive the posts earlier that you struggled to understand. I watch tv and use my phone to post here. The fact that Happy could make sense of it, where you claim to have been unable to or struggled to, perhaps highlights the point we're making. A lack of problem solving and critical thinking appears to be your constant undoing.

Quote:
You keep talking about my critical thinking, but I have refuted everything you have put up.


Laughing
Brilliant. If in doubt, lie.
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Adventurer



Joined: 28 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2015 6:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Discrimination towards accents Reply with quote

mangotango wrote:
Hello everyone! I posted this in the general discussion but thought I would post it here, too.

I am from the North of England and have been teaching in Korea for a while.

I am wondering if anyone has, or knows of anyone who has been discriminated against within an EFL environment because of their accent? And what the preference seems to be?


I knew a fellow from Ireland who had a very heavy accent (heavier than most Irish people I know), and he wouldn't adjust his speech to help his students. I think you need to try to make yourself understood. I knew one fellow from England who lost his hagwon job back in 2007 because they didn't want someone with an English accent, but they had hired him. It wasn't his fault. He had an average English accent. It wasn't very strong, in my opinion.
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drcrazy



Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Location: Pusan. Yes, that's right. Pusan NOT Busan. I ain't never been to no place called Busan

PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2015 11:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My biggest problem with any type of English accent when it is being spoken by a native speaker of English, is that they are foreigners whose first language is English. I do by best to avoid foreigners unless they are from some place where English is not their native language.
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Sector7G



Joined: 24 May 2008

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 3:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jazzmaster wrote:
You've almost got it, but you're still a little off. It's Americans that struggle to understand British accents. Two posters here are telling you this, but you're still in denial because it conflicts with what you want to believe.
I have not checked this thread since my last post, which I had planned to be my last, but this calls for a response. The above comments prove that it's you that's just not getting it. I am not in denial about anything, at least about your personal experiences(both of you) - which I have stated at least two times that I believe or at least do not deny. I only questioned the part where you take your personal experiences and make blanket statements about Americans in general - especially Hap, who right off the bat said Americans make a "big deal" out of accents. Now, how is that faulty logic on my part?? It is an opinion, and even if it was ultimately proven wrong through some empirical evidence, the logic behind my point, that you are making blanket statements from personal experiences, is sound. Why is that so hard to understand? Yet each time I say this you question my critical thinking??

jazzmaster wrote:

You'll have to forgive the posts earlier that you struggled to understand. I watch tv and use my phone to post here. The fact that Happy could make sense of it, where you claim to have been unable to or struggled to, perhaps highlights the point we're making. A lack of problem solving and critical thinking appears to be your constant undoing.
Don't act stupid -my comments about not understanding you were made in jest - even my response to Hap about skew whiff, which was a paraphrase of a famous Muhammed Ali quote when Howard Cosell called him truculent. The only thing I did not understand was how you were missing my point, which I have not changed.
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Sector7G



Joined: 24 May 2008

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 4:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jazzmaster wrote:
Quote:
You keep talking about my critical thinking, but I have refuted everything you have put up.


Brilliant. If in doubt, lie.
Actually, it would have been more accurate for me to say that you have not refuted anything I have said. Just calling something nonsense does not make it so.
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happyinhenan



Joined: 01 Feb 2015

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 4:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sector7G wrote:
I only questioned the part where you take your personal experiences and make blanket statements about Americans in general - especially Hap, who right off the bat said Americans make a "big deal" out of accents.


Arrrrrrrrgh - you thick fucker!!

Nowhere did I make a blanket statement against all Americans - I have always qualified it with 'some' and when I use the term 'in my experience' then that is stating to the observant parties that I have met a small percentage of Americans and not every single one.

Nowhere do I make a blanket statement about Americans and accents - now I know why you have to be taught critical thinking skills in college - the numerous logic fails in this forum from some of you is both ridiculous and embarrassing. Embarassed
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Sector7G



Joined: 24 May 2008

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

happyinhenan wrote:
Sector7G wrote:
I only questioned the part where you take your personal experiences and make blanket statements about Americans in general - especially Hap, who right off the bat said Americans make a "big deal" out of accents.

