Korean Job Discussion Forums

[waterbaby]

Just wondering how many of you out there have ever actually done a midnight run? I am a little bit guilty of this (OK, a lot ). I ran away from my Uni gig in China 'cos it was soooo awful and the Uni lied to me from day one. Won't bore you with the grotty details.

I was tempted to run from my first contract in Korea and even plotted my escape... just planning and mentally packing my suitcase made me feel better

If you have done a midnight run, do you feel bad about it or do you feel completely justified (like me) about your actions? Have you run into any further trouble with immigration? What motivated you to do it?

[LiquidSunshine]

why run away? why not just quit? i never got that....i've been at some pretty bad schools and, once, i had to cover for some dude who ran away. boss knocked on my door at 7am just so i can go teach 12 hours because someone wasn't man enough to give notice.
i'm not attacking anyone personaly (i have no idea what it's like to live/work in china) but...c'mon it's not like they'll chain you to the desk and demand that you stay. once they realize you're leaving they'll deal with it.

[Homer]

I must agree with Liquidsunshine.

My only experience with running is having to pay for the idiot who ran. Had to cover for her because she couldn't face her responsibilities. My employer at the time was no saint. I ended up quitting later on...emphasis on quitting.
I just think running is just leaving the consequences of your choices for others to pay. They don't put guns to our heads or lock us in a dungeon. Of course, quitting is harder and might mean more work on the persons part...but its better than just leaving you coworkers twisting in the wind.

[Stunted Wookie]

I once covered for two runners at the same time (well one was fired and one left) ....

14 classes a day for 9 days.

[jajdude]

Ah,

But realize sometimes giving notice is not the way to go. One can get burned by doing so. And an intolerable situation does not deserve it anyway. Sometimes it's just the next train outta town that will give one satisfaction.

My humble regards you poor had to cover ups.

[Son Deureo!]

I've never run myself, but I was soooorely tempted by my last job, due to 11 hour workdays, getting screwed out of vacation time and overtime pay, a lying verbally abusive control-freak director, and an apartment that reeked of sewage. I stuck it out, but because I didn't want to leave a girlfriend that I love, and I was lucky enough to have an older Korean friend who was willing to chew out and threaten my boss on my behalf. I managed to work things out, and the changes that the owner made in order to keep me and my roommate from running have stuck, making the hogwon a better place to work for my successors.

Standing my ground worked out... for me. I learned some hard lessons about how to deal with an employer in Korea, and I have moved on to a better job here. I had also found a life worth protecting for myself in Korea, and this made staying worth the fight. But not everyone is so lucky.

The teacher I replaced had resigned from this job honorably, giving notice and waiting for her replacement. Her reward for doing the honorable thing? She lost her 600,000 won "security deposit", and the cost of her ticket to Korea and other miscellany were deducted from her last month's pay. Her doing the right thing cost her at least 1.5 million won, maybe close to two mil.

Given his track record, there was no way I would have given him one more opportunity to rip me off on the way out.

[rapier]

Threatening to leave will often bring about the desired results- set a deadline and stick to it until improvements are made. If not, be true to your word. i did that last year and hey, I'm on the verge of doing it again this year. Its almost becoming a necessity with every new job, to put them in their place.
Alternatively you can go on strike for a few days if things are really bad.
But a midnight run? never contemplated that,- always too much to lose by doing so..

[helly]

Old debate, good points on both sides, but I'm curious what is meant by saying the you can get burned by giving notice. What are you losing, really?

They'll make your life hell: Well, isn't that why you're leaving anyway?

Cheated out of severance/airfare/other compensation: You can get that when you run?

They'll threaten you/physically harm/detain you: yes, valid concern but how real is this? Limited case, I'd believe.

Could somebody please explain why giving notice is going to cause MORE difficulties?

[waterbaby]

[starfish]

I did a runner from an appalling school Why didn't I just quit?....here's the jist of it. I arrived to disgusting housing... no kitchen plumbing (I was told to wash my dishes in tne bathroom), no stove or cooking time ( I was eventually given an outdoor bulgogi burner)...the list goes on. I requested something be done about the lack of housing, and this was ignored. Time went on in the school and more problems arose...being expected to work full days on our days off with no overtime or pay, staying an hour or more a night let to do 'phone teaching' and not getting overtime, pay consistently being late etc. I mentioned to my recruiter that there were a few resolvable issues, and they attempted to remedy. As soon as the issues were mentioned I got the silent treatmnet from the Director for about a week, and no attempt to resolve anything. A couple of weeks later I came with down with Toncillitas. I worked for 3 days with this, with such a high fever I was shaking. The school could see how sick I was, and were very sympathetic until I asked for sick leave. I knew the school was going on an outing and there were no classes that would be disrupted by my absence, as all students would be on the trip. The school didn't see the logic in this and said if I didn't show up for the outing I would be fired. I pointed out that I was allowed 3 days sick leave in my contract, I intended to take it as I was in desperate need of a day in bed. Things got really nasty. I was basically intimidated into showing up for work. The Director very coldly informed me that because I was so sick I would not be taking part in activities, and would instead be looking after all the equipment...this was not sitting on the bus however, it was sitting outside by myself in the rain with the huge pile. This was so ludicrous that I refused and just followed the teachers. The Director was not quite sure how to handle the fact that I had refused his instructions, so when we arrived back at school I was hauled into his office and told even more rediculous things such as I was now not allowed to sit down for the duration of the day, except for lunch. They also tried to hold my overtime pay for the Intensive Winter Programem from me. By this time I had informed my recruiter of everything that was going on, and had informed my recruiter that I wanted out of the school. My recruiter said I had a good case for taking them to The Labor Court and obtaining a release letter, and that she would help me. But her instructions were to lay low until I had received my pay. So I followed her instructions and waited for my pay. Then out of the blue I received an email from her stating that she could no longer help me, and I was on my own. I was very confused about this sudden change of tune, but then realised that the day I received her email was my 3 month anniversary. The agreemnet between the school and the recruiter said that if I left after 3 months of my contract, the recruiter was no longer liable to pay back the commission fee, or replace the teacher. Over the next 3 months things just got worse. I was completely ignored by the Director. It got to a point where I was so miserable I had to leave. And yet I knew after my past -treatment that I could not endure another 28 days of the same treatment x 10 if I gave them notice. And there was NO way I would have seen my last months pay. And so I left.

