|
Korean Job Discussion Forums "The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
The evil penguin

Joined: 24 May 2003 Location: Doing something naughty near you.....
|
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 6:24 pm Post subject: Korean imaginations and aspirations... |
|
|
Okay, todays topic in the (very crap) texbook in my middle-school conversation class was about tourism. The so-called discussion question was "discuss what tourists in your country might find unique and exciting".
soooooo..... i thought i'd try a different question.... After giving examples of camel riding in the desert, bungy jumping, snowboarding, surfing, shopping in new-york (for the girls), laying on the beaches in tahiti and other examples ranging from relaxing to stroke-inducing exhilarating I asked "if you could travel to any country or place (i even introduced the concept of space tourism to really get the imaginations kicking) and do anything.... stressing that finance is not an issue... and that you could go ANYWHERE and do ANYTHING (using imagination)............... what would you do?"
The reply from every one of the students....... "Go PC Bang"....
In frustration i mentioned this to the korean teachers during the break while they were all de-oiling their faces with paper squares....
They kinda shrugged and said that maybe the students liked playing computer games.. I then put the question to them..... again stressing that they could do ANYTHING, ANYWHERE........... Without fail, the awnswer from all three was.... "Stay home.... sleep..."
ARRRRRGHHHHHH!!! Whats wrong with these people!!!!!!!!!!  |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
joe_doufu

Joined: 09 May 2005 Location: Elsewhere
|
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 7:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
1. They are all crushed under the gigantic stone wheel that is the Korean way of life, and the most important thing to them is relief of stress.
2. The children literally don't know anything outside their home, bus, and school, except the PC bang, maybe a basketball court, and the movie theater. Going to a foreign country sounds like hard work to them. They probably think their tour guide would force them to chant the names of all the places they'd seen, and memorize the historical details for an exam back at the hotel.
3. The adults have heard vaguely of places such as Hawaii and New York, but as adult Korean women their lives have progressed from potentially meaningless and horrible to almost-definitely meaningless and horrible. I wouldn't be surprised to hear they'd like to go home and down a bottle of sleeping pills. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
Naruto
Joined: 07 Jul 2005 Location: Irvine, CA
|
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 8:05 pm Post subject: |
|
|
joe_doufu wrote: |
1. They are all crushed under the gigantic stone wheel that is the Korean way of life, and the most important thing to them is relief of stress.
2. The children literally don't know anything outside their home, bus, and school, except the PC bang, maybe a basketball court, and the movie theater. Going to a foreign country sounds like hard work to them. They probably think their tour guide would force them to chant the names of all the places they'd seen, and memorize the historical details for an exam back at the hotel.
3. The adults have heard vaguely of places such as Hawaii and New York, but as adult Korean women their lives have progressed from potentially meaningless and horrible to almost-definitely meaningless and horrible. I wouldn't be surprised to hear they'd like to go home and down a bottle of sleeping pills. |
That's a little bit too negative and the third one is horribly inaccurate, but the first two points have the right idea. For kids school is pretty much everything and the parents are the driving force behind it. Korean society is so competative that basically if you don't get good grades you won't be successful in life. If you have amazing sport ability than yeah you have a chance but it's rare. You have to understand that in Korean society you're facing millions of people who are all competing for that good job, or even a place in the line...extra curricular activities aren't encouraged because it can be distracting from the studies. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: Established in 1994
|
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 10:34 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Since that approach didn't work as planned (and I hate when that happens), maybe try something like saying they were going to spend two weeks in Spain. What would you do? Give every pair a different location. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
denverdeath
Joined: 21 May 2005 Location: Boo-sahn
|
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 11:26 pm Post subject: Re: Korean imaginations and aspirations... |
|
|
The evil penguin wrote: |
"Go PC Bang" |
Most kids I've met in this country have a computer at home, or at least there's a family computer where they live. However, most I've talked to are rarely allowed to use it. Just when they get grooving on Kart Rider, their mother/father tells 'em to turn it off and study. They may perceive the Pee-shieee Bang as the place where they'd be in heaven, able to play for hours and hours with nothing to hinder their way to the five-fingered gold glove, or whatever. No studying, no running from hakwon to hakwon, no nothing.
Quote: |
"Stay home.... sleep..." |
Maybe they're tired from being at work all day long...relaxing, talking, eating snacks. Maybe they really do need some sleep. I'd be tired(certainly brain tired) if I had to stay at the workplace for close to twelve hours(maybe eight at a MS) everyday, sometimes six days a week. Don't forget though, sleeping is a hobby in Korea.
Quote: |
ARRRRRGHHHHHH!!! Whats wrong with these people!!!!!!!!!! |
|
|
Back to top |
|
 |
Corporal

