Korean Job Discussion Forums

[own_king]

A friend asked me about ECC a few months ago. This is what I wrote. I hope it's of use. I really enjoyed my time at ECC, but I know some who hated it. Good luck.

If you want a school with less hours (and less money) that's ECC which is an acronym for English Center for Children. This is a subsidiary of the YBM Corporation which is the biggest educational publishing firm in Korea (or maybe even Asia). The kids here are not as good as a school like Poly which is a returnee school. Their English level is much lower. But when I was at ECC, the kids were pleasant enough. The money is lower at about CDN $2200 a month. But when I taught there I only had to work from 3:00 PM to 7:30 PM (pretty easy day). I know ECC sometimes had Saturday classes, but I think that's all changed with the new 5 day work week legislation enacted on January 1 of this year. Many Koreans still work Saturdays, but not big corporations like YBM anymore (I think). The school will pay your air ticket and may or may not pay your apartment, but they will find you one at a subsidized price. So you won't be left on your own, but you'll probably be living with another teacher which can be good or not depending on how compatible you are.

[just because]

As you will hear, some are good and some are bad.

Depends on the hagwon but on the whole I hear more good than bad, but there is a lot of marking,etc to do.

[Sleepy in Seoul]

I had a good time at the ECC where I worked for 14 months. The supervisors were both very good, and most of the Korean teachers were great and are still friends.

The downside was that I worked every Saturday (one month I worked from 3pm to 7.30pm every Saturday ). But then so did everyone else, so I can't really complain.

I did have to flat with other foreign teachers, and that was an education

But as with any hakwon, individual experiences vary greatly. The ����� of my ECC was good to the foreign teachers, but not quite so friendly to some of the Korean teachers. Research!!! It's very important. I was very, very lucky in that I fell into a great job, but I also had very low expectations regarding how well I would be treated. That helped.

[Michelle]

I had bad experiences at two ECC schools. One of them refused to give me back my passport and transferred me to another school. The next school fired me without pay after a month. A lot depends on the Wangjangnim, though. I was unlucky with both of them being weird.

I know it could be bad or good depending on who is running it. The first school reduced my crap threshhold for the other school. The first school didn't give me much choice in transferring to Daegu, which made me resentful.

[Dalton]

ECC has been famous for years for offering the worst contracts, the most hours worked and the lowest pay. These debates have been done to death ove the years. Some people claim to be happy and maybe they are but the fact remains that YBM/ECC pays a hefty 500,000 won to any teacher who can recruit another teacher. Hence the good posts are inherently untrustworthy.

Apparently it was good once about 5 or 6 years ago buthen the daughter took over and screwed it all up. There are hundreds of posts about being screwed for money, overtime severence, earned pay, being charged excessive rent (other schools affer free accomodation), excessive deposits that are never returned, working Saturdays, being forced to work an extra day or hours during a week with statutory holidays(hence no holiday benefit for employees). the list goes on and on ad naseum.

Crass (and one successful) attempts at identifying and attacking posters who diss them on this board. Tiger Lilly where are you? Famous poster savaged by YBM/ECC. Just because she fought for over 2,000,000 in wages she was owed (pre ESL Law and similar help). YBM/ECC employees shamelessly accused her of anything and everything under the sun on this board whenever she posted about anything.

One of their top recruiters from Calgary Canada was blacklisted after he was tricked into putting their contract on this board after many posts defending them. He was clearly not speaking plainly. Quite embarrassing really.

Am I wrong? Put the YBM/ECC contract up here and prove it. Simple. Make a liar out of me.

[Homer]

Dalton,

I worked at ECC for my first two jobs here and overall it was a good experience.
Paid on time, all benefits due to me were given, decent curriculum and an understanding director.

The hours were long but I knew that going in. They pay was a little lower then other schools but there was no hassle about accomodations, health insurance, pay, bonuses and vacations.

This was over 5 years ago hence I have no monetery benefit in saying this at all since I do not work for them anymore.

Not making a liar out of you here, just saying that there are some good ECC schools out there.

As for the complaint you talked about I could turn it around by citing what happened at another ECC where a friend of mine worked for 3 years.
That ECC offered similar good conditions and they fired an teacher who came in drunk on many occasions and missed work often. They warned him but to no avail.
What did that teacher do? He bad mouthed the school left, right and center and made himself come off as a victim when really he was just a bum.

The director of that ECC could not do much to refute the allegations he had made because most people on the boards (where he ranted) had exactly your reaction to the director defending himself: he must lying.
Yet, this drunk of a teacher went on to get fired by 4 more schools and still his complaints got some mileage.

