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Coding bootcamps... a path to a lucrative career after Korea
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ghostrider



Joined: 27 Jun 2011

PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2016 5:32 pm    Post subject: Coding bootcamps... a path to a lucrative career after Korea Reply with quote

"12 weeks of immersive coding... at the end 99% of Flatiron graduates get jobs as developers, making on average $74,000 a year to start."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVMTPW8cm5g

Wow, that would be about triple my salary in Korea. There is a coding bootcamp in my hometown which advertises a 95% job placement rate after a three month course in either web development or app development.
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ttompatz



Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea

PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 12:18 am    Post subject: Re: Coding bootcamps... a path to a lucrative career after K Reply with quote

ghostrider wrote:
"12 weeks of immersive coding... at the end 99% of Flatiron graduates get jobs as developers, making on average $74,000 a year to start."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVMTPW8cm5g

Wow, that would be about triple my salary in Korea. There is a coding bootcamp in my hometown which advertises a 95% job placement rate after a three month course in either web development or app development.


Been there, done that, got the T-shirt.

What they don't tell you is that 99% of the job opportunities are nothing more than cubicle drudgery on the graveyard shift and that 95% of coders don't last a year.

For the 5% who do make it past year 1, they usually do very well for themselves and usually escape the cubicle for the corner office.

They usually don't come through "bootcamps" but were writing code or scripts before they left high school.

Oracle and SAP (ERP) consultants do well and don't have the burnout factor.

.
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edwardcatflap



Joined: 22 Mar 2009

PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2016 12:48 am    Post subject: Re: Coding bootcamps... a path to a lucrative career after K Reply with quote

ttompatz wrote:
ghostrider wrote:
"12 weeks of immersive coding... at the end 99% of Flatiron graduates get jobs as developers, making on average $74,000 a year to start."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVMTPW8cm5g

Wow, that would be about triple my salary in Korea. There is a coding bootcamp in my hometown which advertises a 95% job placement rate after a three month course in either web development or app development.


Been there, done that, got the T-shirt.

What they don't tell you is that 99% of the job opportunities are nothing more than cubicle drudgery on the graveyard shift and that 95% of coders don't last a year.

For the 5% who do make it past year 1, they usually do very well for themselves and usually escape the cubicle for the corner office.

They usually don't come through "bootcamps" but were writing code or scripts before they left high school.

Oracle and SAP (ERP) consultants do well and don't have the burnout factor.

.


There was another video saying you have to have a passion for it. Ie it's so dull you'll go out of your mind unless you actually enjoy doing it. Gritting your teeth and thinking of the money doesn't cut it.
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northway



Joined: 05 Jul 2010

PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2016 5:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My friends who are in tech hiring positions have collectively learned to put the bootcamp resumes at the bottom of the pile. What bootcamps tell you is that they will help you put together a git portfolio that employers can look at to view your work. What they don't tell you is that they're essentially gaming the system with this portfolio, putting the cart before the horse and failing to teach you the necessary skills to support that portfolio. The people doing the hiring generally have CS degrees, and they see right through this.

While there are no silver bullets, EFL folks looking for career development to shift away from teaching would probably be better off learning R and Python on a platform like Datacamp or Sliderule, which are both relatively easy, very marketable, and require familiarity more than deep knowledge in order to be used efficiently.
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Died By Bear



Joined: 13 Jul 2010
Location: On the big lake they call Gitche Gumee

PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2016 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you're smart enough to buy a series of books on say, SQL, and sit down & teach yourself the language - and be strong enough to get through an interview whereupon the panel will ask you how to solve multiple problems on a whiteboard, then you will be able to land a job making decent money & gain experience. Don't know much about bootcamps, but I do know that if you want to succeed in that business, you need to actually know what you're doing.
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northway



Joined: 05 Jul 2010

PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 4:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Died By Bear wrote:
If you're smart enough to buy a series of books on say, SQL, and sit down & teach yourself the language - and be strong enough to get through an interview whereupon the panel will ask you how to solve multiple problems on a whiteboard, then you will be able to land a job making decent money & gain experience. Don't know much about bootcamps, but I do know that if you want to succeed in that business, you need to actually know what you're doing.


And SQL would be a good way to go considering its applications in the business world.
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Weigookin74



Joined: 26 Oct 2009

PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2016 7:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What should you do for real training in this field? Is there a one or two year college course that will let you get into this field if you wanted to?
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jvalmer



Joined: 06 Jun 2003

PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2016 7:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Weigookin74 wrote:
What should you do for real training in this field? Is there a one or two year college course that will let you get into this field if you wanted to?