Joined: 25 Jan 2003
|
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 12:18 am Post subject: Re: Korean imaginations and aspirations... |
|
|
The evil penguin wrote: |
Okay, todays topic in the (very crap) texbook in my middle-school conversation class was about tourism. The so-called discussion question was "discuss what tourists in your country might find unique and exciting".
soooooo..... i thought i'd try a different question.... After giving examples of camel riding in the desert, bungy jumping, snowboarding, surfing, shopping in new-york (for the girls), laying on the beaches in tahiti and other examples ranging from relaxing to stroke-inducing exhilarating I asked "if you could travel to any country or place (i even introduced the concept of space tourism to really get the imaginations kicking) and do anything.... stressing that finance is not an issue... and that you could go ANYWHERE and do ANYTHING (using imagination)............... what would you do?"
The reply from every one of the students....... "Go PC Bang"....
In frustration i mentioned this to the korean teachers during the break while they were all de-oiling their faces with paper squares....
They kinda shrugged and said that maybe the students liked playing computer games.. I then put the question to them..... again stressing that they could do ANYTHING, ANYWHERE........... Without fail, the awnswer from all three was.... "Stay home.... sleep..."
ARRRRRGHHHHHH!!! Whats wrong with these people!!!!!!!!!!  |
1) They're tired.
2) They're kids.
3) Did you consider the possibility that it's much easier to reply "PC bang" than it is to say, "Well, teacher, that's a very thought-provoking question! I really think I'd enjoy spending a few weeks in a rainforest in Brazil examining the mating habits of the red-billed tree frog, because I'm so interested in biology" in someone else's language. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
ajuma

Joined: 18 Feb 2003 Location: Anywere but Seoul!!
|
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 1:35 am Post subject: |
|
|
Korean students basically have the "imagination" gene knocked out of them by the time they're in 4th or 5th grade. Ask 10 kindys to draw a dog and you'll get 10 different dogs. By the 5th grade, out of 10 kids, 8 or 9 will draw the SAME dog! Memorization/being the same is King! Creativity is OUT. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
The evil penguin