Arrrrrrrrgh - you thick fucker!!
Easy there Hap, don't get your knickers in a twist, or you will get this thread locked. Actually, maybe that is what you are trying to do, like an amateur chess player who accidentally knocks over the board when he finds himself in an unwinnable position.
happyinhenan wrote:

Nowhere did I make a blanket statement against all Americans - I have always qualified it with 'some'
As I pointed out before, your very first statement in this thread was this:
happyinhenan wrote:
Yes. I find Americans make a big deal out of it as well and never Canadians in my experience.
Nowhere do I see the word "some" in that sentence, and if that is not a blanket statement, I don't what is. If I had not asked you about it, you would would have left it like that. Even after that, you only partially back-pedaled.
happyinhenan wrote:

Who is saying they are more polite, all that is being said is that Canadians don't melt down when they meet someone who doesn't speak with a 'neutral accent'
Not only another blanket statement but you're implying that Americans do "melt down". How exactly do these "melt downs" and "big deals" manifest themselves??What actually happens? Exhibit A as an example of exaggeration.

happyinhenan wrote:

You need to be a bit more accepting of other peoples experiences regards how some of your countrymen act. Now it isn't just me, it isn't just Jazzmeister and I am sure more will chime in.
But I do accept your personal experiences, it's just hard to accept the conclusions that you have drawn about the world beyond your experiences, especially when you use terms like "big deal" and "melt downs" without substantiation.
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happyinhenan



Joined: 01 Feb 2015

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sector7G wrote:

Easy there Hap, don't get your knickers in a twist, or you will get this thread locked. Actually, maybe that is what you are trying to do, like an amateur chess player who accidentally knocks over the board when he finds himself in an unwinnable position.


Pfffth, funny that no-one else agrees with your position on things, your arguments have been beyond asinine.


Quote:
As I pointed out before, your very first statement in this thread was this:
happyinhenan wrote:
Yes. I find Americans make a big deal out of it as well and never Canadians in my experience.
Nowhere do I see the word "some" in that sentence, and if that is not a blanket statement I don't what is.


Yes. I find Americans make a big deal out of it as well and never Canadians in my experience.

That is a statement qualifier that says I have not met every American and should not be took as a blanket statement based on a very small minority of Americans and Canadians I have met. Now, I went on to say that some Americans have had no problems with the way I speak and I think it is outrageous for your to make the silly suggestion that I have changed a position because of some half baked argument you have thrown up.




Quote:
Not only another blanket statement but you're implying that Americans do "melt down".


This is your lack of critical of thinking skills in action, I have just said and meant that Canadians (in my experience) don't melt down when confronted by my dulcet tones. Some Americans do, which was qualified in my first statement.

Quote:
How exactly do these "melt downs" and "big deals" manifest themselves??What actually happens? Exhibit A as an example of exaggeration.


By acting like an arsehole.

happyinhenan wrote:

But I do accept your personal experiences, it's just hard to accept the conclusions that you have drawn about the world beyond your experiences, especially when you use terms like "big deal" and "melt downs" without substantiation.


Oh, you do accept that I am talking about my experiences and not a whole generalisation that I never made in the first place? Well, thanks for clearing that one up, genius! Very Happy
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Sector7G



Joined: 24 May 2008

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 5:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

happyinhenan wrote:

Pfffth, funny that no-one else agrees with your position on things, your arguments have been beyond asinine.
No one else has chimed in (in your words)on your behalf either(as you predicted), with the exception of jazzmaster.

happyinhenan wrote:
Now, I went on to say that some Americans have had no problems with the way I speak and I think it is outrageous for your to make the silly suggestion that I have changed a position because of some half baked argument you have thrown up. I notice though you have abandoned your silly version of what a 'neutral' accent is and the non-existence of the Midwest American accent - your lack of knowledge on this subject has been very embarrassing.
First of all, at that point I made no argument, I merely asked you to clarify what you meant by "Big Deal." Secondly, show me where I said anything at all about "neutral accents". Not only do you misrepresent things that I do say, you also attribute things to me that I never said, but yet you have the cheek to accuse me of lacking critical thinking skills.
happyinhenan wrote:
Nowhere did I make a blanket statement against all Americans - I have always qualified it with 'some' and when I use the term 'in my experience' then that is stating to the observant parties that I have met a small percentage of Americans and not every single one.
Words have meaning Hap. Do the words "Nowhere" and "some" mean something different in Britain? And I never heard that the phrase "in my experience" equates to "small percentage". You certainly do not express yourself very clearly in your native tongue.
happyinhenan wrote:

Oh, you do accept that I am talking about my experiences and not a whole generalisation that I never made in the first place?
Actually, that was the exact opposite of what I "accept", and any neutral reader would have seen that.

You are so weak in your arguments it is pathetic - the only thing you can say over and over is that I lack critical thinking, as if repeating it will make it true. You have not come up with anything new since the first page of this thread. But this thread is more about you forgetting what you said, and not reading what I said.

