Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Karabeara]

My school is being pushed by the local governing body to sign me ASAP. I don't like this at all, because my contract says we are to decide no later than December 31. I know they are pushing me to sign now, because they also know that I am out looking around. Interestingly, they told my co-worker that they were still deciding about what they wanted to do with him. Maybe they are waiting to see what I will do. Who knows.

I am still waiting to hear back on some other things, and last time around, I had a better offer come down after I had signed this one.

If the school has not filed for the E-2 yet, can I change my mind after signing a contract and go with a better offer? Granted, I would worry about them getting pissy with my severence, etc. Technically, they can't file for the E-2 for a long time, because this contract doesn't even finish for over 2 months.

Kim Jong Il changes his mind often, and Koreans don't seem to mind much. Why can't I?

[bellum99]

Do you mean re-sign with them? Remember that it is easy to re-sign and you don't have to leave Korea. They just take the contract to immigration and change the date in your file. It's possible you may get in trouble if you sign the contract and they take it to immigration before you get visa with the new school. You may find that you "already" have an extended visa with the first school.
I have an idea.....BE HONEST with the first school and decide what you are going to do.

[Karabeara]

Not sure I care to think too much about honesty.

This is Korea, and I have found that my employers look out for themselves. They can (and have) cancelled a signed contract on me. As for them signing me up again at the school, they are not going to bother doing that until the last minute. Not that they would be able to 2 months before the contract ends, anyway.

They want me to sign with no increase in pay, and a possible benefit loss. Any sense of loyalty I had to them is gone.

[schwa]

You've made it abundantly clear in various threads that you seriously dislike your job. Why not just tell them no thanks?

You've got loads of time to find something else.

Wiggling out of a signed contract might be more complicated than you envision.

[chronicpride]

[Karabeara]

There you have it, folks!

The source of all problems in Korea are the teachers. Some dope-happy poster could not cut it as a recruiter, and we all know who he blames: the teachers.

Just what exactly do teachers owe recruiters, or former recruiters like you? You make money off of our backs. If the deal falls through, then tough luck. That is the job. Is that why you left? You could not handle the deals falling through? And that is the fault of the teacher? Because you could not handle the trade?

So, I suppose you would say:

Public and private school vacations have gone to two weeks of vacation because schools are getting the shaft from teachers.

Universities are cutting wages because the teachers are taking advantage of the schools.

Hagwons are firing teachers in the 11th month because the teacher is using the school.

Do not even try to go down a road saying that the reason Koreans treat teachers like cattle is because it is the fault of the teachers. Are you nuts?

The simple fact is that the school has every right to cancel a contract on me if they want to, before the visa is approved by immigration. The teacher has zero recourse. None. But if I do something like that, then I keep some poor salivating recruiter from being able to get drunk or chronically stoned that weekend.

Gee, I feel so bad.

Thank-you for answering my question.

[denverdeath]

Tell your school, "Sorry, but I have to think about things a little more. Our contract states that I have until the 31st of December to make my decision. I'll tell you then, okay?" If they ask again, just say, "Remember? The 31st? I'll tell you then."

Technically, you cannot get an extension until your passport and ARC are brought to immi, and that usu can't be done any earlier than about a month before your contract expires, so...withhold your passport and ARC and they can't get an extension done, right?

I, like some of the other posters, think that giving a simple "yes" or "no" would be better, too. However, tell them to wait until the 31st. I'm not saying that schools are perfect, but they do have to try to do some planning too, the same as you. I am very thankful to my supervisor at my middle school because she told me back in mid-October that they wouldn't be having an English teacher next year. Although I would've liked to have stayed there for another year, it allowed me to get out quickly and search for a new job.

[Grotto]

The contract does not become official until the date of the renewal...and until the new ARC paperwork is done.

If you feel that the school wont honour their end of the contract if you dont sign then do what you feel keeps your butt safe.

My only question is: what about your airfare home? If they thing you are staying they most likely wont get you the ticket.