4-year degree in Comp Sci, Electrical Eng, Computer Eng, Software Eng, Math, or some related field. It's hard hard work. You will be in the lab like 8 hours after your lectures trying to finish a lab, or project. Or hitting the books on how computer memory works when you write these programs. Unless you're one of those few progidies that has been programming since the age 8, you'll get more than a few extra grey hairs. As mentioned before, really, really high burnout rates.
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Zyzyfer



Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?

PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2016 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jvalmer wrote:
Weigookin74 wrote:
What should you do for real training in this field? Is there a one or two year college course that will let you get into this field if you wanted to?

4-year degree in Comp Sci, Electrical Eng, Computer Eng, Software Eng, Math, or some related field. It's hard hard work. You will be in the lab like 8 hours after your lectures trying to finish a lab, or project. Or hitting the books on how computer memory works when you write these programs. Unless you're one of those few progidies that has been programming since the age 8, you'll get more than a few extra grey hairs. As mentioned before, really, really high burnout rates.


I took a comp science class in high school and yeah, there was a lot of work going into it outside of class hours. I could imagine how bad a proper degree would be.
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ttompatz



Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea

PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zyzyfer wrote:
jvalmer wrote:
Weigookin74 wrote:
What should you do for real training in this field? Is there a one or two year college course that will let you get into this field if you wanted to?

4-year degree in Comp Sci, Electrical Eng, Computer Eng, Software Eng, Math, or some related field. It's hard hard work. You will be in the lab like 8 hours after your lectures trying to finish a lab, or project. Or hitting the books on how computer memory works when you write these programs. Unless you're one of those few progidies that has been programming since the age 8, you'll get more than a few extra grey hairs. As mentioned before, really, really high burnout rates.


I took a comp science class in high school and yeah, there was a lot of work going into it outside of class hours. I could imagine how bad a proper degree would be.


My first bachelor degree was comp sci and for every 3 hours of coursework we'd average 6-9 hours in the computer lab.
Thank Ghod for easy classes like integral calculus, linear algebra and stats. The ratio for those was closer to 1:1

.
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silkhighway



Joined: 24 Oct 2010
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 7:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As someone who has worked in the tech sector and know many people from varied backgrounds who do, there are many rewarding careers in it. There is no "one" job, or one monolithic corporate culture. There are big differences between different companies, projects, and locations.

A lot of the comments here focused on software development, but there is also a wide range of jobs. Operations, software testing, technical writing, and project management in various forms are examples of jobs that people work in IT without highly analytic backgrounds.
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silkhighway



Joined: 24 Oct 2010
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 7:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Weigookin74 wrote:
What should you do for real training in this field? Is there a one or two year college course that will let you get into this field if you wanted to?


I think at a minimum, a 1-2 year "good" college program. I can't really help you determine what is a good program, but at a minimum, it should be comprehensive (a little bit of databases, networks, operating systems, programming languages, etc.). It should also be rigorous. You should also be realistic for what type of jobs and careers it's preparing you for. It won't be equivalent to a computer science or engineering degree. You may also need to do further training and specialization to make it into a meaningful career, but you can probably get an employer to pay for that.

Beware of any program that sounds too good to be true, because it probably is. Also beware of programs loading up on buzzwords and the latest and greatest technology of the day. Headhunters sometimes fall for that, but someone giving you a technical interview will see right through it. To give an analogy, knowing how to use a couple tools doesn't make you a carpenter. The converse of that is that a good carpenter should be able to learn how to use new tools quickly.
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ghostrider



Joined: 27 Jun 2011

PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2016 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Weigookin74 wrote:
What should you do for real training in this field? Is there a one or two year college course that will let you get into this field if you wanted to?

You might want to start with a MOOC like this (free unless you want college credit or a certificate):
https://www.edx.org/course/introduction-computer-science-mitx-6-00-1x-7
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PRagic



Joined: 24 Feb 2006

PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2016 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If I were younger and starting out again, I'd be seriously thinking about getting into 3D printing, either the industry itself, a peripheral (scanning), or education related to it. Governments everywhere are chucking money at 3D printing education, including right here in Korea.

You need to create a market, or be poised to take advantage of a very new one, to really hit the money ball out of the park.
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TorontoToronto



Joined: 20 Jun 2016

PostPosted: Mon Jul 04, 2016 5:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My company definitely will look at and hire self-taught coders for iOS.
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