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some waygug-in
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 3:01 am Post subject: Hmm, An interesting read. |
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Something I've always agreed with. I can't understand right-wingers willingness to give "freebies" to corperations, especially with no strings attached.
http://www.buzzflash.com/premiums/05/06/pre05079.html#order
The Great American Jobs Scam: Corporate Tax Dodging and the Myth of Job Creation by Greg LeRoy
cheers |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 3:04 am Post subject: |
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| Corporate Welfare, along with Health Care Costs, are the number 1 things that piss me off about my country. |
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stumptown
Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Location: Paju: Wife beating capital of Korea
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| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 3:11 am Post subject: |
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| Corporate welfare is the malignant tumor of the working man. Too bad unions lost so much control. |
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funplanet
Joined: 20 Jun 2003
Location: The new Bucheon!
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| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 3:46 am Post subject: |
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best way to save taxes (if self-employed) is to be incorporated...why give most of what you work for to the government?? stupid stupid stupid
besides, all those taxes they save may be enough to hire one more worker...or to increase dividends to stockowners...
no problem...they should no taxes at all |
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desultude
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: Dangling my toes in the Persian Gulf
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| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 4:48 am Post subject: |
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| funplanet wrote: |
best way to save taxes (if self-employed) is to be incorporated...why give most of what you work for to the government?? stupid stupid stupid
besides, all those taxes they save may be enough to hire one more worker...or to increase dividends to stockowners...
no problem...they should no taxes at all |
Well, the classical economics argument is that you pay taxes because the government provides the infrastructure necessary to run your business, and the safety net to keep your employees alive and well until you need them- ever hear of the "surplus army of the unemployed"?
The taxes are also needed to educate the workforce.
Paying taxes is decidedly not stupid. Not knowing the value of infrastructure and social support is.
By the way, the money saved by tax cuts has been pretty well been proven to not go into that mythological chestnut, job creation. You probably believe that family farmers pay estate taxes too. |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 5:48 am Post subject: |
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| stumptown wrote: |
| Corporate welfare is the malignant tumor of the working man. Too bad unions lost so much control. |
Umm, you think unions are against corporate welfare? This 'aid' to large companies is generally given with the premise that it is creating or sustaining jobs. All over the West, corporations are given huge tax breaks, and sometimes cash to relocate to, or expand in, a given area (granted, increased tax revenue is also a reason that this is done, but this revenue, we are told, will go to schools and other 'essential' services). I hardly think that the unions would resist this. Perhaps they would want more of the welfare to be funneled into the "workers" hands (of course the welfare comes from tax revenue from other workers, in similar financial positions) but in the end the welfare would still exist.
Unions are cartels and behave as such. The rent seeking behaviour of unions is destructive to the economy as a whole, and the unemployed masses of a country in specific. Jobs are protected at the expense of those who haven't jobs. This is a major reason why fully 25% of Sweden's workforce doesn't show for work on a given day, or why France and the other sick-states of Europe have disgusting unemployment problems. Unions cause great economic harm to the overall employment level of an economy. They also tend to lower worker productivity and competitiveness which over time diminishes the possibility that those workers will be employed long term as their wages relative to their productivity tend to increase making 'outsourcing' an attractive solution.
Unions, in and of themselves, don't have to be economically destructive entities but they tend to get hijacked by Lefty academics who attempt to manipulate the workers into a revolutionary hysteria and create a general feeling of antipathy towards the employers (South Korea). Lately, this isn't working, as demonstrated by the neutered Buzz Hargrove in Canada and backlashes against oft striking civil servants in Europe. Lately, it seems, unions are often only creating antipathy towards themselves.
For a decent example of how unions affect an economy, take a look at South Korea, where labour troubles are becoming a very serious problem in terms of this nations ability to attract FDI. Or, take a look at any teachers union in Canada, where (at least in my province) every 4 years the teachers talk a bunch of talk about class sizes and the like but in the end settle for a double digit percent increase in their pay.
Thank goodness the unions lost their power, at least in the Anglo world. |
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Nowhere Man
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 8:24 am Post subject: ... |
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| Thank goodness the unions lost their power, at least in the Anglo world. |
Nice forked tongue you have there.
So, the unions have lost their power in the "Anglo world"?
Then who does that leave for corporate welfare?
The corporations!
Then we have a guy like FunPlanet, who doesn't want social welfare out of respect for minorities.
In terms of respecting corporations:
| Quote: |
| no problem...they should no taxes at all |
I no want pay education for him. |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 8:44 am Post subject: |
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| Kuros wrote: |
| Corporate Welfare, along with Health Care Costs, are the number 1 things that piss me off about my country. |
Yeah. The amazing thing about health care is there are so many idiots out there who think the USA has the best health care in the world. It isn't even near the top. Sad stuff. |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2005 6:13 pm Post subject: Re: ... |
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| Nowhere Man wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Thank goodness the unions lost their power, at least in the Anglo world. |
Nice forked tongue you have there.
So, the unions have lost their power in the "Anglo world"?
Then who does that leave for corporate welfare?
The corporations!
Then we have a guy like FunPlanet, who doesn't want social welfare out of respect for minorities.
In terms of respecting corporations:
| Quote: |
| no problem...they should no taxes at all |
I no want pay education for him. |
Well, I am not suggesting that the big bad evil corporations should get the welfare and the unions not. But, I would like to see it all gone. I just disagree with the suggestion that unions would somehow disagree with existence of this aid at all. Ultimately, I agree that very low taxes, funding a national health care plan, national defence, the courts and police, and aid to the disabled is best. Anything more than that will just be wasted satisfying special interest groups. |
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