Joined: 24 May 2003 Location: Doing something naughty near you.....
|
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 5:47 am Post subject: Re: Korean imaginations and aspirations... |
|
|
Corporal wrote: |
The evil penguin wrote: |
Okay, todays topic in the (very crap) texbook in my middle-school conversation class was about tourism. The so-called discussion question was "discuss what tourists in your country might find unique and exciting".
soooooo..... i thought i'd try a different question.... After giving examples of camel riding in the desert, bungy jumping, snowboarding, surfing, shopping in new-york (for the girls), laying on the beaches in tahiti and other examples ranging from relaxing to stroke-inducing exhilarating I asked "if you could travel to any country or place (i even introduced the concept of space tourism to really get the imaginations kicking) and do anything.... stressing that finance is not an issue... and that you could go ANYWHERE and do ANYTHING (using imagination)............... what would you do?"
The reply from every one of the students....... "Go PC Bang"....
In frustration i mentioned this to the korean teachers during the break while they were all de-oiling their faces with paper squares....
They kinda shrugged and said that maybe the students liked playing computer games.. I then put the question to them..... again stressing that they could do ANYTHING, ANYWHERE........... Without fail, the awnswer from all three was.... "Stay home.... sleep..."
ARRRRRGHHHHHH!!! Whats wrong with these people!!!!!!!!!!  |
1) They're tired.
2) They're kids.
3) Did you consider the possibility that it's much easier to reply "PC bang" than it is to say, "Well, teacher, that's a very thought-provoking question! I really think I'd enjoy spending a few weeks in a rainforest in Brazil examining the mating habits of the red-billed tree frog, because I'm so interested in biology" in someone else's language. |
WTF??? Do you have some kind of permanent PMS or is it just a big chip on your shoulder dating back to some childhood trauma? Did your little brother get a bicycle for christmas and you only got a limb-less barbie doll?
Gee, I guess it must have never crossed my mind that I'm teaching kids.... or that they and the korean teachers are tired.... Fer chrissakes.....
Unbunch your panties for a second Corporal and get off your self-righteous pedistal... (oops did i spell pedistal incorrectly? I'm not sure and don't care....) ....
Where the hell did the red-billed tree frogs come from? Funny thing is, that would be something i would enjoy.....
Of course they're studying somebody elses language... They are studying ENGLISH and they are participating in an english conversation/discussion class..... the object of which is to "discuss" and have "conversations"..... Thankyou by the way for your brilliant and profound statement regarding how much easier it is for the students to simply say "PC Bang" instead of providing an alternative and indepth creative answer..... Once again i am in awe of your deductive insight......
When i told the students that "PC Bang" was not an acceptable answer, they were stumped.... Not because of any language difficulties... they simply couldn't comprehend any other possible answer....
The whole point of my post was that these kids have no interests outside of computer games.... Their life revolves around study and friggin maple story... And they have absolutely no ability to think outside the wee little sheltored box they live in..
These kids have a complete lack of creativity and imagination ability.... and thats a sad thing... |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
denverdeath
Joined: 21 May 2005 Location: Boo-sahn
|
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 6:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
T.E.P.,
Ever do some kind of (Internet) pen-pal thing with 'em? Might be a way to enhance their use of/interest in computers with getting them to see and talk to some people from other nations. Might also help your travel topic a bit. It worked quite well for a teacher before me and I'm thinking of using the same with my students. Or, maybe get them to make a week-long itinerary for a visitor, who hates computers, to Korea. Show 'em some of the good stuff from other places and try to get them to show some of the good stuff here. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
I_Am_Wrong
Joined: 14 Sep 2004 Location: whatever
|
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 9:42 am Post subject: |
|
|
ajuma wrote: |
Korean students basically have the "imagination" gene knocked out of them by the time they're in 4th or 5th grade. Ask 10 kindys to draw a dog and you'll get 10 different dogs. By the 5th grade, out of 10 kids, 8 or 9 will draw the SAME dog! Memorization/being the same is King! Creativity is OUT. |
I teach grade 5 elementary school and I like to bring art into the classroom. I'd also like to tell you that you're wrong. Should I scan the 200 very different and very creative robots that the kids drew for our "English Robot Department Store"? |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
peppermint

Joined: 13 May 2003 Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
|
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 10:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
to the OP- next time keep it simple. I bet if you'd asked them WHERE they'd like to go, you'd have gotten a few different answers- everyone knows the name of a few countries after all. What they'd like to do might require full sentences, and that's just too much work as far as they're concerned.
I suspect that it's not so much that the creativity is beaten out of them in elementary school ( fairly sure that's left to middle school). What I see is that the less confident kids just follow the pack, rather than risk being creative more as the kids get older |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
rumpolestitskin
Joined: 12 Jun 2005
|
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 11:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
1) tell them that the back wall is the 'Thinking Wall'.
2) Select five male students. Demonstrate the invisible chair stress position and get them to adopt that position.
3) Laugh and smile while doing it to make it a little fun for them. The students after thirty seconds will be competing with each other to see whose the strongest.
4) The one who knows he's about to drop will not want to loose face and will shout out a semi decent answer.
5) Let him sit down.
6) Get remainding students to put out hands.
7) Pick on one of them and place some books on hands.
8 ) When a couple more shout out answers let them all sit down.
Might sound a bit harsh on the students to the western mind, but you'd be surprised how much they enjoy the physical competition. The key is to laugh and smile while doing it all so that it doesn't seem like a punishment to them. The problem is that if your not careful students in future classes will deliberatly not give answers so they can compete against freinds.
Just make sure its fun for the students else your'll be on the long slippy path to hatred. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
ajuma

