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Korean Job Discussion Forums "The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
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canadian_in_korea
Joined: 20 Jun 2004 Location: South Korea
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 1:11 pm Post subject: |
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My husband and I watched the show...he translated the Korean part of it for me. After it was over he said that the show also pointed out the fact that Korean people place too much emphasis on English education...hmmm...perhaps someone is suggesting they should admit they may possibly be part of the problem..? I did notice "Canadian" mentioned quite often...but hey...not all Canadian's are "nice, good kind and polite" people. After the show was over I did say to my husband..."How many Korean men, who watched the show, will tell their wives they aren't allowed to have a private tutor?" After that guy said he only had sex with one woman two times because she felt guilty because she was married. Well, one thing that occurs to me is that anyone who had a degree is able to come here and teach.....what about all those pedophiles who get squeezed out of communities in their own country...? perhaps Korean immigration should also require a criminal record check.....but then....can you get a passport if you have a criminal record? Maybe someone here knows.....is anything like that checked before a teacher is hired? I certainly hope so. |
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peppermint
Joined: 13 May 2003 Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 2:38 pm Post subject: |
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In answer to the last poster- for public school gigs, they usually require a full medical, and letter of conduct from the authorities in your home country, though that's usually made out to be a formality. Come to think of it, the recruiter who got me my first job asked for a letter of conduct too, but she was a lot more thorough than most I think.
I hope some good does come from this mess, and that the ESL industry does get cleaned up a bit. I wonder though- will the Koreans realize they need to work on things from their side too? |
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inkoreaforgood
Joined: 15 Dec 2003 Location: Inchon
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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peppermint wrote: |
I hope some good does come from this mess, and that the ESL industry does get cleaned up a bit. I wonder though- will the Koreans realize they need to work on things from their side too? |
I certainly hope so. I fear that most Koreans will have their blinders on, and only see the bad foreign teachers/nice young women being taken advantage of. Alot of this problem wouldn't exist if the people in this country would do things like background checks and call the teacher's uni to check up on degree validity. Recruiters, schools, and immigration, that is the list of who should be sharing responsibility over this problem. Especially employers, who usually turn out to be the worst of all groups involved, in their zeal to save money and put the best possible face on their school.
I doubt much will change though. Just going to be a rough year. |
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Tiberious aka Sparkles
Joined: 23 Jan 2003 Location: I'm one cool cat!
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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ChooChooPongPong wrote: |
yank your kids out of wonderland before that crazy sex-crazed waygookin humps a chair! |
This made me laugh out loud.
Quote: |
If this sh#t keeps hitting the fan like it has been, we all might have to form a friendly protest somehow... |
That's actually a really good idea. Too bad the general response by most expats to the suggestion is probably "meh."
Sparkles*_* |
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eamo
Joined: 08 Mar 2003 Location: Shepherd's Bush, 1964.
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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Tiberious aka Sparkles wrote: |
ChooChooPongPong wrote: |
yank your kids out of wonderland before that crazy sex-crazed waygookin humps a chair! |
This made me laugh out loud.
Quote: |
If this sh#t keeps hitting the fan like it has been, we all might have to form a friendly protest somehow... |
That's actually a really good idea. Too bad the general response by most expats to the suggestion is probably "meh."
Sparkles*_* |
Yeah. But that response is because a lot of us know how Koreans are and how foreigners in Korea are.
Koreans will forget about this by the time they are eating Mom's duk-guk at Seollal. Those who actually paid attention to the news story that is. This is a minor thing to them. It will barely register on their consciousness.
As for foreigners....get over yourselves! You're not that big a deal. Koreans will keep on keeping on. If every foreign teacher left Korea in protest at this slander on our good name then schools and academies would just revert to Korean teachers only. Maybe the English pronunciation level of Koreans would drop by a couple of nano-points. So what. |
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Badmojo
Joined: 07 Mar 2004 Location: I'm just sitting here watching the wheels go round and round
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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Protests?
Come on.
If you're so offended, the only way you can protest this is by leaving the country.
At the end of the day, Korea is for Koreans. They're going to do whatever they want here. Slag teachers, have anti-US demonstrations, piss on foreigners, treat them well, whatever, who knows? They're gonna live on in the Korean way.
As for me, I'm not offended. I don't care.
I like it too much here! |
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Tiberious aka Sparkles
Joined: 23 Jan 2003 Location: I'm one cool cat!
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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Badmojo wrote: |
Protests?
