Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Summer Wine]

Looking at this, I found it interesting. I thought maybe others would as well so putting up the link for your reading.

http://www.treatyofwaitangi.govt.nz/index.php

[itaewonguy]

very serious topic. as a KIWI breaks my heart.. but thats the reality of war! or better yet the british empire in that era!

[crazylemongirl]

Most kiwis don't want to touch this topic with a ten foot barge poll. Suffice to say the brits stuffed up. We now have this vague docuent we don't know what the thell to do with, after spending most of our time ignoring it we somehow have to play 'nice'.

[Col.Brandon]

For the time the British were reasonably enlightened. Many colonial powers simply killed off any indigenous peoples that objected to being colonised. In this case the Brits signed a treaty. The problem with it now is that in the intervening period the spirit of the treaty was not honoured and many injustices were done. So we're left with this situation that still needs to be resolved. Many NZers don't want to admit to these past injustices. They say, "We're all NZers now, let's forget about the past", or quite often any mention of the treaty will be met with some kind of knee-jerk redneck crack like, "The Maoris are just lazy. Why should we give them anything?"

But at least there's a dialogue, and people are working to resolve it in a reasonably civil manner. (There's been no civil war since the 19th century). Compare that to some other colonial powers even today, and it puts the problems with the Treaty into perspective.

[Summer Wine]

I went to Uni in Aussie, so learn't about Aussies treatment towards their indegionous people, just never realised how much I didn't know about my own history. I think its good for us to discuss it and maybe make it a fairer country. Ignoring the treaty is ignoring our own history and not dealing with the issue fairly kinda of makes this generation just as guilty as all the past ones who didn't deal with it.

It is a good history resource if nothing else is learned from it.

[cruisemonkey]

As a male (I won't mention may ancestery) Canadian who was not brought up with an understading of the true history of my country, I now realise I should have been born 'native': no taxes, f*uk whitie's laws, a guaranteed income and free university.

How could I have benn so stupid?
The sins of the fathers SHALL be visited apon their sons.

Get a f*cking job!

[Satori]

The Treaty is a vital document for Maori now. It gives them leverage to get some proper compensation for stolen land. The prosess has been reasonably sucessful so far, but incredibly slow.

[cruisemonkey]

Any government must honor ALL treaties... but when a 'group' of people who were at war with each other before 'contact' claim 110% of the present-day land, something's got to give.

[cruisemonkey]

[Satori]

[sojukettle]

My background is Ngai Tahu and the claims for compensation under the treaty have been going on for many decades.

Things have moved along and whilst I do not agree with all the results and reparations I think the Ngai Tahu are coping well with the results.

Corporate entities are now in place to control the wealth and distribute to all whanau members. They range from whale watching tours, fisheries, tourism ventures, farming and so on. Like any business, not all have been successful and some have been badly run. But the experience is growing and success is far outstripping the failures and bad investments.

There is educational assistance available and other schemes for the betterment of the tribal members paid for by the tribe itself.

Overall a good way forward and the answer to a lot of problems. Rather than just giving money, give the way to produce and then put in place the systems to continue producing and the benefits flow indefinitely with no further govt input.

[crazylemongirl]

[laogaiguk]

I don't really know the situation too well, but I do know what happened when the North American governments just gave a bunch of money (or compensation) to our native people. It was a complete waste. We should have set up a support structure, give training, etc etc... Just giving money is useless.

[laogaiguk]

[Otus]

I remember being pulverized with the treaty issues as a freshman doing a legal systems paper back in 1988. The only sensible arguments I heard were from a couple of Oxford legal scholars who were doing a kind of tour around universities in New Zealand at the time, but I can't remember much of what was said - just that it was well said for a change.

Assuming the validity of all injustices to indigenous people in New Zealand - is it possible to look at any other colonized country in North America or elsewhere by Brits / Europeans and claim a more fair treatment was given? Check it out - but I think Andrew Jackson actually ignored a supreme court ruling at the time and had native Indians marched onto reservations. One of the few times the American exec. actually ignored the supreme court. I think the supreme court later had revenge.

You can argue that New Zealand may be ground breaking in providing such an extent of legal remedies as an article from the Christian Science Monitor (whatever it's called) recently did. You can also argue that lack of precedents in other legal systems hardly excuses past wrong doings in this case. But is there really any need to feel the massive guilt complexes some of the more radical advocates try to inflict on us?

I still hope my legal systems lecturer never discovers I wrote this.

(for links, just do a sensible google search)