[chronicpride]

OMG, is this one a mess. Ok, I'll try to see if I can lasso some of this wild stuff.

[TheUrbanMyth]

[Karabeara]

I have no interest in putting my school in a bad position once the E-2 has been processed. Until that point, however, you are not legally obligated to work for the school. I just found this somewhere on EFL-Law, as well.

Why anyone feels we should have some sort of loyalty to a recruiter and feel sorry for them is beyond me. As for the school, they can hire another person. In my school's case, they have been asking me to sign again several months in advance, in part to keep me from looking for a better deal. They have got what's coming to them if I decide to cut out a month before they can even process the paperwork legally. Why? Because they refuse to give me or my counterparts a raise. So why should I feel obligated to stay? Also, my contract specifically states that I have until the end of December to sign again. They are not honoring the contract. According to this marijuana(chronic)pride poster here, that makes me a bad teacher for not caving into it.

This appears to be a new tactic to keep teachers locked-in to contracts that are going nowhere. Make them sign early, and threaten that they will lose the job if they don't.

Hell, I say sign. If something better comes along, then dump it. In the end, they will get someone else to take the job. I know that in the case of new teachers, it burns the recruiter's ass, but that is just the nature of the business.

And foreign teachers are treated like cattle because Korean business people treat everyone like cattle. Those that they can, anyway! They even treat my Korean coworkers like cattle when they can.

[bellum99]

Good luck...but remember that you get what you deserve. If they find some way to screw you, then you deserve to be screwed because we tried to warn you not to do it this way.
But if you get what you want, then I am happy for you. You may get what you want..but you may also cause hard feeling and trouble for the teacher coming after you.
Personally I think it is crappy to sign the contract and lie to the school. If you get a better job just before they need you, then you will try to shaft them. This is not a way to be professional and it will cause hard feelings.

*** I hope they talk to immigration and get you blacklisted. I can see your smug face as you hand in your papers only to be told that you have a 5 year ban. Bu bu bu bu bye

[Ya-ta Boy]

[Karabeara]

You do not get blacklisted over a thing like this. Obviously, you are just blowing smoke about something you are not familiar with. If you do not file the E-2 paperwork, immigration does not care. Period. Another poster told me that he actually went to immigration to get the paperwork done on another E-2 instead of one that they already did paperwork for, but did not yet go to Japan to get the visa for. He just told them the first deal fell through, and they shrugged, cancelled it, and processed his new papers a short time later.

Immigration has no care who sponsors you, so long as it is done legally and they get the fee paid.

Teachers are blacklisted for teaching illegally. Not because they decide to change employers before they receive the E-2 stamp in their passport.

[Grotto]

Karabara is correct on this one.

You may have your qualms about it on some moral ground but the reality is there is nothing illegal about it.

Some posters here are the morality police, just as some are the spelling and grammer police

Lets see if I understand this correctly.

1. The school is preassuring the teacher to renew the contract months in advance.

Is this a moral business practice? I dont think so.

2. The school is not offering any incentives to renew the contract.

Is this fair to the teacher? I dont think so.

3. Should you be held to a bad deal when there is a better deal available?

I dont think you should have any qualms about doing whatever is best for you. If you can get a job that pays 100,000 won or more a year then go for it.

4. Can you be banned for changing contracts?

Hell no! Cant imagine where Bellum came up with that bit if bile! Tis the season to be bitter.

5. Should you feel loyalty towards a recruiter?

Hmmmm. Depends on the recruiter I would imagine. The recruiters I have dealt with I dont. Never heard from them once I arrived in Korea. Wasnt met at the airport or given any help...once they got their money they were persona no grata. Myself, I feel that recruiters are money grubbing individuals who only care about getting paid. But thats just from my experience of dealing with 3 different recruiters over 3 years.


Many schools do treat their staff like cattle.....if you tough out a year of it, why on earth would you want to put up with another year of it? If they are dropping veiled threats to 'coerce' you into signing then why oh why does anyone have a problem with paying back the school with lies and misdirection?