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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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 Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 3:34 pm Post subject: China and the Norks |
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There is interesting article about China's growing economic involvement in NK at http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Korea/GL17Dg01.html . It's written by Andrei Lankov. He was something in the old Soviet government, so his articles have an interesting angle. Worth a look.
My response to this article is that this is a good time for Bush, were he to actually have a vision for the future, to make a speech about favoring unification. |
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rok_the-boat
Joined: 24 Jan 2004
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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| I agree with that article and have been saying the same thing. Korean profs don't like to hear it though - that I think China will be the major factor in NK's future. Basically, I think SK has missed the boat in terms of unification - which sailed past in the mid 1990s. It is just that they don't realise it yet. If unification is to come, it will be an NK merge with China and the safest method is to do it economically. It is such a natural outcome I can't see why Koreans can't see it. Well, I can, it is that they don't want to see it. Also, it is not something that will be done actively, rather, it will be a passive rally as people in NK find out what is good for them and pursue it. The flood gates are opening and they point north - to China. SK will also be in on the deal but unification on SK terms is out of the window. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2005 5:05 am Post subject: |
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China has been reinventing the history of that region for quite some time now. The Chosunin and koryo-in have basically been absorbed and melded into northern Chinese history.
I don't think it'd be a stretch for them to do it so their Comunist brethren. |
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Bee Positive
Joined: 27 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2005 11:30 am Post subject: |
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Economics will favor North Korea over South Korea in the long run.
Seemingly an absurd thing to say, right?
Think again.
On the Western economic model of the past few centuries, money is BORROWED into existance when a central bank lends the money out.
Consequently, the sum total of all debts in any Western country always EXCEEDS the some total of all assets. It's very simple. Every time the Federal Reserve prints up a dollar bill (or the Bank of England a pound note), the counterparty OWES a dollar/pound PLUS.
Fractional reserve banking further exacerbates the problem. Let's say you have a credit card. Where does the "credit" come from? Have you ever wondered? Are you borrowing money deposited by others? Far from it: you are "borrowing" money which your bank/lender literally creates the moment it credits you--ie, debits you, in the sense of imposing a debt on you which is higher than the amount being lent, digitally, into existance.
China, like other socialist countries, will simply pump money into the system at little to no debt-cost as required.
Hints of a similarly loose approach to money-generation have surfaced in the US with the rise of "Helicopter Ben." Russia, Brazil, Venezuela, and other non-US dominated countries remain opaque in this regard. (To this poster, anyway.)
But the bottom line is that China, as the foremost socialist country in the world today, will SPEND its way into greatness, without fear of inflation, by creating debt-free money to the extent necessary, while the US and its subject-partners remain bound in the central bank straightjacket.
These are broad outlines. I will happily welcome more detail from anyone who has it.
BEE POSITIVE |
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Gord
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2005 11:49 am Post subject: |
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| Bee Positive wrote: |
| Consequently, the sum total of all debts in any Western country always EXCEEDS the some total of all assets. It's very simple. Every time the Federal Reserve prints up a dollar bill (or the Bank of England a pound note), the counterparty OWES a dollar/pound PLUS. |
?
| Quote: |
| Fractional reserve banking further exacerbates the problem. Let's say you have a credit card. Where does the "credit" come from? Have you ever wondered? Are you borrowing money deposited by others? Far from it: you are "borrowing" money which your bank/lender literally creates the moment it credits you--ie, debits you, in the sense of imposing a debt on you which is higher than the amount being lent, digitally, into existance. |
How is that any different than paying for any other service? Or hitting a business club? Or using a phone? All services being paid for rather than an asset.
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| China, like other socialist countries, will simply pump money into the system at little to no debt-cost as required. |
Only, they don't. Countries that do that as a suffer from either inflation from domestic pressure or hyperinflation as the currency devalues on international trading.
| Quote: |
| But the bottom line is that China, as the foremost socialist country in the world today, will SPEND its way into greatness, without fear of inflation, by creating debt-free money to the extent necessary, while the US and its subject-partners remain bound in the central bank straightjacket. |
That's what Germany said in the 1920s, and Yugoslavia said in the 1990s, for example. Result: Valueless currency and hyperinflation.
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| These are broad outlines. I will happily welcome more detail from anyone who has it. |
I am curious as to your economic background and why you have come to believe in such obvious fallacies. |
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Bee Positive
Joined: 27 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 10:57 am Post subject: |
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[/quote]
I am curious as to your economic background and why you have come to believe in such obvious fallacies.[/quote]
My dear lord--it's Gord!
You and I engaged in a fierce argument, which the moderators finally locked down, a couple of years ago here on Dave's.
Heh, heh, heh, so I'm a "sock puppet." Anyway, I had a different handle then. But how many Gords can there be?
You claimed that gold and silver were just "shiny rocks"--your words, I distinctly remember!--and BLASTED me for buying them.
Well . . . ha, ha . . . haaaaah!
I was right. Gold and silver, as tangible commodities with industrial applications, have far outperformed paper assets over the past couple of years. By huge margins!
My knowledge of economics comes from reading. I read everything that I can. It's that simple.
At present, I see more money to be made trading currencies than anywhere else, though it's such a fast moving market that you've REALLY got to be nimble-fingered to play it. Prices turn on a dime. Leveraged positions can win or lose fortunes in just minutes, or even seconds. The ultimate video game, in so many ways.
BEE POSITIVE |
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Gord
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 2:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Bee Positive wrote: |
My dear lord--it's Gord!
You and I engaged in a fierce argument, which the moderators finally locked down, a couple of years ago here on Dave's. |
Mom?
| Quote: |
You claimed that gold and silver were just "shiny rocks"--your words, I distinctly remember!--and BLASTED me for buying them.
Well . . . ha, ha . . . haaaaah!
I was right. Gold and silver, as tangible commodities with industrial applications, have far outperformed paper assets over the past couple of years. By huge margins! |
That's strictly because the value of the US $ declined. As a Canadian, if I had bought gold in 2003 and sold it yesterday, I would have possibly matched inflation if the person arranging the trade worked for free.
In fact, if the US dollar tanked and was par with the peso, your gold reserves would be worth billions! Granted, a cup of water would cost a million and a half dollars, but still, a net worth of billions.
Ironically, the U.S. would be suffering severe inflation if OPEC oil sales were not done in US dollars. Had it been tied to the Euro which has been advocated by some OPEC members, oil would be costing more than a $100 US per barrel which in turn would have slowed the U.S. economy even more and even further devalued the dollar.
But while we are on the bragging box, I made a 30% above investment return since April on the Korean stock market. And with the strength the Won has gained against the US $, my return is at around 50% above investment.
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| My knowledge of economics comes from reading. I read everything that I can. It's that simple. |
You just argued that payments for services wrecks economies while ignoring that every economy in the developed world is overwhelmingly service based. You might want to start reading a little harder.
| Quote: |
| At present, I see more money to be made trading currencies than anywhere else, though it's such a fast moving market that you've REALLY got to be nimble-fingered to play it. Prices turn on a dime. Leveraged positions can win or lose fortunes in just minutes, or even seconds. The ultimate video game, in so many ways. |
So where is this train going? Through out some valueless "words of wisdom" and that makes everything else you said ok? Let's hit the penny-stocks and make a few bazillions too. |
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