Complaints about schools are often valid, however they are also to be taken with a grain of salt as there are always two sides to any situation.[/i]

[Homer]

Dalton,

I worked at ECC for my first two jobs here and overall it was a good experience.
Paid on time, all benefits due to me were given, decent curriculum and an understanding director.

The hours were long but I knew that going in. They pay was a little lower then other schools but there was no hassle about accomodations, health insurance, pay, bonuses and vacations.

This was over 5 years ago hence I have no monetery benefit in saying this at all since I do not work for them anymore.

Not making a liar out of you here, just saying that there are some good ECC schools out there.

As for the complaint you talked about I could turn it around by citing what happened at another ECC where a friend of mine worked for 3 years.
That ECC offered similar good conditions and they fired an teacher who came in drunk on many occasions and missed work often. They warned him but to no avail.
What did that teacher do? He bad mouthed the school left, right and center and made himself come off as a victim when really he was just a bum.

The director of that ECC could not do much to refute the allegations he had made because most people on the boards (where he ranted) had exactly your reaction to the director defending himself: he must lying.
Yet, this drunk of a teacher went on to get fired by 4 more schools and still his complaints got some mileage.

Complaints about schools are often valid, however they are also to be taken with a grain of salt as there are always two sides to any situation.[/i]

[Homer]

Oups,
Double post...

[Lizara]

I've been working at an ECC for about three months now. It seems to be pretty good... definitely better than a lot of the stories I've heard about other schools... but yes, the hours are long. I do get free accommodation and I haven't yet had any problems with the contract *shrugs* so, I'm sure there are some bad ECCs out there, but I have to say mine has mostly been a positive experience so far.

[Dalton]

So which one of you are going to scan and post your contract?
Is that a tough request?
People do it all the time.

Sorry to be tough but ECC/YBM people do get paid to recruit. That's been common knowledge on this board for over 5 years .

[Lizara]

It wasn't knowledge to me until you mentioned it. and if you want, I'll try to post my contract, but I don't have easy access to a scanner at this point and if I do have any scanned copies, they're on my computer in Canada. I'll see what I can do, though...

[Dalton]

Once again I'll apologize for my harsh attitude beforehand but I don't know who you are and you may be the recruiter or manager. One things for sure, you are posting awfully late and eager for a teacher in S. Korea on a Friday night. Is this typical YBM/ESL culture?

As for your post:
That's all very nice but it's not a contract posted here. It's more like a typical YBM/ECC nice guy double speak sucker ruse. Well gee, give me a sec, I know it was here a second ago .... Hey pal how bout a coffee while we're waiting.

Remember this topic has been done every YBM/ECC recruiting drive
for all the years since the daughter took over.

To be perfectly clear Talk is cheap. Hear from Tiger Lilly lately?

Since your so pert at this hour and so eager to dispell the "YBM/ECC Myth" isn't that what you guys call it, tell me how much would a YBM/ECC teacher make if I signed today and because she/he recruited me?
How much is rent? How many hours do they have to work a month?
How many hours do they work on Saturdays?

Surely a YBM/ECC teacher or manager or recruiter can remember his own schedule.

[Homer]

Dalton,

If you paid attention you would have seen that I worked (past tense) for ECC back in 1997-1999.

I have no incentive to praise of blast them. Just relating my experiences.

also you claim to have no proof but what do you offer besides vague references to a previous post on the old board about some teacher who complained and got treated badly for it?

What makes your word more valid then mine or then that of the teacher who related her experiences at ECC in this thread?

[TECO]

I worked at ECC in Siam Square in Bankok and it was one of the nicest schools that I've taught in - modern and the teachers were really well trained and experienced.

One of my M.A. TESOL Lecturers taught for ECC Osaka and really liked it, saying it was really proessionally run and a good place to work.

However, ECC Korea and ECC Thailand have, on the whole, been given bad reviews from those I've spoken to.

It also depends on if it's a 'franchise' school or not. Franchise schools, like with Berliz, can be a risk.

[Dalton]

Well 1997-98 is certainly over five years ago.
It's almost 7 years ago. Don't you think your experience at one school in a chain 6 years ago is perhaps a little less than wht the OP is seeking?
I think the OP is looking for relevant today advice not reminicences about one's first job in Korea.

Anyway I don't care, I just want to see a contract for this year. I've personally heard and read here many bad experiences from YBM/ECC. The general consensus on this board over the years has been to avoid YBM/ECC for the reasons I've stated and many others. Prove me wrong. Post their contract for this year.

They must be down to about 1.6 a year for 136 hrs a month by now, before deductions. Post a contract prove me wrong. It's really simple and a lot easier than typing.

I've heard for years that YBM/ECC outside Korea is fine. It's the Korean branch that sucks.