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Son Deureo!
Joined: 30 Apr 2003
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 Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 1:46 am Post subject: Subject verb agreement grammar question |
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Which is correct?
A) There is a desk, a sofa, and a computer in the living room.
or
B) There are a desk, a sofa, and a computer in the living room.
A sounds right to me, but I'm not quite sure why and a student is asking me about this. Can anyone help me out here? |
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Don Gately
Joined: 20 Mar 2006
Location: In a basement taking a severe beating
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| Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 2:38 am Post subject: |
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| A) because each noun is individually singular? |
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Son Deureo!
Joined: 30 Apr 2003
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| Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 3:10 am Post subject: |
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Then how about...
A desk, a sofa, and a computer are in the living room.
In this example, multiple singular subjects means the subject has to be considered plural. I guess what I'm wondering is, why is there a difference? |
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krats1976
Joined: 14 May 2003
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| Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 5:32 am Post subject: |
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When you have a list like that following a verb, the verb should agree with the first noun on the list. In this case, the first noun is singular so your verb is singular.
If you change the order and have the list before the verb it becomes a compound subject so it'll have a plural verb.
Why? Because English is crazy. That's all. |
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keithinkorea
Joined: 17 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 6:40 am Post subject: |
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| Good explanations and you guys are correct on both counts. |
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cubanlord
Joined: 08 Jul 2005
Location: In Japan!
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| Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 3:31 pm Post subject: |
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| krats1976 wrote: |
When you have a list like that following a verb, the verb should agree with the first noun on the list. In this case, the first noun is singular so your verb is singular.
If you change the order and have the list before the verb it becomes a compound subject so it'll have a plural verb.
Why? Because English is crazy. That's all. |
This website should be a wealth of information for you guys:
http://owl.english.purdue.edu/handouts/esl/eslsubverb.html |
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ilovebdt
Joined: 03 Jun 2005
Location: Nr Seoul
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| Posted: Tue Apr 04, 2006 8:44 pm Post subject: |
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| cubanlord wrote: |
| krats1976 wrote: |
When you have a list like that following a verb, the verb should agree with the first noun on the list. In this case, the first noun is singular so your verb is singular.
If you change the order and have the list before the verb it becomes a compound subject so it'll have a plural verb.
Why? Because English is crazy. That's all. |
This website should be a wealth of information for you guys:
http://owl.english.purdue.edu/handouts/esl/eslsubverb.html |
Cool site Senor! |
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cubanlord
Joined: 08 Jul 2005
Location: In Japan!
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Hanson
Joined: 20 Oct 2004
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| Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 6:04 am Post subject: |
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Mods, can we make this a sticky?
I owe you a debt of gratitude, cubanlord! Excellent links! Thx! |
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EFLtrainer
Joined: 04 May 2005
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| Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 6:59 am Post subject: |
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| I wish I worked with people like this.... |
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ontheway
Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...
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| Posted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:32 am Post subject: |
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| This thread has the answer (above) for the "is/are" thread. |
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huffdaddy
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Wed Apr 12, 2006 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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| ontheway wrote: |
| This thread has the answer (above) for the "is/are" thread. |
Is there a cite to support "there is" versus "there are"? Besides someone's opinion. I haven't found an example of this problem on any of the sites listed, but I may be missing it. |
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Boodleheimer
Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Location: working undercover for the Man
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| Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 6:13 am Post subject: stumbling block |
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be careful with sports teams. i'm american so "man u was the winner" is correct, but my english boyfriend says "man u were the winners"
i still totally think american english is right in this case, though. |
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Qinella
Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Location: the crib
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| Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 9:08 am Post subject: Re: stumbling block |
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| KWhitehead wrote: |
be careful with sports teams. i'm american so "man u was the winner" is correct, but my english boyfriend says "man u were the winners"
i still totally think american english is right in this case, though. |
I don't think you're right about American grammar's treatment of sports team.
Think of this example:
The Utah Jazz was in New York this weekend.
Would you say that?
The Marlins is the best team around.
How about that one? |
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krats1976
Joined: 14 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 4:18 pm Post subject: Re: stumbling block |
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| Qinella wrote: |
| KWhitehead wrote: |
be careful with sports teams. i'm american so "man u was the winner" is correct, but my english boyfriend says "man u were the winners"
i still totally think american english is right in this case, though. |
I don't think you're right about American grammar's treatment of sports team.
Think of this example:
The Utah Jazz was in New York this weekend.
Would you say that?
The Marlins is the best team around.
How about that one? |
If you use the full team name, then yes, it's in the plural (perhaps because most US team names include the mascot name with is a plural noun--e.g. The Supersonics, the 49ers, the Cougars, etc). Whereas, if you just use the city/state/university name, it's singular.
Examples:
The Lakers were favored to beat the Bulls last weekend.
vs.
LA was favored to beat Chicago last weekend.
When we talk about European teams, on the other hand, we (Americans that is), use verbs in the singular tense, perhaps because the team names don't usually include a mascot. I mean, what's a 'United' or 'Real'? Thus:
Manchester United was favored to beat Chelsea last weekend. |
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