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Korean Job Discussion Forums
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Teufelswacht
Joined: 06 Sep 2004
Location: Land Of The Not Quite Right
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 Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 8:33 am Post subject: More.... ahem...... "Teachers" busted |
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From the marmot.
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Police Make Mass Bust of Unqualified English Teachers
The Foreign Affairs Division of the Busan Metropolitan Police Agency arrested two Americans and booked 37 foreign language instructors without detention on Tuesday for fabricating their educational backgrounds or working in Korea as foreign language teachers without proper visas. In addition, 50 owners of foreign language institutes, including a 37 year-old identified by his family name of Lee, and 27 brokers were also booked.
According to police, the arrested Americans, a 51-year-old man identified as ��R,�� and a 31-year-old ��M,�� obtained forged diplomas and transcripts through brokers and Internet sites, came to Korea and worked as native English instructors in three to four institutes. R and M are both high school graduates. R had a bogus bachelor and master��s degree from a well-known state university in the United States, and worked as an instructor in high schools and universities in Korea. M worked in private foreign language institutes in Seoul and Gyeonggi Province, and reportedly enjoyed improper relations with his female students.
Brokers, including a 33-year-old by the name of Cho, received W800,000 (about US$800) to W2 million in procurement fees for full-time instructors and W300,000 to W800,000 for part-time lecturers, and supplied unqualified foreign language teachers to 50 institutes nationwide. They took over W80 million in illegal profits.
The police uncovered these illicit dealings by hunting through over 30 online communities for foreign language instructors and degree forgery sites. There were not only unqualified Anglophone instructors from the United States, Canada, and Australia, but also those from Japan, China and Taiwan. It was discovered that the practice of employing uncertified foreign lecturers is taking place all across the country.
([email protected] ) |
http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200508/200508160028.html
If this has been posted some where else, sorry for the duplication. |
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Teufelswacht
Joined: 06 Sep 2004
Location: Land Of The Not Quite Right
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Real Reality
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 10:59 am Post subject: |
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Go for it- you don't access to confidential police/Immigration sources, do you?
If that info is already out in the public domain elsewhere then there's very little reason to keep it off of here except to give someone the (dis)illusion of privacy. |
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Derrek
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 1:48 pm Post subject: |
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Two of them out of 31 were Americans... TWO.
So are we to believe that the remaining 29 were from individually different countries?
Want to guess how many of those were from Canada or other places?
Why don't they mention that?
Shows you what country the newspapers here hate.
And here's a look at the Dave's paper. Can anyone read or find who posted that add -- possibly a fake? Maybe that was the person named Cho who got busted for recruiting who posted it:
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Grotto
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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My take on the story is the two Americans were arrested and held in detention(more serious crimes)
The other 29 were charged and released.
If Derreck would actually care to read the articles instead of his typical kneejerk reaction he would have read:
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| There were not only unqualified Anglophone instructors from the United States, Canada, and Australia, but also those from Japan, China and Taiwan |
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Pyongshin Sangja
Joined: 20 Apr 2003
Location: I love baby!
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| Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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Two of them out of 31 were Americans... TWO.
So are we to believe that the remaining 29 were from individually different countries?
Want to guess how many of those were from Canada or other places?
Why don't they mention that?
Shows you what country the newspapers here hate. |
Allright, Derrek, I'll bite. You misread the article. Two Americans were busted and detained for having committed fraud by obtaining visas with fake documents. The others were busted and released for working on tourist visas, a lesser crime. Presenting false documents is seen as a serious crime, violating the terms of your tourist visa is less serious. These two are probably going to trial, the others will be fined or deported.
The article states that those violating tourist visas came from 6 countries, Canada was just one of them. There may or may not have been more Americans among those arrested and released, those arrested and released are not broken down by nationality.
It's not hate but is it any coincidence that in 2004/05 the only people busted with fake degrees are Americans? That's right, just Americans and there were 5 of them.
Perhaps the 6 month Cdn. visa means that we don't have to falsify degrees in order to stay here for more than a month or three but that is all conjecture. As it stands, Americans seem to be head and shoulders above others at committing documentary fraud in Korea.
The problem of illegal teaching in Korea is hardly confined to foreigners from one country, Korea is a global market being exploited by ESL'ers from all over. Just like you.
If Canadians are such a problem in Korea why don't news stories focus on us? Sure, Canada is low-profile but there hardly seems to be a grassroots struggle against us in Korea. Our illegal grammar teaching hasn't had us up on charges at the UN.
Why are you the only one that seems to have a problem with us? Like a serious knee-jerk, I-don't-even-bother-reading-the-article-all-the-way-through-before-I-start-ranting-about-Canadians problem as opposed to the ribbing I get from others on this board?
Why is it so hard for you to believe that there are Americans working illegally in this country? Americans all have a million dollars in the bank and big houses in Malibu? Canadians are all poverty stricken inbreds?
Americans smoke, drink, fight, get kinky, steal, cheat, lie, get sick, go crazy, commit suicide, kill and rape. Just like Canadians.
I have known DOD civilians working on the side, USFK soldiers working on the side, American girls tutoring little kids, American guys editing and proofreading in law firms, newspapers, magazines and teaching business English. All illegally, all under the table, for cash, fly by night, shady stuff.
Sure, I know more Canadians doing this but....I'm Canadian. It stands to reason I would know more Canadians. If I were American, I'd probably spend more time with Americans. There are probably more of us teaching ESL illegally but frankly, a lot of American rejects in Korea are carrying rifles at the DMZ. We're here teaching English. Soft-power vs. hard. We'll see who wins in the end. |
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Hollywoodaction
Joined: 02 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 4:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Bah, throw the book at them. It's hard enough as it is to get students motivated, we really don't need uneducated morons passing off as teachers. It only serves to provide the least gifted students with a pretext to begin goofing off in class. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Derrek wrote: |
Two of them out of 31 were Americans... TWO.
