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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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 Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 10:01 am Post subject: New deportation measures for fostering hatred in Britain |
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What do you think?
From what I can see, it looks to be just about right, especially that last bit about consulting with muslim leaders when drawing up lists on who should be deported or not.
But then again I'm not British, so somebody might know something here I don't.
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LONDON, Aug. 5 -- Prime Minister Tony Blair, responding to last month's deadly bombings in London, outlined a series of unprecedented steps that would allow Britain to deport and exclude foreign nationals who promote or incite extremist violence or are "fostering hatred."
Among those excluded would be non-citizen clerics "not suitable to preach." In addition, Blair said the government was preparing orders allowing the government to shut down places of worship used as centers for "fomenting extremism."
Some of the steps may require legislation or court involvement. Others can be done by government order. Blair acknowledged the potential controversy that could arise from the proposals.
"The rules of the game are changing," Blair said in an 80-minute news conference devoted almost entirely to the issue of terrorism, which has taken on new urgency in Britain since a July 7 bombing that killed four bombers and 52 other people and injured 700 more.
Blair noted that Britain has been generous in hosting asylum seekers and refugees from across the globe, but he said that public opinion is demanding more care in accepting them.
"We're angry about these extremists," Blair said. "We're angry about them abusing our good nature and out toleration."
Blair announced that two Islamic organizations, Hizb ut-Tahrir and al-Muhajiroun, would be banned in Britain.
Leaders of Hizb ut-Tahrir, which has also been banned in Germany, have denounced the bombings and asserted that they are nonviolent.
Al Muhajiroun's spiritual leader is Sheikh Omar Bakri Muhammed, a Syrian-born imam who has expressed "understanding" for the bombings because of Blair's policies in Iraq and the Middle East.
Blair said he was not trying to undermine religious tolerance or "legitimate political debate," but rather he wanted to remove those who are "actively engaged in inciting" people to violence.
He denounced as "appalling rubbish" the opinions of those who have supported the bombings as legitimate expression of Muslim anger at the policies of Britain and the United States.
Blair said some of the new policies would be implemented immediately while others are under "urgent examination."
Britain's home secretary would be empowered to deport or exclude anyone "fostering hatred, advocating violence to further a person's beliefs or justifying or validating such violence."
Blair said there will be a list drawn up of "specific extremist Web sites, bookshops, centers, networks" and organizations and that "active engagement" with any of them would be a "trigger" for possible deportation.
As outlined in a release from the Prime Minister's Office , the government will propose new anti-terror legislation that will create an offense of "condoning or glorifying terrorism . . . anywhere, not just in the UK."
"Anyone who has participated in terrorism or has anything to do with it anywhere will automatically be refused," said the statement.
Blair also said the government would:
*Consider stripping citizenship from naturalized Britons "engaged in extremism."
*Establish, within the Muslim community in Britain, a commission to advise on how to better integrate into society "those parts of the community presently inadequately integrated."
*Consider closure of places of worship used as centers "for fomenting extremism" and, in consultation with Muslim leaders, "draw up a list of those not suitable to preach who will be excluded from Britain." |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 10:32 am Post subject: |
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Does GB have Hate laws?
If so then it's pretty straightforward.
Inciting hatred and violence based on hatred is a crime, and non-citizens breaking the law get deported.
Just a question of implementation.
And I would think that it could/should be applied evenly and equally, not just targeting Muslims.
In an extreme example I could see some Koreans on student visas getting tossed out for inciting Japanese hatred.
What I would really wonder about is- can you deport an EU citizen who is not a British citizen? |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 11:30 am Post subject: |
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| What about KKK members from the States who want to vacation there, would they be affected I wonder? |
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The Man known as The Man
Joined: 29 Mar 2003
Location: 3 cheers for Ted Haggard oh yeah!
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 11:51 am Post subject: |
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| mithridates wrote: |
| What about KKK members from the States who want to vacation there, would they be affected I wonder? |
Hard to believe some of your posts aren't taken seriously. |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 11:54 am Post subject: |
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| I suppose they would be, if they started burning crosses and getting up on soapboxes and advocating lynchings in Hyde park. |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 11:54 am Post subject: |
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| I suppose they would be, if they started burning crosses and getting up on soapboxes and advocating lynchings in Hyde park. |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 12:04 pm Post subject: |
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| The Man known as The Man wrote: |
| mithridates wrote: |
| What about KKK members from the States who want to vacation there, would they be affected I wonder? |
Hard to believe some of your posts aren't taken seriously. |
This post cracked me up real good, William Beckerson. I like one-liners. |
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The Man known as The Man
Joined: 29 Mar 2003
Location: 3 cheers for Ted Haggard oh yeah!
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 12:33 pm Post subject: |
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| mithridates wrote: |
| The Man known as The Man wrote: |
| mithridates wrote: |
| What about KKK members from the States who want to vacation there, would they be affected I wonder? |
Hard to believe some of your posts aren't taken seriously. |
This post cracked me up real good, William Beckerson. I like one-liners. |
Do you mean the same KKK dudes who are still burning crosses in Prince George, BC?
Someone should inform Hedy Frey immediately! |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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| I was thinking more along the lines of laws that get used in ways than they were originally intended. Some laws that were drafted in some states to forbid mask-wearing helped in the fight against the KKK, but recently they've been used to forbid muslim women from wearing full headgear because some of them were too general and referred simply to wearing facial coverings and not specifically the KKK. After a few decades things can change and I wonder if this law could ever be used in a different way against something/someone else in the future. |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 1:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| From what I can see, it looks to be just about right, especially that last bit about consulting with muslim leaders when drawing up lists on who should be deported or not. |
There is absolutely no reason to consult muslim leaders on who should be deported. All that needs to be decided on is whether certain individuals are formenting hatred and terrorism. If they are guilty they should be thrown out, without recourse to courts or money grabbing human rights lawyers. Unfortunately, this is unlikely to happen, unless Blair is prepared to withdraw from the European Human Rights Act, which has hampered all efforts to deal with such problems, and has handed over far too much power to liberal judges. Moreover, Blair's wife is a human rights lawyer, who seems to have her husband under the thumb. Time for Tony to put his foot down. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 2:44 pm Post subject: |
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| All that needs to be decided on is whether certain individuals are formenting hatred and terrorism. If they are guilty they should be thrown out, without recourse to courts or money grabbing human rights lawyers. |
Aren't you glad you're half way around the world where the bobbies can't get to you? |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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"money grubbing human rights lawyers."
Thanks for the laugh. yes, because that is why human rights lawyers go into their chosen field: for the money.
If you want to be a cynic about it all, might want to get a grip on reality and say publicity-seeking. |
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waggo
Joined: 18 May 2003
Location: pusan baby!
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 6:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Way too little way too late. |
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shakuhachi
Joined: 08 Feb 2003
Location: Sydney
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:54 pm Post subject: Re: New deportation measures for fostering hatred in Britain |
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| mithridates wrote: |
| From what I can see, it looks to be just about right, especially that last bit about consulting with muslim leaders when drawing up lists on who should be deported or not.. |
Consulting 'Muslims Leaders' would be a mistake, since they are part of the problem. In the meantime, the new British police guidelines leaked to World Net Daily say that police have to take off their shoes when raiding a Muslim home or Mosque, and cannot interrupt prayers. Talk about crazy. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Consulting 'Muslims Leaders' would be a mistake, since they are part of the problem. |
Every single one of them? |
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