Come on.
If you're so offended, the only way you can protest this is by leaving the country.
At the end of the day, Korea is for Koreans. They're going to do whatever they want here. Slag teachers, have anti-US demonstrations, piss on foreigners, treat them well, whatever, who knows? They're gonna live on in the Korean way.
As for me, I'm not offended. I don't care.
I like it too much here! |
Let's say a Jamaican in Toronto raped a white woman. And, after that, the media wouldn't stop portraying Jamaicans as murderers, rapists and drug dealers. Would you disagree with the Jamaican community if they protested the media's portrayal of them? Fact is, the Korean media has been painting foreign English teachers in a bad light. A LOT, recently. Of course, there are some less-than-desireable teachers here, but most are decent, good-natured people.
And if you think this will be forgotten in a few days, or that this isn't a big deal to your average Korean, you're sorely underestimating the media's ability to manipulate the masses.
Sparkles*_* |
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Badmojo
Joined: 07 Mar 2004 Location: I'm just sitting here watching the wheels go round and round
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 8:12 pm Post subject: |
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Tiberious aka Sparkles wrote: |
Badmojo wrote: |
Protests?
Come on.
If you're so offended, the only way you can protest this is by leaving the country.
At the end of the day, Korea is for Koreans. They're going to do whatever they want here. Slag teachers, have anti-US demonstrations, piss on foreigners, treat them well, whatever, who knows? They're gonna live on in the Korean way.
As for me, I'm not offended. I don't care.
I like it too much here! |
Let's say a Jamaican in Toronto raped a white woman. And, after that, the media wouldn't stop portraying Jamaicans as murderers, rapists and drug dealers. Would you disagree with the Jamaican community if they protested the media's portrayal of them? Fact is, the Korean media has been painting foreign English teachers in a bad light. A LOT, recently. Of course, there are some less-than-desireable teachers here, but most are decent, good-natured people.
And if you think this will be forgotten in a few days, or that this isn't a big deal to your average Korean, you're sorely underestimating the media's ability to manipulate the masses.
Sparkles*_* |
Okay.
And if you don't like what this place is going to become, then leave.
You can't stand being portrayed in a bad light? Leave.
Korea is not Toronto. We are not Jamaicans in Canada. Believe me, if those generalizations happened in Canada, there would be a severe backlash in the media. The media would rise against itself. It would defend the Jamaicans. Heads would roll.
Our voice doesn't matter here, bud. Neither do our opinions.
Get over yourself or go home. |
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Derrek
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 8:44 pm Post subject: |
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Well, I know one thing is for sure... the thousands of English teachers return home, and each one of them is an ambassador with a story to tell. When they get home, they tell stories. I know I do. It can't be helping Korea on the world business front. Also, can I say: wow, can one have a post on here that's NOT deleted? |
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Rather_Dashing
Joined: 07 Sep 2004
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 8:47 pm Post subject: |
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Derrek wrote: |
Well, I know one thing is for sure... the thousands of English teachers return home, and each one of them is an ambassador with a story to tell. When they get home, they tell stories. I know I do. It can't be helping Korea on the world business front. Also, can I say: wow, can one have a post on here that's NOT deleted? |
Yeah Derrek, I am the KING of deleted posts. I am still curious about the results of the pr0n thread |
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Tiberious aka Sparkles
Joined: 23 Jan 2003 Location: I'm one cool cat!
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 9:20 pm Post subject: |
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Badmojo wrote: |
Tiberious aka Sparkles wrote: |
Badmojo wrote: |
Protests?
Come on.
If you're so offended, the only way you can protest this is by leaving the country.
At the end of the day, Korea is for Koreans. They're going to do whatever they want here. Slag teachers, have anti-US demonstrations, piss on foreigners, treat them well, whatever, who knows? They're gonna live on in the Korean way.
As for me, I'm not offended. I don't care.
I like it too much here! |
Let's say a Jamaican in Toronto raped a white woman. And, after that, the media wouldn't stop portraying Jamaicans as murderers, rapists and drug dealers. Would you disagree with the Jamaican community if they protested the media's portrayal of them? Fact is, the Korean media has been painting foreign English teachers in a bad light. A LOT, recently. Of course, there are some less-than-desireable teachers here, but most are decent, good-natured people.
And if you think this will be forgotten in a few days, or that this isn't a big deal to your average Korean, you're sorely underestimating the media's ability to manipulate the masses.