But if you are now changing your story and stating that you are not generalizing about Americans, then good, I guess we have nothing more to debate. But we both know generalizing is exactly what you were doing.
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Sector7G



Joined: 24 May 2008

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

happyinhenan wrote:
Quote:
How exactly do these "melt downs" and "big deals" manifest themselves??What actually happens? Exhibit A as an example of exaggeration.


By acting like an arsehole.
That still does not explain anything. Let's say, for the sake of argument, someone is genuinely "struggling" with your accent. What percentage of said "strugglers" act like arseholes, and in what way do they act like an "arsehole". Do they say inappropriate things, do they get belligerent, do they insult you? Help me out here, I really want to know. Cool
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happyinhenan



Joined: 01 Feb 2015

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sector7G wrote:

No one else has chimed in (in your words)on your behalf either(as you predicted), with the exception of jazzmaster.


Well, someone has chimed in then! 100% more than anyone has chimed in for you. Laughing


Quote:
First of all, at that point I made no argument, I merely asked you to clarify what you meant by "Big Deal." Secondly, show me where I said anything at all about "neutral accents". Not only do you misrepresent things that I do say, you also attribute things to me that I never said, but yet you have the cheek to accuse me of lacking critical thinking skills.


What on earth are you talking about? Honestly, you read into posts that aren't there, making these silly claims that I make blanket statements about all Americans, and now this - get a grip!



Quote:
Words have meaning Hap. Do the words "Nowhere" and "some" mean something different in Britain? And I never heard that the phrase "in my experience" equates to "small percentage". You certainly do not express yourself very clearly in your native tongue.


Is this a logic crash here?

It must be.

How does 'Americans in my experience' mean all Americans? How can that be? How can it be that I have met every American on the planet? It is hilarious that I have to explain simple logic to you and where your critical thinking levels are at. It is hilarious.



Quote:
Actually, that was the exact opposite of what I "accept", and any neutral reader would have seen that.

You are so weak in your arguments it is pathetic - the only thing you can say over and over is that I lack critical thinking, as if repeating it will make it true. You have not come up with anything new since the first page of this thread. But this thread is more about you forgetting what you said, and not reading what I said.


I think you are on something, what are you inhaling? You really have a lack of reading ability and critical thinking skills. It is embarrassing to be you.

Quote:
But if you are now changing your story and stating that you are not generalizing about Americans, then good, I guess we have nothing more to debate. But we both know generalizing is exactly what you were doing.


You are have a problem with being thick, lacking critical thinking skills and finally - cannot comprehend simple English and reading statements that are simply not there. Laughing
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Sector7G



Joined: 24 May 2008

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

happyinhenan wrote:

Well, someone has chimed in then! 100% more than anyone has chimed in for you. Laughing
I'm glad you said that - a perfect example of your exaggerations - 100% of one sounds like a lot, doesn't it?

Nothing else in the rest of what you said actually makes sense in response to what I said - that is because you have no argument - all you can do is say I lack critical thinking. Funny - that is all you have! Ha!!
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happyinhenan



Joined: 01 Feb 2015

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Sector7G wrote:

I'm glad you said that - a perfect example of your exaggerations - 100% of one sounds like a lot, doesn't it?


I don't know how you are taught maths over there but if I have an item and you have nothing - I have 100% more than you of that item - do I not?



Quote:
Nothing else in the rest of what you said actually makes sense in response to what I said - that is because you have no argument - all you can do is say I lack critical thinking. Funny - that is all you have! Ha!!


You lack reading comprehension and intellect - but yeah, critical thinking is sorely lacking in your academic arsenal as is your basic arithmetic. Laughing
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Sector7G



Joined: 24 May 2008

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

happyinhenan wrote:
Quote:
Sector7G wrote:

I'm glad you said that - a perfect example of your exaggerations - 100% of one sounds like a lot, doesn't it?


I don't know how you are taught maths over there but if I have an item and you have nothing - I have 100% more than you of that item - do I not?



Quote:
Nothing else in the rest of what you said actually makes sense in response to what I said - that is because you have no argument - all you can do is say I lack critical thinking. Funny - that is all you have! Ha!!


You lack reading comprehension and intellect - but yeah, critical thinking is sorely lacking in your academic arsenal as is your basic arithmetic. Laughing
See, you have nothing new...same thing you have been saying, and you will probably say it again now..you don't respond to the argument...you are weak...very very weak.
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happyinhenan



Joined: 01 Feb 2015

PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sector7G wrote:
See, you have nothing new...same thing you have been saying, and you will probably say it again now..you don't respond to the argument...you are weak...very very weak.


Come on Einstein - if I have something - a chocolate bar for example, and you don't have a chocolate bar or any chocolate at all, do I have 100% more chocolate on my person than you?
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