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joe_doufu
Joined: 09 May 2005
Location: Elsewhere
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 Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 2:43 am Post subject: hagwon boss = yoda |
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quote from friday evening:
"To go home, ready, I am." |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 5:47 am Post subject: |
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| I remember a Mad magazine series on Yoda's English school. Funny as hell. |
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mourningclam
Joined: 27 Jan 2004
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Actually, the grammatical form used by Yoda is the same as Hungarian, which is in the same language family as Finnish and Estonian. |
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joe_doufu
Joined: 09 May 2005
Location: Elsewhere
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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| mourningclam wrote: |
| Actually, the grammatical form used by Yoda is the same as Hungarian, which is in the same language family as Finnish and Estonian. |
... and Korean, and Japanese, and Mongolian, and Turkish ... |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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Estonians don't use Yoda's word order. More flexible than English but certainly not Yoda-ish.
Mul on sõber - I have a friend
Ma lähen sõbraga - I go with my friend
Mul ei ole kodu - I don't have a house
Kas te räägite eesti keelt? - Do you speak Estonian?
Ei tea. - Dunno.
All those are the same word order as English, though the bits after the nouns qualify what they do in a sentence. |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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Spanish speakers can get into Yoda-like syntax.
Que esta haciendo el mono? (What is he doing, the monkey?) |
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trigger123
Joined: 08 Sep 2004
Location: TALKING TO STRANGERS, IN A BETTER PLACE
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| Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2005 8:59 pm Post subject: |
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funny that, cos i've been working with a korean guy at my school whom i call yoda too. the rest of the teaching staff crack up when he speaks englishee, because he manages to say his english words using korean grammar, or some kind of konglish kerazy stuff that only me, him and yoda could understand. its taken me hours of study to get to a level where i can understand whats he's going on about
'how you go very hard style home?' (Is your journey home difficult?)
'when result, tell you me' (When you have solved the problem, tell me)
'summer time, have you a promise?' (Do you have any plans this summer?)
beautiful. truly a cunning linguist. |
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thebum
Joined: 09 Jan 2005
Location: North Korea
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| Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 4:46 am Post subject: |
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| joe_doufu wrote: |
| mourningclam wrote: |
| Actually, the grammatical form used by Yoda is the same as Hungarian, which is in the same language family as Finnish and Estonian. |
... and Korean, and Japanese, and Mongolian, and Turkish ... |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ural-Altaic_languages
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The Ural-Altaic language family is a grouping of languages which was once widely accepted by linguists, but has since been generally rejected. It comprised the Altaic languages (Turkish, Mongolian, Kazakh, Uzbek, Tatar, Manchu, etc., plus perhaps Korean and Japanese) and the Uralic languages (Hungarian, Finnish, Estonian, etc.).
The theory of a Uralo-Altaic group has now been widely disapproved by historical linguists as a misnomer. Even the existence of the Altaic language family has become controversial (see Altaic languages), although Uralic is somewhat accepted. Most modern linguists argue either that these two families (or more than two, if Altaic is rejected) are unrelated, ascribing any similarities to coincidence or mutual influence resulting in "convergence". Other critics see this as problematic, pointing to strong similarities in their pronouns and other elements - although pronoun borrowing, while rare, is attested. They suggest that they may instead be related through a larger family (either Nostratic or Eurasiatic) within which Uralic and Altaic are no more closely related to each other than to this macrofamily's other members. see:Uralo-Siberian languages.
Both groups follow the principle of vowel harmony, are agglutinative (stringing suffixes, prefixes or both onto a single root) and lack grammatical gender (see noun class). However, these typological similarities do not, on their own, constitute evidence of genetic relationship, as they may be a result of areal influences or coincidence. These features are consistent with a proto-language or a loose collection of areal influences spanning Proto-Uralic, Proto-Indo-European and Turkic languages. Vowel harmony is found in other, unrelated language groups. Moreover, there is no evidence for noninitial labial vowels in Proto-Uralic, thus leaving the remaining /a/ and /i/ open for allophony controlled by the initial syllable, creating vowel harmony from scratch. However, the prevalence of the above-noted features among the languages of the propose Ural-Altaic languages suggests a strong relationship, whether genetic or not.
This proposed language family has also sometimes been termed Turanian. The term derives from the Persian word for places beyond the Oxus, Turān. |
See also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Altaic_languages |
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joe_doufu
Joined: 09 May 2005
Location: Elsewhere
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| Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 5:04 am Post subject: |
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| thebum wrote: |
| Most modern linguists argue either that these two families (or more than two, if Altaic is rejected) are unrelated, ascribing any similarities to coincidence or mutual influence resulting in "convergence". |
These linguists are debating the "family tree" of the languages, not their practical existence. Note how they dismiss "mutual influence" and "convergence" as if that was just noise messing up their otherwise controlled experimental data. Convergence is real, it has a name, and that name is Genghis Khan. Mongolian and Turkish might not come from a common prehistoric proto-language, but they certainly share some serious "convergence" in recorded history. |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 6:28 am Post subject: |
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And more importantly, their word order is the same. You put particles on the ends of words to show that something is going to, coming from, whether it belongs to someone, etc. Verbs come at the end of a sentence. Doesn't matter if linguists have disputed their common ancestry if we're just talking about their structure.
Not the Finno-Ugric languages though. There's agglutination there but you can write sentences SVO like in English. |
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thebum
Joined: 09 Jan 2005
Location: North Korea
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| Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 8:54 am Post subject: |
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Right. I didn't read clearly (nor was I sober) before I posted my response. Sorry.  |
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dulouz
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Uranus
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| Posted: Tue Jul 26, 2005 4:32 am Post subject: |
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| It is correct, the Yoda thing. Before now too, I thought that. Much longer, I cannot talk. A pee I have to take. |
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Grotto
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Tue Jul 26, 2005 7:50 am Post subject: |
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Technically I would equate a hogwan owner more with the evil emporer rather than the benign Yoda.(speech patterns aside)  |
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The evil penguin
Joined: 24 May 2003
Location: Doing something naughty near you.....
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| Posted: Tue Jul 26, 2005 8:01 am Post subject: |
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| Grotto wrote: |
| Technically I would equate a hogwan owner more with the evil emporer rather than the benign Yoda.(speech patterns aside) |
physically speaking... my boss definitely has a strong Yoda resemblance.... about the same height as well.... |
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