Sparkles*_* |
Okay.
And if you don't like what this place is going to become, then leave.
You can't stand being portrayed in a bad light? Leave.
Korea is not Toronto. We are not Jamaicans in Canada. Believe me, if those generalizations happened in Canada, there would be a severe backlash in the media. The media would rise against itself. It would defend the Jamaicans. Heads would roll.
Our voice doesn't matter here, bud. Neither do our opinions.
Get over yourself or go home. |
Perhaps I should explain myself a bit to you. I've been here going on five years. I have a wife (Korean, if it matters) and a daughter. I earn a very nice wage for what I do, and therefore intend to remain in Korea. I don't know about yourself, but I'm not masochistic enough to wish that many Koreans' perception of your typical white foreigner remains the same.
The old "if you don't like it then leave" retort is infantile and ignorant. I suppose I should pack my bags now because I (god forbid!) happen to criticize a blatantly sensational and misinformed news expose.
Again, some of us have families here. We're not all drunken frat boys who couldn't give two turds how our community perceives us.
Sparkles*_* |
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Blind Willie
Joined: 05 May 2004
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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You know Tibs, I agree on the part about not everyone here is a drunken frat boy, and listening to them is like taking advice from them is like listening to the homeless guy telling you about aliens stealing our thoughts.
But I think we need to realize that the change cant be forced from the outside... unless we're talking Japanese invasion level forced change... Korean folks have to do the change themselves.
And change they will, because Koreans are marrying more and more foreigners. Thai, Vietnamese, American, Japanese. There will be a multi-ethinic generation arising here in Korea soon, and they will be the ones to change attitudes.
But Badmojo is right in one regard, we simply dont matter here. Raising a stink will do nothing but justify things for the bigots.
Your kids are a different story. Fill them up with what is good, and they will be the ones to change things, you just need to trust them |
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The Lemon
Joined: 11 Jan 2003
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 10:50 pm Post subject: |
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Blind Willie wrote: |
Raising a stink will do nothing but justify things for the bigots. |
Yup. My semi-informed opinion is that Koreans watching a foreigner-raised "stink" on the MBC News would see it through the narrow prism of "these angry foreigners hate Korea, I wish they'd go away".
These anti-waeguk campaigns are cyclical. Foreigners themselves have very little influence on the cycle, though I suppose they could make the downward part of the cycle worse through stupid public relations actions.
Tibs wrote: |
And if you think this will be forgotten in a few days, or that this isn't a big deal to your average Korean, you're sorely underestimating the media's ability to manipulate the masses. |
The thing about this cycle is that it provides regular reenforcement that [westerners in korea=bad]. ES-Gate goes on top of the two girls incident, which went on top of Ohno and IMF and Meg Ryan and Kwangju 1980 and on and on back through the decades to Western soldiers raping women in the fields during the war, and beyond.
And Koreans do have bizarrely long - though faulty - memories of perceived injustices. It's not this event. It's this one plus their memories and impressions created by all the others they know about.
I spent enough time in Korea talking to Korean adults to know that Koreans are incredibly manipulated and indoctrinated by their Orwellian media. Yeah, someone who read Chomsky once is going to come along and remind me, "Oh, CNN/BBC/CBC/NY Times do it also, and Westerners are manipulated too..." While there's truth to that - where are those promised Iraqi WMDs, anyway? - the Western media at its Eyewitness News worst can't match the insidious and methodical "keep em ignorant and nationalistic" philosophy of MBC and its ilk.
edited to replace a term apparently verboten, though no one's told me...
Last edited by The Lemon on Mon Jan 31, 2005 2:03 am; edited 2 times in total |
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VanIslander
Joined: 18 Aug 2003 Location: Geoje, Hadong, Tongyeong,... now in a small coastal island town outside Gyeongsangnamdo!
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Posted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 11:32 pm Post subject: |
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The Lemon wrote: |
The thing about this cycle is that it provides regular reenforcement that [westerners in korea=bad |
Substitute 'foreigners in korea' and I'd agree.
That's how the Koreans have managed to preserve their sense of independence and culture despite centuries of influence from the Chinese and Japanese and others.
I admire their attitudes as part and parcel of a mindset of resistance and resilience.
I have been treated remarkably well as a guest in their country, and expect that to continue. |
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The Lemon
Joined: 11 Jan 2003
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Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2005 12:49 am Post subject: |
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Then one person's "independence" and "resilience" is another's bigotry and xenophobia. |
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