So tell me everyone. What would you have done? Stuck out the year? I doubt it.

[chi-chi]

This is why I say that many times midnight runs ARE justified. And no, I've never done one.

[Skippy]

Well simply put why midnight runs happen - if a person tell their boss that they want to quit -owners and boss get nasty. They take your money, lie about you and get you deported. hold pay, etc, etc ,etc.

Sometimes when you play by the rules the other players just beat the snot out of you. So at times some teachers will have to do a Midnight run.
Some runners should have gone the legit "I am quiting rule" It just depends on the situtation and the school.

Wow some of the Midnight run stories are amazing. Many of them seem like a legit running.

My question is why do we teacher have to follow the contract and the law when the owners do not? Think on that? With me if you break the contract once I will be diplomatic and talk about it. But continue to break and not honor the contract why should I continue to be honest? All rules go out the door.

Skippy the Evil Scientisit

[Homer]

Well skippy,

Perhaps because when a teacher does a run instead of resigning and or going to the labor board they

a) shaft their co-workers

b) Probably don't do anything to force the bad boss to reform

This means a run makes your co-workers pay for your decisions. this is not just the covering of shifts but also the sometimes rising level of suspiciousness from the boss.
People here talk about the run when their boss misstreats them but how many teachers run just because they don't like their jobs or are in culture shock?
Running solves nothing and doesn't make the situation better for the people that come after the runner. If more teachers in bad situations reported their bosses to the labor board it would make a difference. Not right away of course but in time yes
Also many, many runs are done as a FIRST option and not as a last one. This implies lack of sense of responsibility.
Then there is the simple fact that two wrongs to make a right...i.e. because a boss is acting outside the rules it does not mean you should.
Runs can be an option when all other legal ways have been exhausted.
Unfortunately, this is not the case.

[Skippy]

Yes Homer you are right. Running should NOT be the first thing. I agree rational discussion and diplomacy first. Legal proceedings next. Yet people complain that do anything the right way it is either ineffective or the get shafted in the end.

It is a shame if a person runs that the coworkers suffer. Having to fill shifts and that.

As to raising suspicion. Well if a person runs it may already mean there is a high level of suspicion and mistrust. Simply put if there was trust a person would likely not run. Why do some of these bosses not take a clue and talk to the remaining teachers and try and remedy situations and fix the problems.

I may have been a little rash saying if I get treated unfairly. I will be just as unfair. It just peeves me off I meet many teachers who have problems with there school and they can easily remedied but schools continue to be unsympathetic. Of course it is hard at times to expect rational behaviour from some Koreans.

Ahhhh

Skippy the Evil Twin

[Homer]

Thats true skippy,

The bosses do have the big end of the sticks but thats true everywhere.
The level of suspicion I was talking about was in schools that treat their teachers fair and yet some still run at the first bump. This happened in my school the second year, two female teachers ran on two consecutive months. Uour school was nice, 5 days a week, no splits, single accomodations, always paid on time and no B.S.Yet these girls ran the coop...why?
Well I asked them through the magic of email...only got one response from the one that was from Canada (the other was an Aussie). Her reason: Korea was dirty and there were too many people there.
How did she get this job? She found it on the net and contacted the supervisor. She had never left mommie's skirts (i.e. she was 24 and living at home), never had a job, never travelled outside her province...
She came here..and she expected things to be like Canada and the culture shock hit her like a ton of bricks. I felt bad for her and we all (staff) tried to help her but she freaked out and ran..my boss had provided her with a return pre-paid air ticket which she was allowed to keep.
she waited till pay day, used the ticket and left.
We had to cover for her and my boss felt (rightly) shafted at being so generous. Then, the next month the Australian woman bolted right after pay day...ends up she was just looking for some cash to keep traveling..how nice.
These are just examples of the bad side of running. Its just meant to illustrate that some runners (many) just dump their responsiblities and leave others holding the bag.
Running can be a last ditch solution of course but, often its a first choice.