So are we to believe that the remaining 29 were from individually different countries?
Want to guess how many of those were from Canada or other places?
Why don't they mention that?
Shows you what country the newspapers here hate.
And here's a look at the Dave's paper. Can anyone read or find who posted that add -- possibly a fake? Maybe that was the person named Cho who got busted for recruiting who posted it:
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Derrek, why do you insist on making yourself look silly? When cooler heads point out factors that you overlook, you don't come off very well by comparision. |
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Grotto
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 6:46 pm Post subject: |
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| So are we to believe that the remaining 29 were from individually different countries? |
So are we to believe that of the remaining 29 individuals none of them were American?
I would imagine that there were some yanks in the 29 as well.
It is interesting that of the 31 busted only two were detained for more serious crimes.....it is also interesting that the two held for using forged documents were Americans.....does that mean all Americans are using forged documents? Nope...it doesnt....just as it doesnt mean the majority of illegal teachers are Canadian.
Derreck open eyes, look, see, think, ponder, realise and gain wisdom. |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
Derrek, why do you insist on making yourself look silly? |
Because it's what he does best. |
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rumpolestitskin
Joined: 12 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 8:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Hollywoodaction wrote: |
| Bah, throw the book at them. It's hard enough as it is to get students motivated, we really don't need uneducated morons passing off as teachers. It only serves to provide the least gifted students with a pretext to begin goofing off in class. |
Think it might be a little too early to peg them as uneducated morons. After all the article did say that they graduated high school, so its not as if they are totally uneducated and did nothing during education.
who is to say that they simply couldn't afford to go to college? The hardest thing for me was paying the tutition.
I seem to remember most of my college education being an attendance thing rather than serious learning. Either im a genius or college isn't all its cracked up to be.
And I'm fairly sure that there are people out there with no college education that are better teachers than me; a person with 2 degree's.
Throwing the book at them seems a little harsh when you consider that this is a country with something like 26 times more purgery, fraud and libel than Japan (According to an article in the chosun times). Lets not also forget that if my memory serves me correct millions of people have just been pardoned. Think simply deporting them would be a better option. |
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Hollywoodaction
Joined: 02 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 9:10 pm Post subject: |
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| rumpolestitskin wrote: |
| Hollywoodaction wrote: |
| Bah, throw the book at them. It's hard enough as it is to get students motivated, we really don't need uneducated morons passing off as teachers. It only serves to provide the least gifted students with a pretext to begin goofing off in class. |
Think it might be a little too early to peg them as uneducated morons. After all the article did say that they graduated high school, so its not as if they are totally uneducated and did nothing during education.
who is to say that they simply couldn't afford to go to college? The hardest thing for me was paying the tutition.
I seem to remember most of my college education being an attendance thing rather than serious learning. Either im a genius or college isn't all its cracked up to be.
And I'm fairly sure that there are people out there with no college education that are better teachers than me; a person with 2 degree's.
Throwing the book at them seems a little harsh when you consider that this is a country with something like 26 times more purgery, fraud and libel than Japan (According to an article in the chosun times). Lets not also forget that if my memory serves me correct millions of people have just been pardoned. Think simply deporting them would be a better option. |
Since when does having a highschool diploma make one 'educated' in the US--or in any other developped nation, for that matter? Unless the standards have completely deteriorated, I'd say you need at least a 2 year college diploma to be labeled as so. Yes, I question their intelligence for the simple reason that they chose to remain in Korea, knowing all too well the government had finally begun looking for scam artists of their kind. It was so dumb of them to stay, this story could be filed under 'stupid criminals'.
Deportation is hardly a deterrent; however, the threat of spending 6 months to a year in Korean jail can certainly be so. Send them to jail where they can learn the joys of eating kimchi, rice, and beans 3 meals a day, 7 days a week. I also hear Korean jails are quite chilly in the winter. |
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joe_doufu
Joined: 09 May 2005
Location: Elsewhere
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2005 1:57 am Post subject: |
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| Hollywoodaction wrote: |
| Bah, throw the book at them. It's hard enough as it is to get students motivated, we really don't need uneducated morons passing off as teachers. It only serves to provide the least gifted students with a pretext to begin goofing off in class. |
That goes to show you don't know your language learning history. If some Frenchman hadn't falsified his papers (claiming he could speak English, which he couldn't) to get a job (arranged from overseas, by mail) in the Berlitz Language School, back in 1870 something, the immersion/no-translation language learning method wouldn't have been invented. This magnificent innovation was purely due to some seat-of-the-pants joker with bogus qualifications, and I think we should encourage more of the same! |
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JongnoGuru
Joined: 25 May 2004
Location: peeing on your doorstep
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| Posted: Thu Aug 18, 2005 2:17 am Post subject: |
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| Hollywoodaction wrote: |
| Deportation is hardly a deterrent; however, the threat of spending 6 months to a year in Korean jail can certainly be so. Send them to jail where they can learn the joys of eating kimchi, rice, and beans 3 meals a day, 7 days a week. I also hear Korean jails are quite chilly in the winter. |
Beans? Anyway, you forgot to mention 5 prisoners to a 7-pyong cell. Or was it 7 to a 5-pyong cell? Whatever. With one (open) squat toilet between them, you know it's a zoo. I understand the "he-went-bonkers" rate is fairly high in those cells. Don't know about suicides, but nothing would surprise me. Any druggies on the board might want to chime in with a few second-hand anecdotes here. |
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