Joined: 18 Feb 2003 Location: Anywere but Seoul!!
|
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 1:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I_Am_Wrong wrote: |
I teach grade 5 elementary school and I like to bring art into the classroom. I'd also like to tell you that you're wrong. Should I scan the 200 very different and very creative robots that the kids drew for our "English Robot Department Store"? |
I'm glad!! When I was teaching elementary school students, that was the result I always got...it's good to know that things are changing.
Something else to try: Students sometimes have problems when they have to answer a question (especially a new/creative one) cold. Start by making a list of all of the countries that they know on the board (or possible answers to the question you will be asking...WITHOUT asking the question). Then cross off Korea (or the most usual/popular answer). THEN ask the question.
Speaking of teaching creative/critical thinking: Does anyone have any ideas for teaching uni students to think outside the box? Many of them will be going abroad to study and they need some "thinking skills"...not only for use in the classroom, but in their lives. |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
Corporal

Joined: 25 Jan 2003
|
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 8:17 pm Post subject: Re: Korean imaginations and aspirations... |
|
|
The evil penguin wrote: |
Corporal wrote: |
The evil penguin wrote: |
Okay, todays topic in the (very crap) texbook in my middle-school conversation class was about tourism. The so-called discussion question was "discuss what tourists in your country might find unique and exciting".
soooooo..... i thought i'd try a different question.... After giving examples of camel riding in the desert, bungy jumping, snowboarding, surfing, shopping in new-york (for the girls), laying on the beaches in tahiti and other examples ranging from relaxing to stroke-inducing exhilarating I asked "if you could travel to any country or place (i even introduced the concept of space tourism to really get the imaginations kicking) and do anything.... stressing that finance is not an issue... and that you could go ANYWHERE and do ANYTHING (using imagination)............... what would you do?"
The reply from every one of the students....... "Go PC Bang"....
In frustration i mentioned this to the korean teachers during the break while they were all de-oiling their faces with paper squares....
They kinda shrugged and said that maybe the students liked playing computer games.. I then put the question to them..... again stressing that they could do ANYTHING, ANYWHERE........... Without fail, the awnswer from all three was.... "Stay home.... sleep..."
ARRRRRGHHHHHH!!! Whats wrong with these people!!!!!!!!!!  |
1) They're tired.
2) They're kids.
3) Did you consider the possibility that it's much easier to reply "PC bang" than it is to say, "Well, teacher, that's a very thought-provoking question! I really think I'd enjoy spending a few weeks in a rainforest in Brazil examining the mating habits of the red-billed tree frog, because I'm so interested in biology" in someone else's language. |
WTF??? Do you have some kind of permanent PMS or is it just a big chip on your shoulder dating back to some childhood trauma? Did your little brother get a bicycle for christmas and you only got a limb-less barbie doll?
Gee, I guess it must have never crossed my mind that I'm teaching kids.... or that they and the korean teachers are tired.... Fer chrissakes.....
Unbunch your panties for a second Corporal and get off your self-righteous pedistal... (oops did i spell pedistal incorrectly? I'm not sure and don't care....) ....
... |
Oh, how mature. Because I am a woman and because I say something you dislike (because it's true), I must therefore have PMS. How original!
You posted a question indicating you really had no capability to understand why your students didn't want to participate in your class. Maybe because you're boring? Maybe you fell down the stairs as an infant and that knocked all creative inductive capacity out of you? I don't know. Maybe you should try being interested in what your students are interested in instead of trying to get them to say YOUR perfect answer. Not everyone thinks snowboarding or shopping in New York are the be-all and end-all of existence, you know.
If you hate your students so much (saying they have a complete lack of intelligence or creative ability) perhaps you should consider a different line of work where you don't have to be so frustrated.
Or maybe you're frustrated in a different venue of your life? ('Cause that's about as mature an implication as your snarky little PMS comment.)
 |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
pegpig

Joined: 10 May 2005
|
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 8:52 pm Post subject: |
|
|
YES SIR!!! er....ma'am |
|
Back to top |
|
 |
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|